Top Teir USA is not that bad. (11/6/24) Making my own data chart will share by (11/12/24)

[Panther2995]

@P1tZO

the WAR kit getting its appropriate protection values is one thing

War Kit will still not protect against half of the top tier shells which in this case it will make pretty much irrevelant.

Now im not against fixing Ariete’s, in fact Gaijin should fix every problem on Ariete’s so Italian mains can finally see how trash Ariete’s design is.

@P1tZO

and how is that not true for your case?

Tell me what do you know about Type-90’s/10’s? You’re just looking at protection analysis and saying ‘‘yeah these tanks are not worth it’’, by talking without experience will only get you so far.

Either use and gain experience with them or dont make empty talks about vehicles you dont play.

[サラトガ]

But italy player made up for it with pure skill , rarely see any minor nation complain about their vehicle of chocie. Only US with the largest complainer on here with post after post about M1 being le bad. Still waiting for minor nation to get better SPAA btw

[RavenGuardMarine]

Where is 10.7 top tier?

[Panther2995]

@艦むす愛好家

If you showing this you shouldn’t be yapping on here about how bad or good the tank is. This is peak desperation. Showing this mean you are out of position , nothing much to add about

Yeah im pretty sure enemy will ignore that giant weakspot and focus on your upper plate or your turret face.

Do you hear yourself how much you sound funny? I guess not.

[Panther2995]

@Axzuel

I hear that even if the Ariete gets its proper WAR kit, it still won’t have enough turret protection against modern rounds like DM53/M829A2.

It will not, at best it will protect against 3BM60 at most.

[Axzuel]

1. Strv 122B+ (Has side protection which can be useful against autocannons and CE)
2. Strv 122B PLSS/122A (Has a higher frontal protection for some reason)
3. Leopard 2a7v
4. T-90M/T-80BVM (Small profile + armoured front)
5. M1A2 (Ricocheting UFP, and good turret armour)

[サラトガ]

Understandable but i would put 2A7 and STRV in the same rank cause they are kinda the same but fair

[Axzuel]

The Strv 122’s have a higher hull protection. It doesn’t matter too much but its still higher. The Leopard 2PSO should be higher than the T-90M/T-80BVM but for some reason Gaijin made its UFP non-ricocheting even though it has the same UFP has the 2a7v, Strv 122.

[Panther2995]

@艦むす愛好家

Yeah cause im talking with a litearlly clown, considering he painting himself in every bad scenario ever to make the tank look bad, literally put any tank in said position and they will die faster than the M1

Seems like your intelligence became insufficent so you decided to use insults.

@艦むす愛好家

literally put any tank in said position and they will die faster than the M1

Since thread is about Abrams there is no point of discussing worse tanks.

However if you wish to discuss how bad ‘‘ariete’’ is create a thread and keep continue in there.

[P1tZO]

@Panther2995

Either use and gain experience with them or dont make empty talks about vehicles you dont play.

not everyone has enough time to play every tree. I face them quite often with the type 90 fuji sale going on

[Panther2995]

@P1tZO

not everyone has enough time to play every tree. I face them quite often with the type 90 fuji sale going on

Which only gives you half of the perspective, without playing with them you will never get the full picture.

As i’ve said dont talk about things you dont experience from first hands, both Type-90’s and Type-10’s are amazing tanks despite their inaccuaricies.

[RavenGuardMarine]

It deflects it into the turret ring on basically all models except the base m1 if memory serves correctly.

Then, outside of quite literally the bounce zone(which might also still kill you from a deflection into the turret ring) the entire hull is a free kill. Unless you were going fast enough to slide into cover once disabled.

It’s not a leo2 with spall liners or composite fronts. or a T series with ERA that eats the round so it can’t bounce.

This is pretty common for the rest of the tanks that don’t have this.

I don’t get why all you people get so hung up on only ever comparing Abrams to USSR tanks.

@MotorolaCRO

Also, do you realize you just said: “Just aim at the parts that you can penetrate consistently” but in different words, basically proving my point.

Which is the entire hull except the(but might include the, based on deflections into the turret ring) bounce zone lol.

[P1tZO]

@Panther2995

Which only gives you half of the perspective, without playing with them you will never get the full picture.

so you’re telling me facing them and shooting at them at various parts of their armor is not representative of anything? sure bro

[Panther2995]

@P1tZO

so you’re telling me facing them and shooting at them at various parts of their armor is not representative of anything? sure bro

Please explain to me how many times did you face Type-90’s in those vehicles and gained quite experience against them?

Also please explain to me how playing against a vehicle will give you full picture about its true capabilities, little note: you cant.

