Russia or US threads always evolve to this long repetitous circle of anger,hate,denial and idiocy.
and usually its the same people.
Its just beyond me how someone can put this amount of negative energy sometimes into weeks and months long threads and play the game they have nothing good to say about lmao. its even worse than WT subreddit over here.
Want to buy every single top tier non-Russian player all of the air tech tree so people can do that? Lol
Except the Osa-AK/M at 10.3 and the Tunguska 0.4 BR above it.
sell an event tank/jet/ship coupon on the marketplace.
Since it is you…
So AGM-65D
The seeker has realistic lock range 16-18km. That effectively means fly 2-4km IN Patsirs territory even before launching the ammunition. And Pantsir S1 is aware a hole time about the AC which is about to launch any ammunition towards it.
KH-38MT
Can lock and be launched from the same range that means 4-6km OUTSIDE VT-1 range.
Plus some tiny details that KH-38 is way faster, can land hundreds meters away and still kill the SPAAG, does not self destruct when loosing a lock and has pin point accurate IOG.
And please support your story about flying perpendicular and killing pantsirs in drovers by replay prefferaby in SIM. Thanks
i have shot down mavericks all the time with my roland and osa. a-10’s aren’t a legitimate threat because theyre unmaneuverable slow trashes regardless of their missiles.
Until fairly recently it was more like 12km as well.
Also when considering aircraft like the Harrier Gr7 or Tornado Gr1, they were limited to pretty weak Gen 1 Tpods (which should be Gen 2) and the PGMs only just got IOG which is a notable buff.
16km is larger than 13km, so it’s 3km outside Pantsir’s range.
Paper stats =/= actual performance.
I’ve been within 14km of Pantsir dozens of times.
I’ve already fragged many Pantsirs and will do so less often these days since I don’t bring CAS as often due to nothing to learn anymore.
KH-38 has that same seeker range BTW.
Though it’s faster, more maneuverable and has a better ballistic trajectory (it doesn’t try to glide parallel to ground as Mavericks).
You can justify the current USSR advantage on A2G and SPAA capabilites on infinite argumentative loopholes. In the end, your ‘defense’ on nato stuff always ends up being a straightup faked reality on how things tend to work for most of people in this thread.
Both go top-down when launched properly, which means they’re effectively the same.
9000 meter high launch altitude means that if you launch at <18km, you’re dropping right on their head [and I launch AGMs from 11,000 meters up, only GBUs get the 9000 meter treatment.].
Go play 5 matches at top tier with any country other than Russia. It is completely unplayable currently. You have 2 minutes to get into something to play CAP with Aim120s for 700 sp meanwhile there is 2-3 pantsir every match (100 SP vehicle cause thats fair) trying to shoot you down as well while the su34’s are completely uncontested slinging kh38’s from outside the range of every AA that’s not the pantsir.
Exacerbating the problem is that the premium US teammates never spawn SPAA. Often times I triple or quadruple spawn AA with backups but it doesn’t matter because even Adats can do nothing. You have to get super lucky with some idiot flying slow inside of 8km because the missiles have no maneuverability at long range.
CAS overall is OP but this update has made top tier completely unfucking playable. I have over 1kd on all vehicles and winrates are now down into the low 30% or on the M1A2 27%. Its fucking pathetic and horrible balancing from Gaijin.
GOD forbid I want to play some actual tanks and not get nuked by some CAS retard every other minute.
Also stop setting up false equivalencies saying “bUt US hAS oP CAS” the game is completely unbalanced with ONE country having by far the best CAS and the same country having by far the best anti air.
Congratulations.
As I said replay or did not happened.
Just doubled checked, that is not entirely true.
AGM-65s dont have IOG. So if the missile is targeting something specific and the target smokes, the misslile will loose lock and self destruct.
