No matter which way you put it the ICE is better than the AV-8B+, so no. Also it would absolutely crush the 12.0 premium players.
oh boo hoo, the premium player would have to try a little harder. no matter which way you put it the mig-29 is better than the ICE. what you said makes 0 sense. An AIM-120 launched from a harrier is the same AIM-120 that is launched from the ICE, flight performance matters little if there is gonna be a 13.0 AMRAAM slinger
An AMRAAM fired at 0.85 Mach at low altitude is NOT the same as an AMRAAM fired from 1.25 Mach at high altitude.
That’s a compression problem, decompress up, not compress down. If you are outclassed in every way possible you still should move to a place where you outclass something else in every way possible.
You seem like the kind of person to say the ICE is defenseless against 13.7 planes no? But you think an ICE vs the F-104S.ASA would be fair huh?
So
You can’t club 12.0 planes. Take your brain dead Iranian F-14 tomcat players and be greatful.
I guess avionics is not considered in determining br
What i sent is a baseline, and there are exceptions to the rule based on avionics.
It is though. They both can be dodged by getting low and/or notching. The same way a Phoenix at 12.3 can be dodged. It’s not like players at 12.0 don’t know how to dodge radar missiles, they have to deal with F-14s in every game even before the event.
No, I don’t seem like the type I am the type. That is literally what I am saying. In a sheer dogfight, no missiles, the F-104 could at least keep its speed and speed away while the F-4 turns. The F-4 has nothing on a 4th Gen fighter. 4th gens turn better, accelerate harder, and have similar if not higher top speeds.
Not to mention that the F-104 player gets the benefit of moving on from the plane for bigger and better things. The F-4F ICE is the end of the line and the only option for Germany to experience Fox-3 gameplay. If there was a different top tier with AMRAAMs I really wouldn’t care, but that is not the reality we live in nor will it be until the Eurofighter is added.
The F-104 is a bad example anyway. It’s not like the F-104 you are referring to has a fun time without needing to deal with the ICE.
You are right it is a compression problem, but it’s not like compression is an issue Gaijin is keen on solving. It took them forever to do a “mass” decompression like the one we saw a few updates ago and even that “fix” was like putting a band-aid on a gunshot wound.
I thought I was going to be and I would, except that a slight up-tier is much more common than a full-down tier. Therefore, it gets a fun game in maybe 1 out of 10 matches. Could that change as more people unlock the plane? Sure, but then what happens when the brain-dead players realize they suck at the brain-dead tomcat gameplay and drop the game or go play a different plane?
If the only way a plane is fun/playable is in a down-tier, then something needs to be done. Since I don’t see Gaijin doing another decompression attempt anytime soon, the only thing that can be done is changing BRs; not just for this plane, but other vehicles that are in a BR nightmare too.
But one will be coming at you from a weird angle and very much faster, they have very different characteristics and one fired from the ICE is harder to dodge.
The phoenix is a bad example because it is a slow, 17G missile that 90% of the time won’t hit 17Gs. The phoenix can also be defeated by turning around for 2 seconds and than turning back.
From AIM-9Ls at 12.0 to AIM-9Ls at 13.0 ;)
Fat chance maverick drops his baby lmao.
All games are at the bare minimum a minor down tier in the ICE, if you get into a 13.7 match there is a good chance you will see 12.7 planes. I don’t wanna sound pretentious here and I’m sure you’re a very good player but I think you have to play it like the M4K when it gets up tiered. You have to use terrain, stay low, stay with teammates and take cheap shots at distracted people whenever you can.
Moving the ICE to 13.0 would create even more compression issues than there already is, it would insinuate the F-16ADF or Mirage 4000 is equal to the ICE, I’m going to be frank with you it isn’t. 4 IRCCM missiles and 4 AMRAAMs is a 13.3 kit unless you put it on a prop plane.
I’m glad you acknowledged it is a compression problem which can be solved by moving obviously superior planes up (I’m looking at you F-15C) to 14.3 or 14.7 even. The players may not trust gaijin to try it again but for the sake of hard to balance planes like the ICE it is necessary.
