It was suffering at 11.0,was the reason i stopped playing it. Now its playable again. SMT with much stronger engine is 10.3,over SMT the 7D have just better missiles. After the FM nerf neither of them can really turnfight.
I am less concerned with whether or not it needs to go back up in BR, I’m inclined to think it’s the usual compression issues and new players tanking its stats while they learn the game. Rather I just think your assertion that increasing missiles from 2 to 4, increasing their overload from 10 to 35G, un-caging the seeker allowing radar slaving, increasing speed from 1.7 to 3 MACH, adding a more powerful engine and the addition of 72 countermeasures is not a significant upgrade over the Mig21F13 is frankly a bit ridiculous.
10.0 for the 1st one, they only get 2 Magics and 1 radar/ less effective IR and no CM though.
I think the main reason for the J-7D gets hate is because its premium so it gets spammed a lot more than other aircraft with the high G missiles at that BR range so it stands out more.
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MiG-21SMT is more fatter and has worse flight models.
Reminder Russian model need to carry CM pods, which makes it more fatter.
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That is understandable, and as you said, it’s a premium, it’s going to be spammed more than the actual tech tree variant. At that point, I was more inclined to irritate him because I was figuring he was some whiner that died to it once and went on the forums to cry about it. So I was more willing to screw with him by using the lowest BR MiG 21 to tease him.
As I said though, it definitely doesn’t need to move up. That’s more of a punishment than an actual fix. Very similar to when they moved the Kfir Canard and the J35X up to 11.3 for no reason, and it took them half a year to put it back down to 10.3/10.7 area. Sure, I’m sure it’s a decent plane, but I still regard it as a jet that will do terribly at 11.0 (especially since it will constantly face the F4S because what’s a downtier) and China will continue to be a nation no one plays because premiums are the best way to grind.
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Aside from the J-7D, the 10.7 BR aircraft (excluding attackers) include the F-8E (USN), F-5A/C, F-4F Early, and Mirage IIIE. all of which suffer from significant drawbacks, such as poor flight models, aren’t that fast, a lack of countermeasures, or unreliable missiles etc.
At 11.0, we’ve got the F-5E, F-104G, F-4EJ, F-4F, MiG-23M/MF, and F-5A(G). I don’t see how the J-7D doesn’t belong at the same BR with them. Only issue is MiG-21bis, which is just undertiered.
You would always use the PL-5Bs but yes
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The 3E is a lot worse than the J-7D
Mirage 3E has like 45 CMs…?
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Do you think every MiG-21 flies even close to one another in FM? Because they don’t. The F-13 is about half the jet the J-7D is even if both don’t have missiles equipped or CMs.
9Ls don’t start on fighters until 12.0. 12.0. 12.0. 12.0. See that number?
You want R-73s at 12.0. Get a clue :)
Guess what, MiG-21MF and MiG-21SMT both belong at 10.7 as well, making the J-7D a 11.0.
Frankly, I’m surprised there are still players who think it belongs at 10.7BR, especially when many of them don’t even make proper comparisons with other aircraft at the same BR or +/- 0.3BR.
The playerbase is incredibly bad at the game and this shows when they have opinions. That’s the gist of why people believe silly things like that
Can I see R-73s at 12.0 cuz I like to spam super OP plane :p
/s
This is why I hate over 90% of playerbases in forum/reddit when they talk about “balancing”.
If the discussion is not about balancing, there are a lot of good guys and focus on actual constructive discussion, but that’s it.
“9Ls don’t start until 12.0. 12.0. 12.0. 12.0. See that number?”
9Ls don’t start until 12.0? By golly, when did the A-10A become a 12.0 plane? When did the Sea Harrier (both tech tree and squadron) become 12.0? When did F111C become 12.0? When did Buccaneer S.2B become 12.0? When did F111F become 12.0? When did the AV8-B (NA) become 12.0? When did the AV-8S Late become 12.0? When did the F-5T SCU become 12.0? When did the Tornado IDS become 12.0? When did the Tornado IDS (1995) become 12.0? When did the Tornado IDS MLU (RET.8) become 12.0? When did the Tornado IDS ASSTA1 become 12.0? When did the Norwegian F-5 become 12.0? When did the AJS37 become 12.0?
Darn, so many planes below 12.0 that have AIM 9Ls.
I see you decided to edit your response to only fighters, but I guess the Tornadoes and F-5s are no longer considered fighters.
Yeah, J7D shouldn’t be the same BR as the Mig-21 Bis or the Mig-23M, but with the down tier is facing a lot of people without CMs, while you can dodge a 10G missile without them a 35G missile is a death sentence and I think that is what frustrates people.
I would like to see some of these hard to balance aircraft (and tanks for that matter) have their BR range adjusted so rather than +/-1 BR adjust it to +/- 0.7 so for example J-7D would see aircraft from the 11.3 to 10.0 range. that might help some what.
I’m not to familiar with Chinese missiles, but I guess the extra range is worth the trade off as not much is dodging a 30G MACH 2.5 missile anyway.
Yes, but its closer than the Mig-21F and I was basing my comparisons on the assumption you would be using the PL-7 which is a Magic-1.
You are right, the default load out had drop tanks between the standard and large cal CMs so I missed the standard ones on the stat card, my bad.
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Yes, I’m aware you want the 0.7 BR difference, I agree it’s a lot better, but I bet you they will make up an excuse that it will take longer for queue times because apparently 1.0 BR difference is instantaneous, while 0.7 BR difference will take too long. I don’t know, but I know that will be the excuse, second to “skill issue, just get good” that the forums will say.
I still stand by my grad system, where props fight only props, early jets only fight early jets, missiles only fight missiles, all while maintaining the BR system. It’s like school. You start in your elementary (props), then you get into… I believe you Americans call it middle school or junior high (early jets), and then your high school (your missiles) and then university (so-called “Fox 3s”)
Perhaps it still cannot be balanced.
Just look at what the CL-13A Mk.5 was doing back in 2018, Hunter FGA.9/J32B in 2019-2020.
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I’m not holding my breath for a change for all vehicles, but I wish they would at least consider it for the ones that cause sever problems with balancing, F-104, the Maus etc.
I assume you would still maintain BRs within the “Grad” system? just hard breaks between some areas.
Not a bad idea, I can still see some issues with things like Fox3 Harriers and F-4F ICE though.
Read closer
The only plane you list after this point with any relevance to being a fighter is the F-5T SCU and the F-5A(G) both of which only have 9L tier missiles due to them being F-5s and in gaijin’s world this means they undertier them. Though I did forget these. Still, rules always have exceptions and this does not undermine the rule. The rule is still 12.0 for 9L tier missiles. MiG-21bison is perfectly fine at 12.3. It would be overpowered at 12.0.
No?
You read it the first time as fighters, typed out a long ass list of attackers, then realized I said fighters. GG.
Correct they are literally anything but fighters, the ones you listed. They are strictly interdictors with no other defined roles. Believe it or not, Tornado ADV? Different plane! Also 12.0!
I wasn’t playing around then, so I cannot be too sure. I believe that the best balance is by putting things into technological grades. Sure, some props are better than others, but then at least you’re not a prop fighting something going 800km/h. At least you’re not playing the J32B and constantly fighting A-10As. At least you’re not playing a F4S and getting smacked by RB99s from JA37DIs.
People think these jets could go even lower BR btw. They claim its unfair that they fight supersonics in uptiers. Meanwhile in 2018 people had sense and realized even a 9.0 CL13 was extremely hard to beat for the 8.0s.