In my place, people call it a trade. Isn’t that better than not having a kill at all? I’m pretty sure that, out of any of the existing tech trees in the game, curiously any plane capable of bringing the R-27ER is at least capable to do so. While for example, you get any plane using a Skyflash/Matra 530D/AIM-7whatever variant and it’ll lose having that particular advantage a significant amount of times against an ARH missile, cause all of those SARH are slow enough so they can be notched, while the R-27ER has that individual advantage.
I don’t personally play to trade. Thus I just don’t carry the R27ER. It’s more of a pain to cycle through 4 different missiles than it’s worth. It doesn’t offer enough of an advantage to take over the R77. And no one’s arguing that the ER is the same as other SARHs, rather that using it in a “joust” is pointless unless you plan to trade. Trading is unlikely too, unless you’re very close to your opponent, because he can simply go cold and notch your awful N001.
If you still think that the R-27ER doesn’t have a chance even with a slight positional advantage against ARH slingers, then i will clearly say that i’m proving better.
Feel free to check stats if you like. You’re the one considering a trade to be a worthwhile use of your time.
The Fox3 shooter gets significant leeway to shoot second since he doesn’t need to maintain closure rate. The best that the fox1 shooter can do is crank a bit. The Fox3 shooter can fully go cold, focus on multipathing between the 40m tall mega trees, or dive behind a mountain or into a canyon. This are things that happen in real combat situations all the time in game.
Feels like I’m taking crazy pills arguing against these kinds of statements.
I don’t get the end goal? Do they just want the USSR to continue being weak for the sake of dominance or do they legitimately feel like that makes for a balanced game? There’s zero debate anymore that the USSR air tree is significantly weaker than the US tree in ARB.
It’s not weak. That’s not my argument. My argument is purely that in a FOX3 game, it’s only strong when used asymmetrically. In a joust against anything with a FOX3, the R27ER carrier is at a big disadvantage.
Well you can focus on asymmetric jousts. I’ve gotten 70km BVR kills against AMRAAM carriers with the ER. You don’t have to use the ER on missile jousts, that’s why you have the R-77.
I still get my share of kills with GUNS too. That doesn’t mean guns are meta. Just a few BR steps down with the Su-24 I routinely sucker punch people with freaking laser guided Kh-25’s. It’s very much possible to get those kills like that. Far cry from meta though.
Well you can focus on asymmetric jousts. I’ve gotten 70km BVR kills against AMRAAM carriers with the ER. You don’t have to use the ER on missile jousts, that’s why you have the R-77.
But the situations where you can actually do this is few and far between. That’s assuming whatever you fired on
A. Ignores the launch warning and does not defend
B. Does not close the distance and counter your launch
C. No one else fires on you requiring you to go defensive
I’ll be honest, I’m not getting your point. You’re proposing a few-and-far between situation that while, yes, it can happen, does not in any way make an R27ER carrier inherently stronger.
It’s pretty similar. You can get kills with inferior kit. It’s still inferior. They’re still not the weapons of choice for someone serious about competing. You can get kills with 27ERs but they’re dinosaur weapons of yesteryear in the fox3 domain of top tier.
You can still get plenty of kills with AIM-9L’s on planes that would rather carry their AIM-9M’s. The 27ER is to the Fox3s what the 9L is to the 9M. Objectively inferior but still lethal.
No one is enforcing you to play for trade. I’m just commenting that, even on the worst scenario, you’ll trade with an ARH slinger, which is a significant achivement for a non-ARH slinger.
There could be a reasonable debate about it, but i can concede that point. To me, it’s more a thing of how you plan to use both missiles that make them worth using one or the other.
I’m not discovering something if i remind that lategame exists, and stomp games are still a thing, therefore a hypothetical trade is better than not killing anyone in a 4v1 situation.
Most of the time, i check stats only to see if people have played the vehicle or thing they’re talking about, and doesn’t complain out of sheer antagonism. As you have been playing the stuff you’re talking about, i’m okay with it, despite our disagreements on the topic. I only consider trading on a lose-lose situation, like i mentioned before.
Well, I wouldn’t say the R-27ER is as bad as an Aim-9L in the Fox 3 meta, in fact it can do decently well. If anything I’d just carry a few alongside the R-77’s. It’s one of the weapons that can be useful but ultimately doesn’t make Russian top tier jets competitive. Anyone can go into how good the R-27ER is stat-wise, but it’s still a SARH, you will always be at a disadvantage having to guide it in when your enemy can fire, notch, re-engage you, fire, notch, etc.