If you crit them and they crash, you should get the full payout though
1 Like
I had many cases where i got a Crit (usually just a flap or so gone) and they then crashed when they were closer to one of my teammates and all i got was the pay for the crit.
Or i literally only got about 65% of the kill from Crit/Normal Hit + Crash mechanic
1 Like
hmm… Definetly sounds like the system needs work then
2 Likes
Bu bu bu but think about the abuse and bots!!! :(
(banning them is too much effort for gaijin)
1 Like
Not exactly bc is not a issue deal with AIM 7F or R-24R, at least not for me, but high br like 13.0/14.7 it is a problem bc if you have a new plane you’re gonna be in a loop of multipathing untill you get the chff
I would say Rank 8 & 9 should get stock chaff.
but then there are the edge case aircraft at 12.0 that are rank 7 that should also get stock chaff. Especially those armed with only 2x Aim-9Ds stock.
So its tricky whether or not rank 7 should also get it.
MP cant ever be lowered as.
12 missiles vs 45 CMs
CMs cant be increased as realism. Ironic
Extra 2. Should be just zero. If gaijin gives player stock chaff and makes maps with actual terrain and not gm_flatgrass
3 Likes
F-16 ADF has Fox 3s, while Su-27 has Fox 1s.
J-15T has 48 CMs, because IRL it relies on ECM.
It’s not ironic, it just lacks context.
Stock chaff is enough. Most maps will always be relatively flat, unless you want to play only in the mountains.
I agree, notching is too easy and too reliable. Much like most people have said here though, notching alone isn’t the only problem and buffing data link or nerfing notching alone will only make other issues even more of a problem. To only change notching will make things like multipath and more importantly iron dome, much more of a problem.
Personally I think all areas would need some attention at the same time for this to have the desired impact.
Make iron dome a dice roll, dont remove it but if it was at minimum a 50/50 for each interception then players would rely on it less and planes that have more missiles would no longer have a built in advantage when it comes to intercepting planes with significantly less missiles.
Data link could also be buffed though i don’t think multi player data link would be overall healthy for the game mode. If individual data link was more reliable then we wouldn’t have the need for semi realistic multi player data link. This will be particularly important when we get next gen fox3 with very long range NEZ. The larper in me would absolutely cheese over seeing some AWACs player datalink my PL15 i launched 3 minutes ago, but i really dont think this would be healthy.
Seakers as a whole are very dumb. Currently when a target is notching the seaker will get stuck in a loop, it gets notched and chaffed and bites the chaff, iog doesnt seem to work well for closer range targets and it will then use data link, bite chaff and repeat until the target is too close to the missile and it just sticks to the chaff until its defeated. When you incorporate any kind of vertical loop this becomes extremely exaggerated and way too effective.
Multipath im less concerned with, its a shitty mechanic but it think somewhat necessary for the game as a whole. Gaijin already failed to incorporate their subsystems mechanic where if a plane took damage that has the new subsystems modeled, i.e. countermeasures, RWR, HUD etc, its essentially useless even if not killed outright. If this was actually reliable with a slight increase to warhead proxy strength then multipathing may not be a total death sentence but at least more of a mobility kill.
overall though I agree with you that notching is too easy and too reliable. Though as most things with this game, one fix wouldn’t be enough for the overall balance, and would most likely have a huge negative effect on the game as whole if devs dont look at the bigger picture. BVR too some degree should be more effective, and I think this is a good place to start.
Good post and I hope productive discussion gets done.
3 Likes
The context is we have at a guess 0.5KD f16a vs flankers. If they changed multipath the game would die faster than the f16s
Same people who want realism also cry when suggestions for more CMs- even if it was just the max ammount any version of jet could get are made. Yes its ironic.
Premium flankers should be 13.7, not 13.3. Right now, without any changes.
1 Like
True but they have confirmed no decompression.
As many jets face fox 3 with very few CMs theres no solution. MP is essential as jets cant get more CMs due to realism.
Then you have, amung others the king of dust -TT china special with 45 CMs.
MP is essential and always will be
Importance of having chaff will decrease, if you increase notching resistance, as you will have to defeat missiles kinematically more without using chaff anyway.
(*48 CMs) Irl J-15T relies on ECM, so again it’s the lack of realism that makes it bad, not too much.
Vehicles/systems/solutions are meant to work in a certain context, meaning if you want something realistic, you need a bunch of other things to also be realistic, for it to make sense.
Also F-16 ADF could go back to having 60 standard CMs, instead of 15 large, 30 standard, and it would be realistic. In fact it should be a choice whether you want 60 standard, 15 large/30 standard or 30 large CMs.
The original discussion is about notching in terms of gameplay and balance anyway, not multipathing nor realism. Even though multipathing could be lowered as well, and both of these changes would be realistic.
This topic sounds like: “Let me do more kills just for locking and launching missiles”
2 Likes
It’s true notching can be considered a bit on the easier side now that many people understand the mechanics behind it.
What is the end goal of all of these people who keep advocating for “Remove multipating” and “Make notching harder”? This game is already a 16v16 mess that constantly messes with skill involvement through chaos and disorder. Do you really, legitimately, want a game where the only correct course of action is to fire your fox3s at 40km then go cold and fly 40km in the opposite direction? Do you think YOU would find that fun?
I’d go as far as to say literally nobody who is advocating for this would enjoy this gameplay more than 3 months. The game would become incredibly one dimensional and remove pretty much all skill involvement. Congratulations, game ruined.
2 Likes
- Yes (although you wouldn’t need to fly that far because other methods exist i.e, bleed missile energy through S turns, diving, etc.)
- Also, yes.
Also,
The premise that this automatically removes skill involvement is questionable. One could argue that such changes, if implemented, would separate those with actual skill from everyone else.
1 Like
If you just turn 90 degrees and drop chaff,you die cause you get angle gated.