Some Frustrations and Suggestions from a Japan Main

[Zyranovos]

@LaD1x

BR compression around 9.7–11.7
Why is the jump so extreme? Going from 9.7 straight to 11.7 feels very punishing. It often feels like BR 10 just doesn’t exist for Japan, and the matchmaking gap is frustrating.

It’s okay, but should be decompressed.

@LaD1x

Chi-Nu II BR feels too high
The Chi-Nu II seems overtiered for what it offers. This is a pretty common opinion, so there’s not much more to add here.

Gun that can pen anything and armor that can’t stand anything, it was classified by weight as a Medium tank, but fills a fire support role for a light tank.

@LaD1x

Lack of light tanks between BR 4.0–5.3
Japan really needs another light tank in the 4.0–5.3 range. Right now the lineup jumps from 3.7 straight to 5.7, and the 5.7 vehicle isn’t even a true light tank. That gap makes lineup building awkward.

The SUB-I-II has scouting and APDS at 5.3, it’s pretty good…

@LaD1x

Top-tier lineup issues without CAS or helicopters
As a newer player who doesn’t play CAS or helicopters, it’s very hard to build a proper Type 90 (11.7) lineup. I end up with two 11.7 MBTs and one 11.7 SPAA, but then I have to fill the rest with 9.7 and even 9.3 vehicles. That kind of BR spread feels very rough and not very beginner-friendly.

They definitely do, the AH-64DJP for one, and then you also have A-7E and F-5’s, which are some of the best CAS planes at this BR right now.

Then you also have top tier CAS when you get there, the F-2A’s mostly.

Considering your low battle time, you seem to be new, actually try and grind to get the things you’re going to complain about.

[Pangolin_Fan]

@Stockholm_Blend

Either way, the government is a representative of civilians

A representative is not the whole itself.

@Stockholm_Blend

You told us that copy-paste is bad, and those need to be removed because they have no uses
Then, ‘In your theory, by your definition’, Stingray(US) might need to be removed if we really need to push your Idea.

You’re just restating what I said, that you’re the first to mention removing the Stingray.

@Stockholm_Blend

But both are essential to create new things.

And one is far more important than the other. You can’t buy something that hasn’t been invented yet.

@Stockholm_Blend

Stringray existing at all

They bought a Stingray that already existed.

@Stockholm_Blend

Others and I explained why M24 and M19A1/M42 are needed for the lineup to fill the gap.

If you wanna play with 3.7-4.0 U.S. tanks, then just play America.

@Stockholm_Blend

Then back off, M24 and M19A1/M42(JGSDF) actually helps japanese lineup.

lmao no.

[MAUSWAFFE]

@Pangolin_Fan

They bought a Stingray that already existed.

They configured their version of the Stingray based on features that were offered by Cadillac Gage, but it was still distinct from the two existing prototype.

Specifically the second prototype was intended to represent the basic “production Stingray” configuration but still (for example) lacked the removable gun mount on the UFP or the horn that the Thai model has, and features different mounting points on the hull and turret akin to those on the first prototype. Another difference is the track tension mechanism, which extends through the LFP on the Thai model, but covered by the LFP on the prototypes.
Though sadly not much else is known about its specifications and Textron doesn’t answer my emails asking for more detail.

Cadillac Gage Stingray Prototype 2 ("Production Stingray")

Thai Service Stingray

[ParryACO-psn]

@Wiggly_Armed_Man

That isn’t really possible. What option is there other than the O-I?

HT number 6.

Which is a Tiger 1.

[Stockholm_Blend]

@Pangolin_Fan

A representative is not the whole itself.

You are mixing the concept of the company(Gage Cadillac, AKA Textron) and the Nation to rationalise your gatekeeping attempts to the Japanese tree.

Sir, isn’t English your first language?
You are pushing your take which claims that Gage Cadillac itself is ‘America’, to saying Stingray is an American tank. And Thai people are the ones who need to lose it if we can only have one Stingray in this game.
Because you believe that a nation that NEVER OPERATED AND NEGLECTED has BETTER LEGITIMACY THAN HER ONLY OPERATOR NATION.

If You genieuly believes that Stingray is an American tank even though you didn’t buy any, used at zero war, and had no interest at all, just because manufactured by an American company via a private venture
In that term in that inverted universe, CV90 and Strv 122 are British tanks because BAE Systems bought Hagglunds and they are part of BAE in the name of ‘BAE Systems Hagglunds’ ffs.

I wonder why I should keep explaining this simple concept again and again.

@Pangolin_Fan

You’re just restating what I said, that you’re the first to mention removing the Stingray.

You are the one who brought up the concept of removing copy&paste vehicles. I was the one who EXPLAINED why the USA need to lose Stingray if we ‘push’ YOUR IDEA.