KH-38s have IOG. So if the target smokes, they have to move out of the way, if they were previously moving, they have to stop and change directions, otherwise the missile will hit the target still
Granted this is now a capability that has just been given to the PGM
Combine with the significantly higher speed and longer burn time of the motor, KH-38s are also more reliable at longer ranges, especially against moving targets or on more cluttered maps. There is less time for the target to react and get into cover.
Pantsir can at the very least engage at ranges up to 16-18km away and can reliably intercept and shoot down multiple incoming AGM-65s (I once had a match where I fired 9x PGM-2000s at a Pantsir and none got even close) and possibly even fire a max range pot shot at something like a harrier Gr7, Tornado, F-16 etc (The air spawn point is well within range of a Pantsir so you have to actively defend on spawn, especially as you wont always know if you are being shot). Something like an ADATS will never get a shot oppotunity against an Su-25SM3 let alone a Su-34 which is ultimately the core of the issue.
I always get the feeling that Alvis thinks it’s fair to invest 800 SP (and losing the ability to capture points) to negate air superiority whenever you’re not a certain nation with a currently unparalleled SPAA.
Pantsir has a range of 18km <8000 meters altitude against drones.
It has not been tested against any other targets at higher altitudes.
Pantsir has a range of ~13km against jet CAS whose altitude is above 8000 meters.
@PyroAddict
The fact you think SPAA is good is proof you’re a CAS main that wants to stay unkillable.
Keep defending CAS and Soviets.
This is always my biggest complaint with the current situation at top tier. Its pointless for me to spawn an ADATS except for dealing with helis and the best solution is for me to spawn in a CAP (did this the other day with the FA2 and wiped out half the other team without much effort, few people know what chaff is in GRB) but the Pantsir can at very least be considered a threat to any aircraft in game and it cost 10x less than even a “weak” CAP aircraft like the FA2
Vs the 8-10km range of the ADATS and you can quickly see why people are frustrated with the situation.
If absolutely nothing else. If I spawn in a Tornado vs a soviet team. I am actively defending the moment I spawn in. Dropping CMs, and turning hard in an attempt to create lateral movement and usually diving to gain speed (spawn speeds really need to be increased)
Vs any other team though, (or if it is against a soviet team but I can see our team has a decent amount of air superiority already), I just fly in a straight line. Only reacting if I see a threat or my RWR starts screaming at me. Allowing me time to take stock of situatioin and maybe even unload my payload of wepaons right there and then. But usually, vs something like an ADATS, I just drop a weapon on them and carry on with my day as if what I was bombing was just an IFV that had no SAMs.
That’s my point.
ALL SPAA is useless against CAS, and all ten tech trees need new SPAA.
Of course @PyroAddict argues that SPAA is currently fine.
That range Alvis is literally the furthest SPAA in the game right now.
It’s the best even compared against their immediate competitors.
Your classic ragebait in the end doesn’t affect me, you’re clearly not in the will of discussing critically about the topic.
@PyroAddict
Ah yes, everyone that wants SPAA capable of fragging CAS are all ragebaiting you.
Sorry to burst your bubble, but Morvran and I are not ragebaiting anyone.
Stop protecting CAS from criticism with blatant character attacks.
Not saying they don’t
But Pantsir vs F-16C is a much fairer fight than Su-34 vs ADATS. Considering its been 2 years since the Pantsir was added. Them dragging their feet so much has people deeply frustrated and with CAS getting continuous notable buffs, especially the soviets that had one major weakness at top tier, which was the lack of fixed wing CAS now have the best fixed wing CAS in the game. has people rightly frustrated. (especially in the same update where they denied mmV Brimstones due to reasons that could be readily applied to most other AGMs especially KH-38s)
We are also only talking about 1x F-16C vs 1x Pantsir. Yes, F-16C stands a good chance of winning that fight.
But 1x F-16C that costs 900+ SP to spawn in with AGMs vs 2 or 3 Pantsirs that cost 70 SP each?
No AGM-65 will make it to the target and the F-16C will have to defend hard or spend most of the match idling