Player count in top tier sim

I mean I’ve provided 2 screenshots of 2 separate nights. It’s clearly a problem big enough for people to start a thread about (not enough players in top tier).

My point is that GJ should allow us to create rooms with bots so we can start a game when it’s like this, and that will create more active rooms for people to hopefully join. Others think that would thin out the 2 to 3 active rooms too much.

It will. It’s a horrible idea. Anyone with even the slightest critical thought can figure that one out. I think we should be grateful we’re not subject to RNG up tiers/down tiers like the RB matchmaker and be happy with the system we have, we can actually pick our maps and join/leave at any time and every BR get it’s days to shine during the week. People don’t tend to appreciate it but this is a wonderful system and is a big reason why people love sim so much. A system with already this much player control is bound to get abused by farmers/botters so it makes sense that we have these few restrictions that are in place, namely requirement of ONLY 2 people on each team to start a battle (seriously, this isn’t much to ask), the preset nations which ensure some sense of balance and won’t exclude nations and that a game will end when enemy team has left.

Air sim is not your personal sandbox. You should not feel entitled to create your own custom games at will and expect it to show up for everyone in the serverlist, you have custom battles for that. Instead help fill up an ongoing battle and join that instead, don’t make the situation worse by splitting up the player base even more because you’re feeling like playing on Vietnam that day.

And if there are no lobbies available and there aren’t even 3 people out of the 100-200k concurrent players to join you at the respective BR, then sorry but that BR is dead. It should not be an excuse to allow you to make it a personal PVE lobby with bots which would wreck/worsen the functioning battle ratings.

This thread was made before air superiority update, right around when Mig29’s got their massive nerf along with F16’s massive buff as well as the time where several nations were entirely missing a top tier aircraft in the first place… It was so unfair to the point where no-one wanted to play on the Russian team, since then We’ve got a ton of new top tier aircraft - especially to the minor nations so it’s not nearly as much of a problem anymore. What is still a problem however is the balance, western RWR/radars are vastly superior and give much better situational awareness, along with invisible missiles and the fact that Russias entire upper-hand, being radar missiles are rendered useless by simply flying low.

But it’s still a problem though…

So let’s find a solution that won’t wreck the entire game-mode. There are plenty of reasons why the sim community is only a fraction of a fraction of the 150-200k concurrent playerbase, plenty of improvements to ask for

huhu.

in the meantime I am also convinced that the 2 vs 2 principle should remain to create user created battles. reason: 100 empty servers would be really pointless.

but I am in favor of increasing the number of official rooms! that the sim community is very small or too small is of course a counter-argument. but I have often experienced in the last 4 or 5 years that people have gone back to RB just because of the waiting time - because RB is always immediately available.

but the fact that rooms could be abused is honestly not my problem,- I want to fly and not sacrifice anything because there could be abuse.

so if I were a snail I would first fix the battles, the economy, the balancing and much more … and then (because more players are expected after the improvements) immediately increase the number of official rooms.

one more short note: we all know shooters and simulations with large server lists. sometimes even where it is possible to rent your own server. I would immediately rent a sim server if it were possible. so that people can always play there and I can join them in the evening! just like we know it from good shooters or sims. and I am absolutely against the RB random battle method.


A quick word about the nations. ‘mooeep!’

yes… but for the WW2 Prop Planes as WW2 ALWAYS Axis Nations against Alliies Nations!
This worked well for many years and would also be possible since Germany, Japan and Italy have very popular WW2 airplanes . This simply has to be standard WW2 Sim again! not a crazy mix.

I’m not sure about the high Jets Brs. although I would like to have a few NATO nations against Russia and China for my self-created space. without NATO defectors.

BF2 back in the really good old days, you could build and host your own ranked server as long as you met specific criteria. Then you had to rent their hosted servers but it was the same principle.

Then the concept eventually that got migrated to Console and then it was changed a bit so you really didn’t have much control over your server any more (we know why this changed).

As far as WT goes, however, I’m guessing there isn’t a resource issue that there was when we were playing BF2 (there’s several physical servers available for the work).