@Pangolin_Fan

And one is far more important than the other. You can’t buy something that hasn’t been invented yet.

Gage Cadillac invented it for EXPORT. You get it?
Just like F-16/79.

@Pangolin_Fan

They bought a Stingray that already existed.

If Thai hadn’t bought Stingray, she would have ended up with canceled just like how F-20, F-16/79 did.

@Pangolin_Fan

If you wanna play with 3.7-4.0 U.S. tanks, then just play America.

I wonder why the heck you are this short-sighted.

Those vehicles could be used for more roles than ‘just form a JGSDF C&P 4.0 deck’

M24(JGSDF) fills the key role of scout tank before SUB-I-II or M41A1(JGSDF) show up, also can be used to make 3.3 lineup at Arcade battle along with chi-nu and na-to.

M19A1/M42(JGSDF) fills the SPAA gap between So-ki(3.0) and SUB-I-II(5.3)

Can’t see the forest for the trees.

@Pangolin_Fan

lmao no.

Why? Because you cannot accept that asians get American vehicles while Italians can?

M24(Italy) fills the gap in the Italian tree
M24(JGSDF) fills the gap in the Japanese tree
Both are M24 Chaffee.

[Pangolin_Fan]

@Stockholm_Blend

You are mixing the concept of the company(Gage Cadillac, AKA Textron) and the Nation

The >civllian< company, v.s the government.

@Stockholm_Blend

rationalise your gatekeeping attempts to the Japanese tree.

It has nothing to do with gatekeeping. You’re just making strawman cause you don’t have any actual, valid arguments and you know it.

[Stockholm_Blend]

@Pangolin_Fan

You’re just making strawman cause you don’t have any actual, valid arguments and you know it.

Because you skipped valid arguments of mine, or just projecting yours onto me?

You read the whole reply, and even made a reply within 120seconds?
And ignored any other parts?

Hey @RDXRooster63, @MAUSWAFFE, I am terribly sorry about pinging, but did I made none of valid arguments?

[Pangolin_Fan]

@Stockholm_Blend

You read the whole reply, and even made a reply within 120seconds?
And ignored any other parts?

No1 should waste their time reading the whole reply after the first few sentences.

[RDXRooster63]

Na don’t care for the ping

your arguments are way more valid ngl

to remain neutral, you are asking ppl u know are likely to agree with u because they sided with u in the past

[MAUSWAFFE]

@Stockholm_Blend

Hey @RDXRooster63, @MAUSWAFFE, I am terribly sorry about pinging, but did I made none of valid arguments?

I’m probably a bit biased just because I agree with most of it, but I’d say so yes

[Stockholm_Blend]

@Pangolin_Fan

No1 should waste their time reading the whole reply after the first few sentences.

So, you are admitting that you came into this thread not for discussion or debate?

How can we debate without reading the opponent’s take at all?
This is one of the grand rules of debate…

@Surbaissemaxxing, sorry about calling you,
If you are online, but…

@RDXRooster63

to remain neutral, you are asking ppl u know are likely to agree with u because they sided with u in the past

Yeah, I admit about that part, but not many other user nicknames came out from my head atm.
I mean, I cannot call the House of Commons or Anton for this, right…?

[Pangolin_Fan]

@Stockholm_Blend

So, you are admitting that you came into this thread not for discussion or debate?

If you start your comment with a strawman, it would take a fool to continue reading.

[ParryACO-psn]

What’s really frustrating is you can take 27 rounds in the Yamato class’s magazines and you will still instantly die.

27.

But Tosa can take 550 and survive MULTIPLE ammunition explosions

[Kievskiy_Minipig]

@Stockholm_Blend

Stingray was built by the US but never bought by Congress in the final selection.
You think that is an American vehicle because an American company built it, even though US Army didn’t operate it.
But the operator company shouldn’t get it because copy-paste is bad?

Built by US, operated by Thailand. Could you find Japan in this sentence? Same about oplot. Soviet tank, modernized by Ukraine (postsoviet country), operated by Thailand/Pakistan. Where is Japan/China here? Both vehicles deserve to be in creator nation tree under operator flag. Not in tree of nation which didnt make those vehicles nor operate them.

[Stockholm_Blend]

@Kievskiy_Minipig

Built by US, operated by Thailand. Could you find Japan in this sentence?

@Kievskiy_Minipig

Both vehicles deserve to be in creator nation tree under operator flag. Not in tree of nation which didnt make those vehicles nor operate them.

Sir, do you know what a sub-tree is?
Currently, Thailand tech tree is part of the Japanese tree because Gaijin tied those with some historical ties.

Just like how we got SA/India, France got Benelux, or Italy got Hungary.

