Continuing the discussion from Challenger 2 MBT - Technical data and Discussion (Part 1) - #10198 by DevilO6.
Previous discussions:
And here we are
This thread is a WIP, please let me know if I’ve missed anything or made any mistakes.
I wanted to create a central place to discuss the Challenger 2 and to consolidate the bug reports and create a master list of threads/bug reports for it
History
In 1986, then Vickers Defense Systems began a private venture to update and extensively redesign the pre-existing Challenger 1. By 1988 they had a working prototype and over the next several years it was refined and imrpoved. In 1991 140x Challenger 2s were ordered followed by a further 268 in 1994. The tank entered operational service in 1998 and subsequently replaced the earlier Challenger 1.
It has seen active service in Bosnia and Herzegovina, Kosovo and Iraq.
The only Challenger 2 ever lost during operations was due to a frriendly fire incidient in Basra on 25 March 2003. It was mistakenly hit and destroyed by another Challenger 2.
Technical Specs
Crew
4 Crew: Driver, Loader, Gunner and Commander
Dimensions:
Length: 8.32m
Height: 2.49m
Width: 3.56m
Weight: 64’000kg
Speed:
37mph (59kph) on road
25mph (40kph) off-road
Drive Systems
Engine
Perkins CV12-6A V12 disesel 26.1L
1,200 BHP
18.7 hp/t at 64 t
16 hp/t at 75 t
Gear Box
TN54E epicyclical transmission
6 Forward Gears
2 Reverse Gears
Suspension
Horstman Defence Systems second-generation hydrogas suspension units (HSU)
Weapon Systems
Turret
Rotation speed 360° in 9 seonds (40°/s)
Main Armament
L30A1 - 120mm (55 Calibre) Rifled barrel
Ammunition
49 Maximum Shells
L23A1 APFSDS
L26 APFSDS
L27A1 APFSDS (Charm 3)
L28A1 APFSDS
L31 HESH
L34 White Phosphorus Smoke
Secondary Armament
L94A1 Coaxial 7.62mm chain gun
L37A1 7.62mm Loader hatch Machine gun
Optional
Leonardo “Enforcer” remote control weapon system, can be fitted with:
L37A2 7.62mm Machine gun
12.7mm Heavy Machine Gun
40mm Automatic grenade launcher
Armour
Chobham Armour (Dorchester)
Optional NERA plates
Linked Threads
Spoiler
Challenger 2 TES and Challenger 2 (2F) (Dorchester 2F) IED equipment and barracuda
Fixing Challenger 2 ammunition rack locations
Specs for Challenger 1, 2 & 3
Old Forum Threads
Legwolf’s detailed breakdown of issues:
Please check it out!
Please let me know if there is any missed items / bug reports for this post
Missing Features
Bug List
Challenger 2 Bugs:
Mobility related
Challenger 2 (All): Turning issue when at low speed(Fixed)Challenger 2 (All): Low speed Turning gearing issues(Fixed)Challenger 2 (All): Gears causing jerking and loss of speed(Fixed)- Challenger 2 (All): Pivot Turning issues
- Challenger 2 (All) Mobility issues
Armour/survivability
Base Armour
- Challenger 2 (All): Incorrect Mantlet armour/Protection (Dev Post)
Challenger 2 (All) - Missing Spall liners- Challenger 2 (All): Turret Side armour too weak (Dev Post)
- Challenger 2 (All): Missing composite armour in turret roof
- Challenger 2 (All): Turret points cause shells to ignore rest of armour
- Challenger 2 (All) - Turret bustle should be RHA instead of CHA
- Challenger 2 (All) Turret composite too small
