Imo the F-14A should get AIM-9L and the F-14B should get AIM-7P, AIM-9M or possibly both.
The IRIAF can stay as it is for a while for what it did in the past.
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Theres no up-to-date uptier graph currently out, butr from my own experience playing 18C early in the past three weeks, the uptiers are definetively not that common, since majority of my enemies were MiG-23s.
In comparison, F-15A which im spading currently faces uptiers much more often.
So unless Im shown some graph how often 12.7 is or is not uptiered that would prove either of us right, Im dismissing this point entirely and going stricly by what missiles are aviable to 12.7 planes and number of games played last month. And these are, for the most part, non-IRCCM.
12.3 and 12.7 M2Ks have combined number of battles for the past month at some 180k ish.
The belgian OCU has 46k battles for the past month.
JH-7A has 128k battles. This one is 12.3.
Bison has 343k battles. This one is also 12.3.
Thast the most of the 12.7 IRCCM armed planes I can think of right now, and I included two 12.3s as well, which massively increases the pool of compared aircraft.
Now, for comparison, and I will be going only with 12.7 planes that have non-IRCCM short range IRs aviable (so not counting 27T or 27ET as thats entirely different class of missile).
All 12.7 MiG-29s, Sniper included, amount to 551k games.
The premium 12.7 hornets amount to 3.422 mil games.
F-14A early amounts to 278k games.
F-16AJ amounts to 102k games.
Both Netz jets amount to 402k games.
Im not including 12.3 non-IRCCM planes in this because I cant be arsed.
I think its safe to say IRCCM missiles are definetively not a common sight at 12.7 and it is more likely than not to run into non-IRCCM missile rather than IRCCM one.
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like, dont get me wrong, im not saying Tomcats dont deserve any attention, but their problems wont be fixed by mere BR shift or addition of missile.
they actually dont really atleast not on this map size R27ERs can lowkey hit just as far and better using TWS you can fire them super far
14A/B could easily drop by a step in BR and not be too crazy, especially after the sparrow/phoenix mixing limitations
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no no this is the wrong perspective.
People learned how to combat them because of the pheonix spam during the free tomcat event/incident
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+1 for the A getting 9Ls, and B getting 9Ms. It’s overdue, and I’d rather have them buffed than have them move down in BR.
-1 for any BR reductions, because I’d rather not have climbing functionally removed from the match they are in. Why climb if you’re just going to be forced to defend against missiles with twice your range?
-1 for the IRAF getting any BR reduction, because Fakours are cancer to fight. They activate your RWR unreasonably close (sub 14km in my experience, but often as low as 10), giving you zero counterplay.
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Their aren’t good their mid at best you have to spam the living hell out of them and notch/multi path especially at 13.0 the bol pods on the f14B is not comparable to the jas39 as it has a better rcs and less ir signature
And if the F-14B ends up needing more help to stay 13.0, Gaijin can also give it AIM-7P.
(although I’m of the opinion that every 13.0 plane with sparrows should get theirs replaced with AIM-7P, at least those that can get them)
Choosing the eft as example was bad as it not even the same one compare to f14 when the tornado and av8 exist witch would’ve been better examples picking the eft is like picking the jas39 witch in game has the same bol pods (if I’m not mistaken)but both of those aircraft have better ir signature and rcs compared to the f14
Theirs like 14 planes with ir irccm missils with some ranging in at 11.3-12.7 br for example A10c,Jh7, Jh-7a,Mirage 2000c-s5,Mirage 4000,Mirage f1ct,Mirage 2000-r1,Mirage 2000-rmv,F-16a ocu,Mirage f1cA200,MiG-21 bison,Su25t,Su39, and Su25sm3 all at least have 2 of them
As I said I never found them lacking on planes I used that have them.
you completly missed the point. the airframe wasnt what was compared. BOLs CMs were.
allright now do all aircraft without IRCCM missiles within this BR range as well as how much they are played ;)
it may not dictate them but undoubtedly HMS is a very big advantage especially when you have HOB missiles such as the r73.
AAM3’s are literally better 9M’s lol, they turn faster and turn harder
r27ER is just leagues better than any sparrow lol, r73 is arguable better than 9M depending on the situation. 2 less missiles and less CM but for missiles that cant be rolled and are extremely fast is free kills assuming a fox1 only lobby.
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Planes that have a better ir signature and rcs compared to the F-14B, do you even have the F-14B?