Can you elaborate more on this rules? I have a feeling that they don’t consider avionics when determining BR
Because Russian radar system is in all aspect inferior to their western counter parts. As can be shown here
To my knowledge, most top aircraft BRs are not balanced around theirnown BR, but rather to not crush lower tiers (see F4F ICE and Tornado ADV L only 0.3 lower than F-15C MSIP) and as Russian missiles can be carried im such high amounts (10 on SU-27) they are placed at a higher tier than feels balanced when playing them.
2 Likes
How is the top BR in naval RB still only 7.0? Its by far the most compressed game mode.
“But no one plays it, you don’t want queue times to be longer, do you?”
I’m pretty sure the compression is one of the main reasons no one plays it…
How is an Ashville(or pretty much any 3.3) suppose to deal with the SKR-7?
How does a Maxim Gorky (or pretty much any 5.7) deal with a Wyoming?
On a slightly different note yet still the same topic -
Nearly all players that use the Scharnhorst, Prinz Eugen, SKR-7, Jaguar, Brantford, and PG-02 have absurd KD ratios, but their BRs are never raised. I thought gaijin used “stats” to determine BRs?
And those 12.7 aircraft are still infinitely better aircraft in performance, they just have poo poo armaments.
You can’t put a rating on a kit if the Mig-21 Bison is going to exist. That thing gets to sit pretty at 12.3 with 2 IRCCM missiles, 2 of the best SARH missiles in the game, AND a HMS.
This is an issue that needs to be addressed in some way. I would like to see things moved for a temporary solution (things like this plane and others like the F-4C are in an unplayable position), but there really needs to be another attempt at decompression gamewide, not just for air.
I know we’ve only been talking about air because that is what my original post was about, but things get even worse when you start to look at ground balance. All the new, top-dog tanks that are being added are just getting slapped at 11.7 even though some are clearly better than others (i.e. the Leopard 2A7HU). It makes playing 10.7-11.3 unbearable. Even once you make it to 11.7, depending on your country you still aren’t even out of the woods because more likely that not your 11.7 is still just going to get dogged on by the more elite 11.7 tanks.
1 Like
can we please fix me 262 a1a jabo and a regular having to fight mig 15 and f86 a5 me262 c2b haveing to fight 9.0s is a pain to
That’s a weird way if spelling gaijin needs to decompress but yeah pretty much
1 Like
At the end of the day, I really don’t care about the F-4F ICE. If I want to play top tier, I can just go play a different nation. It just sucks for players that don’t have that option. I would also at least like to spade the thing, but I don’t even want to touch it because of the spot it is in.
1 Like
13.3 is kind of gaijins excuse for planes they don’t want to put effort into balancing, same with 11.3 ground. They say “just below top tier is fine” when it is certainly not.
2 Likes
The F-84B and F-84G should both be uptiered, or have their airspawn removed. Giving some of the fastest planes for their Brs airspawns is an awful idea, and they make playing anything at that BR a pain. They also are able to climb higher than everything else because of them.
They make playing 6.0-8.0 infuriating since you just can’t counter them 90% of the time.
The 76mm variant is 6.3, he is talking about the 75 jumbo.
Need more attention to Luftwaffe br and performance
and more WW2 attackers and bombers br difference in ARB and GRB
Make matchmaking based on year and month. Every tank before the set match date can be used. anything above it can not.
Then make sure only the correct countries group with each other and spawn on the correct side of the historical map. add a date of the battle there and it set’s the stage for some cool historical gameplay. This is way better and more fun than the current bs that is RB. I think it’s actually fun to face things stronger than me. You could balance this by for example giving the team with weaker tanks a few more players.
That would be good as an event (I’m fairly sure that’s what they did with World War mode, but I could be wrong).
However, that shouldn’t be added for regular RB since it won’t be fun for the people in worse tanks. There’s also situations where post-war tanks are on par with WWII tanks, like many Swedish and French tanks.