@MotorolaCRO, I would respond to your previous reply to me…except it’s is now buried in the literal hundreds of new comments posted in the last 48 hours. I don’t see any point wading back in to find that exchange except to say that I disagreed with your contentions about RB AFs and what “combined” refers to in WT.
RB AFs has been and is a combined arms mode as-is, with AI forces in place because it’d be futile mechanically to have players on the ground (they don’t have the attention span for what player GFs in AFs modes would entail).
Most players (particularly WoT imports focused devoutly on GFs) don’t have the interest or patience to setup in the AFs modes as SPAAs as you’ve suggested. That, among other reasons, is why the SPAAs in AFs modes get laughed at…it’s just not viable for a variety of reasons, mechanical and player-side.
I contemplated a grand CA mode with RB AFs/GFs meshed in a populous set of battles on one stage with some divides and some overlaps. However, given the failure of World War mode and RB EC, I doubt an RB AF + GFs setup as described there will ever turn up.
RB GFs as-is is likely the realization of what CA will look like in WT; given its popularity, Gaijin has little reason to deviate from it either.
I appreciate your attempts at humor, but you’re mistaken for three reasons:
A tank being killed by an aircraft is not a game problem…that’s what WT is all about
WT is a combined arms game with aircraft & tanks as combatants; fights between air and ground units are expected
A loss due to poor vehicle mixture (ex. “too many SPAAs”) is a player/team issue, not a game problem
The ability to read matches’ direction and momentum matters; while players/teams can be forgiven for poor mixtures upon initial spawns (due to a lack of spawn screens and despawn points (which should be added)), not so with respawns…they can see the roster and conditions
If a team bungles their spawn choices terribly later on, the responsibility for the loss that follows is entirely on them–especially if they were faced with just ‘one aircraft’ to respond to.
Although I know you are thrilled about hyping up how aircraft are, we both know they’re not so potent as you portray (as statistics have repeatedly shown and proven). Bluntly: CAS hype is a hoax.
All players (and their teams) can make preparations to prevent their defeats (by selection the proper unit for themselves/their team)–whether they succeed or not is up to how well they play
Again, this ties into the ability to read the match and monitoring the team roster is an important part of this (first spawns should be delayed for an initial choices screen).
Nowadays, TO’s two best ways forward are these:
Spoiler
Fighters First:
If we had Fighters First implemented, the above point on preparations would only be made truer by giving players more freedom of choice. Teams would have more protection options (in the form of defensive fighters) while losing nothing (all existing first spawn choices would be retained); associated changes I’d want to see attached to FF’s implementation would be despawn points for GFs and AFs with SP rebates.
Trigger queue:
The novel ‘trigger queue’ idea is another avenue to TO, but that has never been seriously explored (or even discussed) in recent years. All things considered, that “submode” approach was an extremely practical way to get TO around most (if not all) of its needs yet the idea has seen hardly any interest.
Also: stop hogging War Thunder for Nintendo 64–when is that going to release?
It is a problem with balance as a player in a ground unit can’t do anything about it. He can’t change his vehicle into SPAA (if that even had a chance, or a plane).
If You don’t understand such simple thing after so many posts and discussions, there is no point in replying.
Eh…your images there do not make the case you seem to believe they do:
4 guys managing to get themselves killed by a 250kg bomb indicates they had no spacing discipline and made themselves vulnerable to enemy attack (a large HE shell and ammo rack or artillery barrage could have had similar results)
Multiple Wirbelwinds failing to kill a D4Y3 is embarrassing to them
If you were within their effective range, they missed you…thus they were simply defeated
If you bombed from high altitude at the edge of/beyond their effective range, that’d take a far more setup and aiming to achieve success (each easily open to undercutting by enemy/friendly action)…nothing improper about that. Again, they were simply defeated
The presence of at least one enemy fighter (P-51) and your success against it is a humiliation for that fighter…either he was incompetent, AFK or not trying. That was another means to prevent your successes that didn’t see realization by the opposing team.
All in all, I concur with the others: that was just a lousy enemy team, not an example of any particularly powerful CAS.