And you missed my point you used a plane that has better ir signature and rcs to a plane that compared to it the eft obviously would have a easier time defending even in its br to witch i said you should’ve just used the tornado or av8 as a better example because they have almost the same ir signature/rcs to the f14
my point was that their is irccm missiles in that br so it would been seen commonly especially since their 14 aircraft that have them in that br and France has 3 planes with irccm missiles with Sarah missiles at 12.7 so I do expect some of those being commonly seen and then you got su25 with irccm missiles with those a2g missiles that are good enough to take out planes
Plane that faces much more IRCCM missiles than F-14A or F-14B ever will, solely by grace that these planes can see downtiers with planes that do not have IRCCM missiles (more on that later) whereas downtiered EFT will still see 99% IRCCM missiles.
which share the BR with F-14B so the exact same as above applies. They dont see as much IRCCM missiles as EFT does, and BOL CMs seem to do just fine on it.
aight i dont have anything better to do, so lets take a brisk look into this, shall we?
For each listed aircraft im listing number of battles of ARB for december 2025. This comparison isnt perfect as many of these planes were together in single battle at the same time, but I just want to demonstrate something. Im also looking only at short range IRs, no R27Ts or R27ETs as these are entirely different class missile with different purpose.
Now lets add all the other planes you mentioned with IRCCM missiles.
A-10C 105k battles.
JH-7 78k battles
Mirage F1/F1C-200/FCT 1.565 mil battles
Mirage 2000D-R1 32k battles
Mirage 2000D-RMV 34k battles
Su-25T 127k games
Su-25SM3 47k games
Su-39 383k games
All of the above bring us to total of (roughly) 3.248 mil games played by planes found at 11.3-12.7 with IRCCM missiles.
Now, lets some of the non-IRCCM missile armed aircraft between 11.3-12.7, BR range you set up yourself.
F-4E 385k games
F-4EJ kai 49k games
F-4S 1.1mil games
F-4J 260k games
F-4J(UK) 100k games
F-111F 196k games
F/A-18A (both US and AUS) 397k games
F-16A 261k games
F-20A 321k games
AV-8B (NA) 127k games
MiG-23ML 1.805 mil games
◊MiG-23MLA 171k games
MiG-23MLD 163k games
◄Tornado IDS WTD61 403k games
▄F-104S TAF 291k games
All of the above bring us to total of (roughly) 11.335 mil games played by planes found at 11.3-12.7 without IRCCM missiles.
I dont know about you, but this almost seems it is more likely to run into non-IRCCM plane at that BR spread rather than into non-IRCCM plane.
And I couldnt be bothered counting ALL non-IRCCM planes at that BR spread.
Can you explain why you suddenly include the 11.3 BR where theres almost exclusively missiles without IRCCM, despite the question strictly only involving the BRs 11.7-13.7/14.0?
Dosnt quite click with me.
Why not just include the 10.0 BR aswell then to prove your point?
I didnt, person Im responding to did. I merely abide by the rules he put forth :) he wants to include 11.3 IRCCM planes in his argument, im gonna include 11.3 non-IRCCM planes.
Ok, my bad I missed Knuckles7080-live mentioning the 11.3 BR
Sorry for that.
But yeah, theres only 5 Aircraft at that BR with IRCCM Missiles and 3 of those are Premiums, which arnt even that good in ARB.
So no surprise those numbers are low. - which donst really matter anyway in context of the Topic since its outside the past and current F14 BR range.
However even earlier than that in this very thread a BR of 12.7 for F-14B was proposed. This comparison of IRCCM vs non-IRCCM originated in that, my original argument was that up to 700x CMs at 12.7, despite being BOLs, is as they say, fkin insane to face in a plane without IRCCM missile.
Even in a reduction to 12.7 it wouldnt see 11.3 planes - which is what i mean with it being irrelevant really.
But vanilla R60s will just Ignore those BOL flares within a certain range, Sidewinders are even better at this, because the Engines are just so hot and I say that as someone who mained the MiG-23 while the F14B was still in its Air Space.
Overall I agree that the F14As should be moved down in BR again, since Gaijin nerfed their Radars in the past weeks, making it “remember” chaff locations instead of filtering them, which isnt that fun when fighting mostly Su27s and Su33s nowadays, whom all have ARH that dont explode as soon as the other guy turns away.
I’d understand your concerns if the F14 would have a MAW system, but it dosnt.
12.7 does not only face 12.7