- Challenger 2 (All): UFP Spall liner should be split
Extneral Armour
- Challenger 2 (All): Incorrect additional side armour composition (Partial fix)
- Challenger 2 (2F & 2E): UFP add-ons missing thickness and effectiveness
- Challenger 2 (2F): Side external armour doesnt work
- Challenger 2 (TES): Incorrect armour values (Closed)
- Challenger 2 (2F, TES & OES): Incorrect external armour
- Challenger 2 (2F, TES & OES) Expected add-on armour values
- Challenger 2: side blocks should be 200mm thick
- Challenger 2 (BN) UFP Model Incorrect
- Challenger 2 (2F & TES): Side armour protection levels
- Challenger 2 (All): Missing spall liner on the LFP
- Challenger 2 (TES & OES): SPRO-HMT CE resistance
- Challenger 2 (TES & OES): ASPRO-HMT should have higher KE
- Challenger 2 (TES & OES): Backing Plate
- Challenger 2 (TES & OES): Applique Armor shouldn’t detonate to KE
- Challenger 2 (TES & OES): Baseplate configuration is backwards
- Challenger 2 (TES & OES): Applique Armour name and type
- Challenger 2: ASPRO-HMT incorrect protection
Internal Armour
- Challenger 2 (All): Turret basket ammunition bin unprotected
- Challenger 2 (TES): Internal armour ignored by shells
- Challenger 2 (All): Turnnion pins missing
- Challenger 2 (All): Missing armour around gun mantlet
Challenger 2 (All): Ammunition Armoured Stowage Bins Too Thin(Fixed)- Challenger 2 (All): Missing internal bulkheads
- Challenger 2 - Mantlet protection too low (post rework)
Other components
- Challenger 2 (All): Incorrect ammo storage placement (Dev Post)
(Additional Information) - Bag charges detonating too easily (needs further research and bug report)
- Challenger 2 (All): Inert APFSDS storage in Challenger tank is counted as explosive.
- Incorrect Gunner and Commander position
- Challenger 2 (All) Ammo Position issues
- Challenger 2 (All & Other Tanks): Incorrect behaviour of Ammunition (Game limitation)
- Challenger 2 (OES): Incorrect ammo bin thickness
APS
- Challenger 2 Black Night: Iron Fist targetting Sabot discards (Believed to be fixed)
- Challenger 2 (BN): Iron FIst missing soft kill function
- Challenger 2 (BN): Iron fist Hard-Kill APS Issue
- Challenger 2 (BN): Iron Fist Launcher randomly spinning
- Challenger 2 (All): Mantlet Thickness Issues (Closed)
- Challenger 2 (All): Drivers Area Thickness Too Thin (Closed)
Weapon Systems
Optics/Thermals
Challenger 2 (BN): Gunners Optics are blocked when elevating the Gun(Fixed)- Challenger 2 (All): Commander should have thermals when aiming
Main gun
Incorrect turret rotation speed(sourced found confirm 12 second rotation time not 9 under normal conditions)- Challenger 2 (All): L27A1 pen incorrect, should be closer to 700mm (Game
limitations) (Dev Post) - Challenger 2 (All): L27A1 CHARM 3 penetration too low
- Challenger 2 (All): Incorrect ready rack
- Incorrect reload speed
Challenger 2 (All): Incorrect side depression for main gun(Fixed)- Challenger 2 (All): Ammo Stowage and first stage incorrect
Other armament
- Leonardo “Enforcer” for all Chally 2 (with potential weapon choice)
- 12.7mm HMG (AKA 50.Cal) for all Chally 2
- Missing 40mm Grenade Launcher?
