If polls are so irrelevant why did you make one?
4 Likes
I can see that but at the same time I literally bought 2 more crew slots for France this year just to play more tanks. I don’t have a single lineup with more than 1 plane. If you have more than 2 planes in your lineups just suck it up I guess.
The game is not more challenging for CAS players. Once you are CASing nothing changes. First spawn CAS has not been made any harder to get in the recent past.
Making it boring for SPAA I can agree with. Sucks to spawn SPAA and just have nothing to shoot at but everyone knows this is an option when they spawn SPAA.
Game being boring for CAP? You wanna shoot down planes with your plane? There is 3 dedicated game modes just for that. You don’t necessarily have to do it in ground battles.
Someone else already said that IFVs are not meant to be engaging planes.
All of those can be dealt with without resorting to CAS and that has always been the case.
1 Like
I was not referring to eliminating of “Close Aerial Presence,” but rather the “cap zone and immediately J out to jump in a plane” behavior, otherwise abbreviated as “cap & fly.” Apologies for the misunderstanding.
1 Like
It’s a habitual victim mentality - the people doing the complaining will never not find something else to complain about. Hence why the only long-term solution to the CAS question must be constructed in such a way that it is automatically insulated from such crap.
Which boils down to making all potential counters to CAS so everpresent and effective even in average player hands that even the most stubborn fools like these cannot come up with any excuse not to try using said counters.
“But I wanna play tanks!” ain’t an excuse, either. That is a choice of preference. If they willingly choose a vehicle class which is not effective against aerial threats, that should be solely on them with nothing to blame but their own stubborn choice.
The entire “earn SP for plane” concept is fundamentally unbalanceable in my eyes. Doesn’t matter what you set the cost to. One team will always get air up before the other, who then complains its “OP” simply because they’re salty about dying and don’t want to blame their own mistakes.
And if you make that choice willingly, then you should have no excuse to complain. You willingly choose to keep playing a game that has and will always have both - that isn’t a game problem, but rather a user preference one.
EXACTLY! Average players will not learn to use SPAAGs if aircraft get less common, and if the only practical SPAAGs are also totally defenseless against tanks. Rather, much as we saw when helicopters were new and Gaijin jacked up SP costs to save the whales from the consequences of their own actions, the fewer planes that did get airborne became more powerful, not less, because less people bothered even bringing appropriate counters with them.
People go full “ANGR MONKY” mode about CAS because frankly, snail implemented CAS very poorly as a killstreak powerup ripped out of Call of Duty, and completely lacking the vast majority of its real objectives, thereby forcing all CAS to try their luck at killing tanks whether they’re actually good at it or not. Simultaneously, tiny tank maps effectively trap tanks in a barrel waiting to get bombed, and current mechanics of the kill camera and airspawns only encourage the use of CAS as a sleazy revenge weapon. Thus this absolute dumpster fire of a mechanic has at least three overlapping parts, most of which have received no adjustment in years or only the barest minimum.
- It is currently implemented as a revenge killstreak powerup, with rage-inducing mechanics encouraging this toxic use.
- Its counters for most of the game are ineffective or unavailable when you need them. Despite the mode being marketed as a Combined Arms mode, it doesn’t actually force users to have both unit types in their decks when it probably should.
- Aircraft are totally lacking most of their possible objectives which could serve to draw away a lot of incoming bombs/rockets/gunfire/missiles from player tanks. Most CAS IRL hit supply lines, not tanks directly, which were too numerous and stubborn to kill to make a massive difference with.
Habitual CAS haters are quite literally the “this is fine” meme - as long as they get their selfish piece of the pie, they couldn’t care less that the rest of it has gone rancid.
Fish-in-a-barrel maps are part of the CAS problem. It means that tanks have nowhere to hide. Thus in addition to counters being all over the place in terms of effectiveness, if people use them at all that is, and that CAS lacks most of its real objectives, tanks are stuck in shoeboxes with no options.