Players have the option to select the vehicles they choose–with all of their capabilities and limitations. That is the tacit deal you are making when you select a vehicle. It’s a package deal: you get you vehicles strengths and its weaknesses, whatever those might be. (Most SPAAs are not great breakthrough vehicles for instance)
For mutual support, there are teammates and you/they may vary your/their choices for the sake of the general team’s capability. (This is why the addition of a team roster that shows you first spawn selections prior to team spawning would be great…same thing with despawn points and SP rebates for GFs, I’ve suggested these things)
As I’ve previously explained before too, tanks can dodge most air attack attempts with smart maneuvering and good handling. No attack is a guaranteed success and its defeatist to believe such things. (If you’d like me to give you pointers on how to handle your tank in such scenarios, PM me)
I appreciate your attempt at humor, but again you’re mistaken. My understanding of this is fine (to be honest, it’s actually more advanced than your own). While I’d happy to tutor you (via PM), you have nothing to offer me (besides WT for N64).
As @JuicyKuuuuki has related and other data has validated, the number of tank kills ascribed to CAS sits at less than 20% (often nearer to 10%)…a far cry from what CAS hype pretends things to be. CAS hype is a hoax…dying to aircraft more than occasionally just doesn’t happen as a rule.
If you’re going to be upset about getting outplayed and defeated, try to avoid deaths altogether. Barring that, focus on what’s likelier to kill you (other tanks!)…that’s how you can really reduce your demises. The improved situational awareness will inevitably prevent your deaths from enemy air attacks along the way too, even if passively.
As I said, if you want me to advise and help you more send me a PM. (Likewise, how does one get the WT for N64 beta?)
And as others have stated as well, those AI units in ARB are pretty weak outside Airfield ones. Enemy ground units in ARB can be mostly ignored.
No need for setup if the maps are small enough and you spawn in directly into the furball.
Most non-AA ground units have a really hard time dealing with aircraft. Hiding is by far their best option, which in a PvP game isn’t exactly thrilling.
Not all tanks have good handling and can turn on a dime with good acceleration. This thing (alongside many others) can’t really escape from a semi-decent strafe/bombing run.
As said many times before GFRB imbalance is mostly result of players having too much and too little control at the same time. Meaning player can make any lineup he wants without even hint of knowledge what lineups he will be teamed up.
In proper Combined Arms game it is not possible (even if all players want to do it) to spawn only for example SPAA. Game doesn’t allow it as it would create imbalance. In WT its possible. Is it probable to happen, not really but its possible. As its possible to run one vehicle lineups.
So due to air assets naturally having advantage over ground units this makes it impossible to balance.
‘They aren’t shown for a good reason’ is such a pathetic take that it shows you’re not genuinely taking on board anything, and the fact I can guess ULQ liked this post just shows how close-minded you all are.
It’s only ‘unbalanced’ because you all die, and by the sounds of it, you don’t die all that much…
No. It is how it is. You are either dishonest or delusional.
Thats why all armies invest more into air force and drones than armored ground units. In fact UK is thinking to abolish tanks in total as they are not worth the effort on modern battlefields.
Also how can you as player defeat a plane coming at your vehicle at °80 without having roof MG.
Oh we’re talking ‘real life’ here? Well, this isn’t that so it’s irrelevant.
Well, first, you make sure you aren’t as visible as you’d be sticking out like a sore thumb, and second, I’d be calling out the air threat to the team…
Now because you’ve thrown the old ‘defenseless’ ‘without a hope’ stance, you’re wanting to be sure about your team, and thus, that’s where squading comes into it.
But don’t worry, once you get bombed in that undefended casemate deathtrap, you can spawn your SPAA.
But that is the actual solution, compared to sitting here throwing out hypotheticals, moaning about how bad the game is because you want to ignore a whole branch of ground vehicles, and play like you can’t even fight your way out of a paper bag.
But it is relevant, as even in game air assets have advantage over ground units and if you cannot see what it than you are truly delusional.
Everything you wrote above doesn’t help if you are in Ferdinand (or any slow vehicle) on Sinai map. And that falls under category I wrote above. You cannot know what to spawn since you don’t know what are other team members spawning. You don’t know even if they have any SPAA or planes in their lineups.
It’s not relevant or applicable to the game, or the situation you face being ‘plagued’ by planes.
Again with the ‘defenseless’ ‘I’m not on a team’ ‘I can’t make any effort’ nonsense…
There’s chat for a reason, and you can otherwise trust that others will be of sound mind to spawn something to help the team.
Thing is you have to trust people like those in this thread, who actively avoid trying to spawn SPAA, will struggle and strain to spawn a plane, die, then go back to hangar cos they haven’t got any SP left…
Then they’ll complain that planes are too easy, and are so bad…