You could limit the total number of rooms to keep it from spreading out the entire population but I think several smaller games is would be better than very few large games.

There’s a lot of ways you could use the AI:

  • They could just turn it on so that when you start a game alone it starts and it’s you and your AI teammate against 2 AI

  • You could change the threshold to start a game to 1 v 1 but then add a bot to each team so it’s 2 v 2 when you start - that way disconnects don’t break the game.

  • They could bring up a new hosted server with them when the current one at any given BR is full

It may be better than it was a month ago but it’s still pretty bleak for games at top tier during the hours I play.

??? It definitely will be when farmers/botters take over which they definitely will

Absolutely, fix all these things. That together with a better learning curve/default controls for sim… But why do you think we “need” more official rooms when we have a larger player base? When there’s plenty of people on we have no issues creating lobbies

I am personally against this, with a lower player base it would essentially only be up to whoever can fork up the most cash for a server / the person with the most popular sever that would get to decide what map gets played etc. Gaijin is already providing servers for us for free and it works well as long as you can find 3 other people to play with. a 24/7 server would be cool, similar to the DCS Cold War server but I think we’re gonna need bigger maps and better objectives for that, an ongoing server is also going to die very quickly because as soon as everyone has left it, nobody will want to be the first one to join an empty server

Really depends what you consider “small” or “large” games, but I disagree. There is nothing worse than logging on and seeing 4 separate Denmark or sinai games at top tier, all being 2v4, 3v5, 4v3, 1v7… All of these lobbies are terrible and it would be much better if they just combined into one, but unfortunately entitled people like yourself wasn’t feeling the weather or some player in the other Denmark lobby so they decided to create another one… It’s sometimes to the point where it should require a 3v3 to start the lobby.

Air SB is not PVE, and it’s certainly not your personal PVE sandbox. You have custom battles for that. If you want a PVE game mode like heli PVE then seriously ask the devs for that instead of vouching for this change which will clearly open the floodgates for botters and farmers to destroy the game mode and further worsen the problem I mentioned earlier:

You can’t have ultimate freedom here, there has to be some restrictions in place to help balance out the freedom we already have.

Right now I’m finding:
6 games on red team, 5 games for blue team, a total of 75 players playing in top tier (11.7-12.7)…
8 games on red team, 8 on blue team, a total of 112 players playing at (10.7-11.3)…

well, in any online game, hackers with illegal hacks (wallhack/aimbot) can also get in at any time.
but nobody would think of imposing any restrictions on sim rooms because of hackers. … do you understand my argument? …installing easyAntiCheat is not a restriction for us. :D
ok and of course it can also happen that the abusers/farmers join. it will happen. then gaijin should fight the abusers the same way gaijin fights hackers! if I build a nice 12.0 gulf war scenario as a self created battle and my old squadron friends come, apollo comes, feetpics comes … what do we care about abuse? we are innocent. we only want to fly together. I don’t want any restrictions. Gaijin should take care of abuse profiles. do you understand what I mean? it’s easier to explain in german.

yes. I think so. because a barbecue party with too few plates and too few chairs and too little meat will not be a success. :D
so I don’t think there should be 200 empty servers standing around. but a somewhat larger offer with official rooms would make sense in my opinion. but I can’t commit to a number right now.

I wouldn’t insist that war thunder should do that. I just remember that rented servers could be a great thing in old shooters.

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I agree. it’s simply more flexibility.

I’m not playing right now, I’ll be playing later where I will not find any games active, or maybe one or two.

Just because there’s an named AI doesn’t make it PvE, I just want to start a game. I am entitled to start a game.

When will you be on? Why is one or two not enough? Sure there are times during the day with fewer players, naval Is supposedly struggling a lot here too even with a matchmaker. We have to be considerate of this. There’s never a time when there’s fewer than 4 players in top tier though, we do have an issue with balance regarding western RWR/Radar though but that is no reason to implement this horrendous change which will damage the entire game mode the other 23 hours when there actually are games available just so you can fight AI on your own the 1 hour when you can’t find a game.

