Were prop teams better back then? In general; yes
For some reason this thread fixated on U.S, on that front; it depends, a lot of their planes required teamwork to function smoothly and generally required a lot more time of target with only .50 cals. Give them something that can actually climb, still quite quick and turbolasers; say a full team of F8F-1B Bearcats and yeah U.S could win games consistently even on Hokkaido vs Griffon Spitfires.
i think hatred of props cristallizes around US players because when you play with them youre forced to bring your A game since most will die without doing a single thing, and then youre in a 3v10.
Im pretty sure if gaijin introduced a nation ban list, most players would instantly ban US because theyre tired of how stupid they tend to be, but to be fair all Big Three TT players tend to be a bit slow in the head.
Been playing since 2017, the game has gotten worse.
The quick pace of games does make this advantage considerable, though, as they allow for steamrolling if done adequately.
I wasn’t counting premiums and was assuming that most of the strike/interceptor aircraft have airspawn, so my list was:
IC:
And of the strike aircraft, I’d say only the A-36, P-61C-1, and maybe the 5.7 AD/AM are useful for non-bombing.
Their whole point was high-altitude interception of enemy fighters going after bombers, and the P-47s desperately need airspawn to be relevant in the first half or first two-thirds of a match.
The issue is that no amount of speed will get you 1.5-2km of separation before a plane can turn 90 degrees, and once they start shooting (and you would rather dodge than get hit by MGs/cannons that can actually do damage unlike 0.50 cals) you’ll be the one losing speed.
Then even if you’re climbing at a slight angle, if the enemy can keep enough energy to have nose authority (due to their climb rate) when you come back around they’ll still be able to at the very least make you decide whether to commit to a headon.
Which is where you’re the weakest in a BnZ-er?
Most will know to run away, but after that it’s just ??? and almost nobody tries to exploit your poor p/w.
Last time I fought a competent Zero it was me alone in the japanese 109, in a pacific map, against an american A6M2 (the irony lol) and a Spitfire Mk1 or 2.
I used my top speed and climb rate, I got above them, I killed both. Right at the end of the match after carrying my team, almost out of fuel, ammo, and time. I wish I had recorded it…
Me when I see good old US vs UK matchmaker in Hokkaido 💀
i killed a fucking wyvern in the a6m2 mod 11, that should tell you everything you need to know about the average player lmfao, i much prefer the ki 44 since you actually have a working engine and the guns are much better.
Imho this points out significant changes in prop Air RB:
The willingness of players to invest time for positioning is (almost) none existent. Topics like patience to wait for opportunities or tactical & strategic aspects (like target prioritization) before accepting (or even entering) a fight looks like relics from ancient times.
Everybody seems to be in a hurry to get mission score and to end matches as fast as possible - totally ignoring basic things like that the majority of gained RP is based on time being alive and killing the last enemy or securing a ticket win is way more important than scoring the most kills.
The game play looks often just like like a head-on simulator - and this is imho fully intended by gaijin. I mean alone the fact that repair cost increase if you stay alive for a longer time (or the whole match) is encouraging more reckless game play. So from a pure economic perspective those guys rushing in a Wyvern and enforce 2-3 head-on kills (and die) do everything right.
On top of that: 16 vs 16 decreased the overall quality as just rookies and veterans (if they fly meta planes) are able to benefit from that. Rookies just have to find an even lesser experienced opponent whilst the vet in a meta prop can remain (almost) untouchable.
As the exchange about air spawns, BnZ & US planes looks rather off-topic a short reply behind a spoiler:
You got me - i forgot in my list the P-38E, so i have to correct my previous reply to 12 fighters with IC or AS spawn.
You mentioned P-51s and P-47s - no interceptors - just look up the definition. As written earlier - it depends on team composition and individual pilot skill to make them work. If the wt meta favors quick matches it depends on each player to select the “right” aircraft.
I have no idea why you want 1.5 - 2 km separation. For me this looks like an experience issue - meaning that we have different experiences. I recommend you to watch this replay:
Gaijin Entertainment - Single Sign On
You will see an outstanding Ki-43 pilot dodging at least 15 BnZ runs of 2 experienced pilots - he had imho no real gun solution on both of us - despite this insane plane turns on a dime.
No - if you enemy has no altitude left to pick up the necessary speed to dodge your bullets he is dead.