Of course it’s frustrating - but the solution is to completely reform how CAS works, and in a broader sense also the objectives & maps tanks use alongside that, not removing or “removing” planes to throw a rug over the stain.
I have long felt the mode name needs to be changed to make it more obvious. Also, it could pull a page from Naval and give everyone default aircraft in their decks so now, nobody is lacking BR-appropriate Fighters and CAS. Theoretically such a concept could also be extended to SPAAG and SAMs.
Then if everyone has the tools to help themselves but some choose not to, then those who choose not to use them forfeit their excuse to complain about how “OP” CAS supposedly still is.
Excellent comparison. Another would be walking into a sandwich shop and demanding they make you a pizza - even if both are technically made from the same ingredients in many cases, if its not on the menu, then its not on the menu. If the store doesn’t specialize in making pizza, even if they made you one, chances are it won’t be all that spectacular (like Subway offering pizza in America - I have yet to see anyone order it).
Most of them are simply too much “ANGR MONKY” mode to calm down and think rationally about how CAS does and does not work. As a system, it IS absolutely FUBAR in its current state. Fixing it would mean totally scrapping RB’s “earn SP for (better) vehicle” concept in favor of what Simulator does, which has been tested in some RB events but not seriously pursued.
Not only is CAS a FUBAR system, but it has so many interlocking component issues that MUST be fixed almost simultaneously, not piecemeal or any attempts at truly “fixing” it will go down in flames.
Amen.
3 Likes
You can’t stop a nuke carrier from ending the game in a tank neither, the point is, your tank is not a equivalent choice against aircrafts, and the advanced SAM’s spawn cost (90sp) is a ridiculous joke too.
EVEN FIRST SPAWN OF A CAS PLANE COSTS ALMOST 10 TIMES SP COMPARING TO THE TANK! Just do the math
1 Like
That is why it costs so much.
2 Likes
That is why it costs so much
1 Like
This is a straw man argument that has been debated over thousands of times. If you spawn an SPAA at the start of the match in any BR that is not somewhere betweeen 8.0 and 10.0 you are a detriment on your team since SPAA are ineffective against tanks which is all there is for the first minutes of the match. But if you spawn a tank which is what you should be doing you people keep claiming you chose “willingly choose a vehicle class which is not effective against aerial threats”.
No issues here.
They techincally did that by adding the drones at higher tiers but that is a bad example.
Or they could just make SPAA cheaper to unlock since they are slower to grind due to the small amount of things most of them can do.
Actually not. A better comparison would be ordering pizza with for example olives on it and complaining about the olives. But what you don’t say is that the pizza place only offers pizzas with olives on top and will not let you order one without olives by default.
1 Like
The difference is that planes don’t cost that much compared to what they can do ;)
Because watching CAS haters make themselves look stupid is fun.
There’s a difference between stumbling upon a once in a while WW2 br game with no planes, and seeing absolutely no planes at pretty much anywhere 8.3+.
Holy cope Batman
2 Likes
Damn, someone’s mad.
First group of players use “tanks” for jumping into plane ASAP, and then their “fun” begins. At this moment “fun” for second group of players, that likes tank battle, ends, because they either getting CASd, or MUST exchange “fun” tank for “unfun” SPAA.
Main problem of GRB, really.
4 Likes
Nope
Oh, so “LT-scout-j-out-plane” players don’t exist?
They’re so incredibly rare that you could go 100 games and MAYBE see two. The closest you really get is players that get multiple kills/caps really early in the round and die just as quick b4 spawning CAS.
You compare capture airfield in AB and ARB mode with planes is possible as in GRB. I doubt you can capture points with planes in GRB mayby with helicopter but not with planes/jets.
2 Likes
Helis can do it. Planes literally cannot even if you land on the cap.
No it’s just become clear that your poll is not giving you the result you expected so you are trying to justify this whole thread in your head.
4 Likes