It would do a ton… if made realistic APHE only creates more spall in the exact same cone shape that spall created from the initial penetration was already going. It isn’t a spherical grenade like it works in WT. Meaning all those goofy cupola snipe spots that every spaa abuses to get kills will turn into pretty pointless shots that might kill a commander and thats it. It would work the same way shooting a Tiger 1 cupola with solid shot would work
SPAA’s with high RoF cannons would not care about such changes whatsoever. Most fragmentation would still go to the sides, direct front and rear. The corner areas would have less, but not 0, in any case, sufficient to nuke the entire crew as currently, especially when you just send 7rds of APHEI-T/gun/sec anyway.
Its literally just gonna make anything low RoF that relies on current APHE implementation to be viable less consistent.
But I will refrain from repeating myself too much:
Also lets not act like 35mm APHEI-T wouldnt just completely obliterate anything inside a enclosed space when fuzing irl;
(Pictures below are from an older shell, PSBH/H, with worse design and fragmentation behaviour than PLD-044 shown above)
50mm RHA;
3 Likes
To add on to RAGE’s point, I think the APHE nerf is also the wrong approach to take.
Let me first clarify that I did still want it tested before being rejected.
However, my central thesis is this. I have never met a single person who’s played with APHE, then played with solid shot only, and said “Wow, AP is so much more fun. I wish all rounds did this much damage”.
APHE may be unrealistic, but having high damage rounds is just fun. It’s fun to be able to click on tanks and watch them explode, not have to queue up a follow up shot because my solid shot round missed the ammo by fractions of an inch, and therefore only disabled the enemy (Let alone doing no damage whatsoever).
And I’d argue it’s fun in both directions too. Leaving aside the getting nuked in half a second by full auto APHE (Which I’m trying to address), it’s far more fun to take one hit and be sent to the respawn scene, than to be forced to wait, completely disabled and helpless, as your opponent readies another shot (Or multiple, if he’s unskilled/unlucky).
It also helps balance via allowing weakspot targetting to keep certain tanks in check. Take for example the T95. Many have used this as an example of a tank that’s victimised by APHE. I disagree. It’s a tank that’s actually allowed to be useful entirely because APHE cupola shots exist to keep it in balance.
If players with APHE couldn’t engage it frontally at all, then it would get a massive buff, and be forced to move up in BR… to a BR where almost everything fired at it can lolpen it. It would suffer from IS-3 syndrome, a tank that’s terrible where it is, but can’t be any lower without risking the complete annihilation of the APHE centric tanks below it.
The change that should have happened is a buff to solid shot/low caliber APCR/APDS/HEATFS to make their damage more similar to APHE. Some additional, angular spall created around the breach to help ensure near hits still do decent damage, and to help prevent the awful feeling of a center mass round doing no useful damage. And add some fragment ricochets for full caliber AP so that engaging tanks that have to be penetrated in weakpoints is a less obnoxious endeavour.
ok
I suggest you take a look at footage from the aphe-rework tests (dance of dragons dev server) before claiming it’d make cupola shots do as much with APHE as regular AP, since thats simply not the case.
The XM246 in particular has terrible survivability. Its turret is filled with components that will instantly disable firing or turning the turret when hit, and it has ammo belts going all along the sides of the turret. Unlike the Gepard, it can’t rely on speed as armor either.
It’s by far the second least problematic of the Gepards, second only to the Chieftan marksman.
Sure. But those modules eat the entire shell and all the spall so a hit to the turret disables it or does nothing. Unlike other 35mm spaa which often die when hit in the turret.
It shows.
It is in fact not. It has poor traverse angles as well as poor traverse speed in terms of SPAA. It is beat in pretty much every metric when it comes to killing planes by the 5.7 TPK. Except that thing is a truck and it dies tp a gust of wind so it’s not the most effective SPAA when going up in BR.
Just because you’re biased against America doesn’t mean everything American is OP.
The Gepards and Marksmans will commonly just ignore sabots. They do die easy enough most of the time, however the XM246 is near impossible to hit without destroying something.
You don’t have to:
It is clear as day what is better.
4 Likes
That’s a german main thing, I have better games in a locust than plenty of Leo players
My personal most to least pain in the ass 35mm ranking
ItPSV Leopard 2 Marksman
XM246
ZA-35
Gepard/1A2
PGZ-88 ( no gun dep puts it below geps)
Chieftan Marksman
3 Likes
tbh i agree
No it applies to all mbts and any gepard style spaa
Just remove aphe and leave 40 apds. Sidam with full he + some apds isnt roaming as freely and as often as gepards, marksmans and other oerlikon garbage.
i wish my xm246 was really that hard to kill
1 Like
XM246 is not above Gepard, and especially not Za-35
Yes it is lol
XM246 is way more survivable than Gepard while retaining a center mounted guns. Lemme tell you which can eat a 122mm APHE shell and which can’t. The XM246 can while the Gepard can’t
If you are struggling to kill an XM246 with a 122mm, then that is skill issue and nothing more. You do not even have the XM246.
I have played enough to know which is most survivable based off shooting them alone. XM246 is the only one to take agregous amount of punishment.