In order to show you an example of a totally failed BnZ attack - watch this replay:
Gaijin Entertainment - Single Sign On
At around 09:00 I dropped on a Chinese P-51 C and took in my air brake too early - i overshot with just a marginal speed difference - skill issue. I decided to pretend to run and turned back in for turn fight as my 8 ton SM 92 outturns any P-51. The pilot was decent, so it took my almost 3 minutes untill i killed him at 11:44.
But the rest of the match showed the lack of experience of the last 2 enemies - a B-17 and a P-51 A. The Mustang saw me (he had rearmed) and i flew towards my main airfield (as i saw his marker too). They were slightly behind in tickets and their B-17 (has not rearmed with bombs) tried to equalize their ticket disadvantage by playing gunship whilst the P-51 broke off at 15:35 (as he assumed i would need to repair/rearm) and decided to go for ground targets too.
Both were subsequently spotted by our ai planes and i killed the P-51 (20:02) whilst my Su-8 killed their B-17 a few seconds later. Game over.
Have a good one!
Lmfao wat.
I mean UK side was super easy game because US team is basically dumb like bombing P-47s.
I would say your teammate is still same from back then.
oh yeah lol, f8f’s turnfighting spitfires =P
and yeah prop teams will turn me into the joker, i stg
ok so im grinding japan and having fun because their props are braindead easy to use but MY GOD, the “”“people”“” i play with are legit completely braindead, they only know headons, and i have to clutch, EVERY MATCH, its exhausting and tedious, and fun 1v1s never happen because either some shitter teammate sniffs up my ass and tries to steal or i get 1v4’d and get sniffed, i cant wait to grind jets in all trees so I NEVER have to fly props again, fuck.
Little vent post because damn this sort of thing is tiring as hell!
Do what we all do: buy a premium, put our Golden Eagles into crew and expert that premium slot, and then play until you are at top tier
I agree, but I think maybe 30% of that is caused by everyone just expecting quick matches and getting into the mindset of prioritizing the furball. Why take time to get better positioning for a single engagement when that increases your likelihood of being left in a 1v5 or 1v6 situation? That sort of thing.
True, but I’d also say that it’d generally be better for learning how to play the game by getting into more engagements - especially when that’s the majority of the issue when it comes to skill imo (and for me personally). I can spend the time climbing all the way to 5-7km, and I usually do, but once I’m there at least a third of the players in the match have already been knocked out and the number of engagements I can get in is lowered by a lot.
True. Not much else to say on that lol.
The P-47s and the (later) P-51s were interceptors defending bombers, though, and interceptor spawns should be used for those aircraft (especially the ones with poor climb rates). Just from a game design standpoint it doesn’t make sense to have all of these high-altitude fighters/interceptors start as far from their useful altitude as possible - especially when the stereotypical fast-climbing interceptor actually doesn’t need an airspawn to be good.
It’s roundabout the smallest distance where a trailing enemy is unlikely to be able to hit you by leading their shots, in my experience.
He did at least twice after a couple of minutes, but he was down to only ~74 ammo in his cannons, so he was conservative with his shots (a little too much imo, but idk).
top tier is fucking ass and bad players dominate there because they can just rely on their missiles, no thanks.
You’re not wrong, but it gets the grind done a lot faster. Yesterday I got through Rank VI done in a few hours just buy using a premium. It took me a good day and a half to research the MiG 17 with a MiG 15. So yeah, I’d say spamming missiles get you done faster than slowly grinding.
dude what how does that take you a WHOLE DAY to research one jet?
I think the introduction of the “Skill” mechanic has turned the bulk of the player base into desperate sweats that will rush to take any kill they can get, even if that means losing 5000m of alt to join 5 other people already engaging a single guy on the deck, pushing a head on because they can’t bear the thought that someone else might get a kill if they dodge and come around or just straight up sheading your plane because you dared to get between them and “their” kill… never mind that you where dogfighting for half a min before they showed up.
That’s not to say that didn’t happen before, but its certainly gotten FAR worse.
Add in the compression with people just wanting to end the game ASAP and escape the up-tier they are in and people just trying to power grind jets and not realizing that a lot of skills you learn in props transfer to jets.
And don’t even start me on the canc… I mean “content creators” that promote stupid gameplay.
The fact that I was taking breaks because I loathe early jets. Especially since G-suits are the last thing unlocked, and going 3° downwards is enough to cause a blackout (exaggeration).
That mentality is only made worse because you can’t take your time to position yourself to get a kill. You need to be aggressive, and you need to be the first one there in order to get lots of kills from what I’ve seen.