Just had to call me out when talking about phantoms, lol.
But yes, I agree with all the points made. Speaking of my fav phantoms:
F4C has no flares but faces planes armed with high-g missiles (hard to outmanuever them, once locked on it’s almost a death sentence) or straight up all aspect ones (you are just dead if you don’t realize you are going for a head-on with a plane armed with those). F4C really deserves a spot at 10.0, planes like mig-21 f-13 or mig-19 are perfectly capable of fighting it despite being lower BR, not to mention stuff like CAS version of mirage.
F4J is also rather weak and should be at 11.0, it won’t outmanuver stuff like Mirage F1 or the MLD, has SARH all aspect option but the doppler radar has no iff (it should have directional one but it isn’t represented in game) and has no all aspect IR missiles. Despite having the helmet sight, it can’t utilise it properly since AIM9G is too weak. All the other planes have stronger/comparable radar with working IFF, giving them same/better BVR and given how much of a brick F4J is - everything else has better WVR.
I’m pretty sure the japanese 11.3 phantom is the same - it should be dropped down to 11.0 while the Kai variant should be at 11.3. There are planes with solid modern radar at that BR already (viggen for example). It would fit decently into the BR working like a heavier viggen - more missiles, worse dogfighting capability.
In fact japanese F-4EJ Kai Phantom is even 11.7 which makes it now unplayable, facing MiG 29s and F16s, as there is no separate roster for 11.7 planes.
I dont get why there are such massive difference in BR for the phantoms. Some are 10.7 (FGR2/FG1 for example) others are 11.7. Do they really have that big a difference in performance?
Honestly the whole mode needs an overhaul not just the aircraft, although I agree with you.
Maps need to be much larger, maybe some more navel maps and have us bomb convoys and respawn after awhile. Mini Events of some sort within an on going SIM match?
Spit balling here but you see my point.
It’s the same with the Tornado IDS ASSTA1. It’s a fucking 11.7 on SB. Why??? It’s the only Tornado over 11.3, with everything besides a little bit of extra speed the same as the other Tornados. As if you can out speed a Mach 3 BVR missile. YOu dont even have a radar ffs.
I’m a VR simmer who plays both DCS and WT. I recently got some 11.0-3 premium jets because of the much higher FPS and less stutter compared to DCS. I consider myself a decent pilot but:
Fighting F16s with:
J7-D which is in Snail planet is a copy-paste of MiG-21 Bis == OK, can maneuver with it but just barely.
F4-S, a missile truck. If I don’t see the F16 first, it’s guaranteed death sentence
Mirage F1C-200, something is very wrong with the flight model. It can somehow supercruise with full load but cannot maneuver at all. No ACM button to extend the combat slats+flaps also. Has a truck load of countermeasures but the F16 can basically gun you down.
Guess I’ll return to DCS for the time being. At least skills still matter there.
You really expect to beat an F-16 with those planes if the F-16 doesn’t make big mistakes ?
The game would be wrong if you can win a BR12 fightter with BR11 fighters, or an BR11.3 interceptor/bomber.
You need an Mig-29 for that.
I have killed many F-16 with the Mig23 or tge Mirage F1, but because they were unaware, or the pilot lacked skill, or numerical superiority, but if you find a decent pilot in 1vs1, he will kill you
I think thats the point he is trying to make, Why are those jets matched against an F-16? Tornado F3 for example has to exclusively fight against Mig-29s and F-16s and its not fun. I literally dont play that jet at all, because even with its recent upgrades, its still no match. I have to get lucky with my first missile, or just J out. There is no third option
The point I’m trying to make is skill doesn’t matter in EC9 when the supermaneuverable jets with a vastly simplified radar mechanic meets previous-gen interceptors.
Give me my full-fidelity RWR in cockpit and full radar controls with repeat frequency, elevation, scan zone and ECCM (and enforce these manual controls in EC on every aircraft) and I can kill F16s all day in the Flogger. The problem is the current F16 pilots doesn’t need to worry about any of these, they just do the massive tailstrike takeoff, turn on their radar, point, shoot, pull their planes into 40* AoA during dgfts and get thier kills.
Nah, it’s just a lot of oversight because sim BRs aren’t observed as much due to the bracket system & the lack of players giving information to the data collection servers.
I think EC9 has bigger issues, mainly a lack of jets that are meant for that bracket. pretty much only F-14s, F-16s, Migs-29s and Yak-141s.
Just need more time for more jets to be added to help balance that bracket out. With also nothing higher than 12 at the moment, there is a larger overlap than there should. When we get 12.3 + 12.7 jets added. then EC9 can be only 11.7+, maybe even 12+ and 11s/11.3s that should never face 12s, wont have too.
That being said, I do agree. we need an RWR overhaul and I think they need to make radars more advanced to allow for things like ECM to be added.
But if its an EC9 day, then what? Just not play the game? I think when we get more BR brackets, then they need to remove the 11-12 and 11.3-12 days. They do suck for a lot of people. But this is a natural and avoidable problem at the moment. What doesnt make sense is the random nature of BR allocations though. Some jets are at 10.7/11 are laughing when identical 11.3s are struggling vs 12s.
Play top tier knowing your plane is worst … you’ll improve as pilot ;)
F3 is a joke, it should be the same than the ADV. An both are interceptors, not fighters …
Also, 11.7 planes don’t have a day where they are top BR, but that will change one day, like it happened recently with 10.7, 11.0 and 11.3 planes.
But, in any case, it doesn’t make sense to make WT like DCS, even in SB what people want here if fast action. If I want full fidelity systems, I go to DCS.
Also, it’s not the case of the person complaining, he bought the F-4S, he wanted to buy a premium jet and kill top tier jets easily, without grinding the tree.