Challenger 2 (2F & TES): Incorrect ammo count for Enforcer 7.62mm. Should be 200 rounds with optional 400 round mag, currently 100(Fixed)
Miscellaneous
- Challenger 2(All): Missing meteo-sesnor mast
- Challenger 2 (All): Model issue, Missing wash plate
Challenger 2 (All): ESS coming out of the wrong exhausts(fixed)- Challenger 2 (All): Wrong X-Ray of the Challenger 2E engine Compartment
- Challenger 2 (Black Night) Incorrect Gun Trunnion Position (Fixed In future version)
Challenger 2 (2, 2F, TES & BN) Incorrect engine sounds(Fixed)- Challenger 2 (OES): Incorrect Armour skirt plate texture
- Challenger 2 (TES & OES): Rear Grille Armour damaged model issue
- Challenger 2 (TES): Baracuda thermal stealth blanket for TES
- Challenger 2 (TES): ERA not getting visually destroyed (Fixed in a future version)
- Challenger 2 (2F, TES & OES): low quality Camo netting
Challenger 2 Suggestions;
Challenger 3 Bugs (shall live here for now):
Challenger 3(P): Incorrect name(Fixed)Challenger 3(TD): armor missing and not aligh with the model(Fixed)Challenger 3(TD): missing armor around the ammunition storage(Fixed in a future version)Challenger 3(TD): Incorrect Weight(Fixed)Challenger 3(TD): Missing Spall Liner(Fixed, but to hull only, more data needed for turret)- Challenger 3(TD): Missing composite armour in turret roof
- Challenger 3(TD: Turret Side armour too weak
Challenger 3(TD): Model issue: Missing anti-slipping surfaces(Fixed)Challenger 3(TD): Incorrect Engine sound(Fixed)Challenger 3(TD): turret floor invisible and missplaced(Fixed)Challenger 3(TD): incorrect KE protection on turret cheeks(Fixed in future Version)- Challenger 3(TD): Turret Bustle should be RHA instead of CHA
- Challenger 3(TD) Turret composite too small
- Challenger 3(TD): Missing armour around gun mantlet
Challenger 3(TD): Turret Bustle ammunition not exploding/venting(Fixed in a future version)- Challenger 3(TD): Wrong road wheels
- Challenger 3 (TD) should not have laser warning system
15 Likes
2nd!!!
2 pages and its still not fixed?
2 Likes
Thats not including the original forum too
2 Likes
But that one went a little, well…
oh yeah my bad
Oh yes…
yea i was mostly addressing the multiple CR3 point.
nowhere does that say anything about the HP being increased, aside from the two things I’ve already mentioned I’ve seen nothing confirming an HP uplift (obviously excluding the mph/kph gaffe on the May 2021 CR3 press release).
I would genuinely love it if we had publicly available confirmation that HAAIP increases hp to 1500 cause then we could get the 2022 CR2 with improved HP and thermals to use in a lineup alongside CR2E
2 Likes
How we got a part two of CR2 thread Imll never know (perhaps link this into Part 1?)
anyway yes, as I was saying, I don’t consider the statement from Baroness of whatsit and whocares relevant and/or useful because chances are, she has little to no idea what Defence is, other than Daddy was a Officer in the Household Cavalry and went to play horsies with all his mates around London. (Funny how you can be a Cabinet Minister, or Secretary of State for x and know nothing about x.)
I’d pay far more attention to the QRH post, on the contrary.
Well, and what would you guys did, if a threw a random HP number, like for example 2000?
With or without NOS?
As I’ve said before, my assumption that HAAIP gives 1500hp comes from the QRH post (infamous now?) where it confirms it outputs “1500hp via HAAIP”
Whether that’s true or not is up for debate, seeing as the MoD don’t actually know (not the first time me thinks)
? Elaborate a little
It’s tough that these are the primary soruces, but they should be held to the same level of scrutiny as other sources.
As you said most Cabinet minister couldnt tell the difference between a Cheiftain and Challenger tank.
1 Like
It’s a joke Nitrous Oxide injection
sadly the individual who ran the account at the time doesn’t do so any more, and it seems like there was either no replacement or the replacement doesnt keep on top if it as it seems the last tweet was in 2023, so we cant go and double check.
I think the added context of the first tweet saying that an HP increase would be welcome, separately from the other changes listed, show that the upgrade to 1500hp wasn’t set in stone
1 Like
Oh. Well, as i threw a random number, without.
1 Like
It’s ok we can just all play the Fox at top tier cap a point kill a light tank and spawn the Harrier…Peak British gameplay
You madlads did it