So, if we follow the operator flag, the Japanese tech tree is the place for the Thai Stingray
Unless Gaijin dismissing Thai subtree idea and releases the independent ASEAN tech-tree.

If the Thailand branch weren’t tied with Japan, then you are right. Then thai stingray would’ve sat on US TT.
For example, we can see some Israel vehicles in the US/FR/UK before opening israel tech tree, and Germans have a South African armoured car which was added before introducing SA to us.

@Kievskiy_Minipig

Same about oplot. Soviet tank, modernized by Ukraine (postsoviet country), operated by Thailand/Pakistan.

And about oplot… if that bald old man named [REDACTED due to political reasons] didn’t blunder…
We would also see oplot in the Soviet tree either.
Just… blame him. He permanently terminated the option to add Oplot to soviet tech tree. :/

[MAUSWAFFE]

@Kievskiy_Minipig

Built by US, operated by Thailand. Could you find Japan in this sentence?

Can you find Japan in this image?

This is just where the Thai nation is placed, so it’s where Thai vehicles go.

[MAUSWAFFE]

@Stockholm_Blend

Then thai stingray would’ve sat on US TT.

The US do have the Thai Stingray for whatever reason, even if it has the wrong flag right now. This is even weirder to me considering how they did the same for the NASAMS but still gave that the Norwegian flag.

Stingray in the US tree

Thai Stingray Variant

[Kievskiy_Minipig]

@Stockholm_Blend

Sir, do you know what a sub-tree is?

Poor excuse to insert copypaste and extend grind process of certain tech tree. I wouldnt really mind if those were optional (at least if you have original vehicles/modules unlocked) but its necessary every damn time. So you have to break through 999 soviet/us vehicles just to get smth unique like aft09.

And their “historical ties” are just joke. Half of world could become US sub tree because of those ties. And even if they have some really deep lore. I boot up game not for those ties. And I expect trees to have unique vehicles so there is motivation to grind new trees and not adandon them because of overwhelming shermans, t34, pattons, t54 etc.

@Stockholm_Blend

And about oplot…

Oplot case just showed hypocrisy of devs once more especially compared to how they handled stingrays. US gets stingrays without operating them but USSR (which includes post soviet countries) cannot get oplot because Ukraine (post soviet country like Russia which we have in WT) didnt operate them (BVVD words on dev stream).

@MAUSWAFFE

Can you find Japan in this image?

Yes I can click on “Research” and find crapton of Japan vehicles. Also Ki 27 Otsu on image is japanese aircraft not thai :)

[MAUSWAFFE]

@Kievskiy_Minipig

I wouldnt really mind if those were optional (at least if you have original vehicles/modules unlocked) but its necessary every damn time. So you have to break through 999 soviet/us vehicles just to get smth unique like aft09.

I have a suggestion for you then

Subtree Rework - Nation Folders

poll Subtree Rework - Nation Folders [Nation Folders - New800] Subtrees are a good way to help existing nations in their efficiency and vehicle variety, while introducing new and exciting nations to the game. They have been a part of War Thunder since the release of update “Ixwa Strike” in March 2021. Yet, they also come with with a lot of criticism. From gameplay debates criticizing the addition of other nations vehicles “getting in the way” of researching the main nations vehicles, to mor…

This way what nations you want to play is entirely up to you. You can decide to skip nations you are not interested in, and instead just focus on the part you actually want to play.

@Kievskiy_Minipig

Also Ki 27 Otsu on image is japanese aircraft not thai :)

I can see where you got that Idea, but I came prepared!

If you don’t accept user camos, then I switch it with the Ki-43-III. I only prefer the Ki-27 because it’s a model Thailand operated while their Ki-43s were Ki-43-II instead

Ki-43-III camo

Photo of Thai Ki-43-II

[侍KAMIKAZE侍]

@LaD1x

At the moment, the Heavy Tank No.6 costs around 75 EUR

Not just that absurd price but at the same time its basically worst of the 6.0 tigers. Not even worth if it was TT.

Japan is basically worst tank nation low - mid tier - please fix (brs, lineups etc.)

I think we can all agree that Japan is basically the worst tank nation to grind or start with. Talking not just from my experience but wherever you look people rank Japan as the worst tank nation to start with. Nobody is gonna recommend new players to start with Japan because it’s just pure pain even worse than Italy and France. And best of all. You cant actually even start with ground japan. Game literally does not let you. Idk if it always been the case as I started playing before there were a…

Had that conversation years ago. Nothing got better only worse when it comes to ww2 stuff. No lineups fixed with native vehicles. No extremly overtiered stuff put down. Now just with more bs uptiers like Chi-ri 5.7 etc. Will gaijin ever make ww2 Japan any competative? Or will it just stay “asian” difficulty switch button for ppl that wants harder gameplay?

- YouTube