Just because you’re slapping a ‘name’ on an AI, doesn’t make it human. It’s still an AI and hence, still PVE.

No, you’re not. Gaijin certainly doesn’t think so given they require you to have 2 people in each team… Which again, is not much to ask… It’s a small price we pay for having the massive freedom we already have, be happy we’re not subject to a matchmaker like RB.

shot 2024.03.28 20.18.48
no, it’s not enough. because junk like this is simply unacceptable.
I paid a lot of money for premium content back then. the snail should also offer me good scenarios in return!
camel-attack

This has nothing to do with “hackers”. It has to do with you enabling farmers/botters, essentially pouring fuel on the fire. Especially if we want changes like improved SL/RP earnings it’s going to get completely out of control, the internet will fill up with SL/RP farm tutorials and sim will look like it does during mission-score events. A disaster.

You make no sense… If there are more players, the players will have no issue creating more lobbies, or creating more ‘plates’ for the barbecue party as you call it.

2 perfectly fine lobbies with 28 players. Ultimately the players themselves will decide what they want to play. Just because you’re completely alone in playing your ridiculous nation-sets doesn’t mean you get to shove it down everyone else’s throats. It’s not Gaijins fault that no-one is interested in your “scenarios” Players care way more about balance, earnings and actually fighting people than taking part in your role-play.

It’s a free game, it’s your decision to speed up your grinding progress for real money, Gaijin is not promising any unique scenarios with your GE.

This is a free multiplayer game with perfectly reasonable requirements for the luxury of creating a lobby of your own, It’s not your personal sandbox. Even you agreed on this;

Matter of fact you can have exactly what you’re asking for in custom battles, only 1v1 to start the game, custom nation-sets etc. If you haven’t noticed there’s a reason SL/RP earnings are turned off in custom battles, it’s the exact same reason I’m talking about here - opening the floodgates for farmers/botters. Custom battles is a clear example of this

hacks and abuse are both illegal things.
So we can make a bit of a comparison.

what you write basically confirms the great weakness of the game principle with Silverlions and techtrees. so according to my reading…

do you really want to fight 14 F-16s all the time???

I’ve always said I don’t want to take the Mix away from people who want it. besides, there are enough WW2 Sim people who finally don’t want Mix anymore but more good old Allies vs. Axis. which always worked well for 8 years. Alliies vs. Axis. between 1.0 and 7.0 is not a ridiculous set. those are the best WW2 sets.

yes yes I understand. we all had over 2 years to think about the measures form summer 2021.

there has also been a lot of talk about anti-abuse measures.
the snail logic simply put:
a Sim player should not have a good time in Sim but is under constant suspicion of being an abuser.
to put it very briefly and simply

we are customers after all. and we want epic battle moments. if I manage to persuade my old friends to fly together in EC at snail night, it’s never possible. it’s like a curse. it’s always a classic.
one of them says: “let’s go to DCS, let us abuse!” :D
those are the typical snail evenings.

I also have to add that when I play alone, it works from time to time.
9ufr4SS

but never when I want to play snail with friends at the weekend. we always end up sitting in the lobby looking stupid

Let it burn

It’s people complaining about bots ruining sim more than the bots themselves.

I’d say let’s bet on it but GJ won’t make that change anyway so there’s no need to get your panties in a bunch.

Back in the day of the classic bomber ABuse, we still had operation lobbies.

All bombers used to be on Mozdok, so you had a neat little containment zone.

If you wanted to play sim properly you just played anything but mozdok.

For some unexplainable reason, the sim community thought it was a good idea to Petition gaijin to remove mozdok.

And then after mozdok was removed, they all complained about bomber ABisers in their games.

They disabled friendly rwr on RB but not on Sim. Nothing more need be said

Are you sayng that they should disable it? Hell no…

Unless they fix RWR sensitivity they should definitely disable it for sim too.

I don’t need alarms going off in my cockpit because my friend is firing off radar missiles in a completely different direction whilst flying in front of me