Only tank you have that can easily penetrate Type-90’s is the MBT2000 with DTC10-125 shell(btw considering you have only one match in that tank you most certainly dont have that shell), and even then Type-90 will still beat you with its mobility and reload time.

Its safe to say that you have no idea what you’re talking about.

[P1tZO]

@Panther2995

Please explain to me how many times did you face Type-90’s in those vehicles and gained quite experience against them?

so we’re gonna ignore that a pack sale just happened and gave everyone and their mother a type 90?
good work pulling up stats

@Panther2995

Also please explain to me how playing against a vehicle will give you full picture about its true capabilities, little note: you cant.

if anything it will give me most of the picture if we’re talking about armor

@Panther2995

Only tank you have that can easily penetrate Type-90’s is the MBT2000 with DTC10-125 shell(btw considering you have only one match in that tank you most certainly dont have that shell), and even then Type-90 will still beat you with its mobility and reload time.

so weakspots dont exist now?

[Panther2995]

@P1tZO

so we’re gonna ignore that a pack sale just happened and gave everyone and their mother a type 90?
good work pulling up stats

Nobody is ignoring anything but one thing for sure you have zero experience when it comes talking about Type-90’s.

@P1tZO

if anything it will give me most of the picture if we’re talking about armor

Yeah and Type-90’s armor is immune to your poor Chally2 and to your stock MBT2000.

@P1tZO

so weakspots dont exist now?

In that case armor doesnt matter on any tanks, safe to say we can put Strv-122 and Challenger 2 into same place due to both having weakspots right?

As you can see your logic is completely faulty.

[MotorolaCRO]

@Panther2995

I guess giant lower frontal plate doesnt exist huh?

Giant LFP that has two external fuel tanks behind it, just waiting to absorb shots. You still ignore the fact M1’s UFP will bounce shots.

@Panther2995

Please show us where i claimed Abrams has paperthin armor, im waiting.

Claiming that M1’s hull is a free kill literally means armor is paper thin and can’t stop common rounds thrown at it.

@Panther2995

Stop trying to put my words into my word while bein two faced devil advocate

Admitting that you were wrong isn’t that hard buddy, at least for people that aren’t pretending they are know-it-alls.
You claiming that M1’s UFP bouncing shots is nothing more than a “cherrypicked spot” is really wild, considering most of the UFP will do just that. It’s weird that dude with 30k+ battles doesn’t know that, or just pretend he doesn’t.

I think you’re the devil’s advocate in this discussion lol.

@Panther2995

Oh do they? too bad their giant lower frontal plate and giant turret wing weakness makes it pretty much irrevelant, unlike T80BVM/90M or Leopard2A7V-Strv122 series.

I think it’s safe to say hitting M1 in the hull isn’t a free kill and that you need to aim in order to disable them. You also seem to not know what decent means, or just pretend you don’t know like many things above just to suit your agenda.

T-tanks and Leopards might have better armor, but you somehow forgot about all other tanks at that BR, just look at Arietes, Merkavas, Challengers, Leclercs, etc.
It’s safe to say M1s have decent armor, claiming otherwise is just arguing in bad faith.

[MotorolaCRO]

@RavenGuardMarine

It deflects it into the turret ring on basically all models except the base m1 if memory serves correctly.

Large parts of UFP will bounce shots and won’t deflect it into the turret ring, you can test it yourself on that shooting range map.

@RavenGuardMarine

Then, outside of quite literally the bounce zone(which might also still kill you from a deflection into the turret ring) the entire hull is a free kill.

No it isn’t.
Large external fuel tanks in the front can and will eat shots, so if you want to be safe you’ll always aim at the center of LFP.

[P1tZO]

@Panther2995

Nobody is ignoring anything but one thing for sure you have zero experience when it comes talking about Type-90’s.

I have all the experience I need considering you just showed me i have 100 matches in 2 nations in that tier where i might face the type 90

@Panther2995

Yeah and Type-90’s armor is immune to your poor Chally2 and to your stock MBT2000.

P1tZO:

chally

mbt2k

@Panther2995

In that case armor doesnt matter on any tanks, safe to say we can put Strv-122 and Challenger 2 into same place due to both having weakspots right?

they are at the same place tho. look at their brs

[Panther2995]

@MotorolaCRO

Giant LFP that has two external fuel tanks behind it, just waiting to absorb shots. You still ignore the fact M1’s UFP will bounce shots.

Why would i shoot through fuel tanks when i can just aim to middle? Also fuel tanks doesnt stop incoming rounds hundred percent time which makes your claim pretty much irrevelant.

@MotorolaCRO

Claiming that M1’s hull is a free kill literally means armor is paper thin and can’t stop common rounds thrown at it.

Panther2995:

Claiming free kill? I see you’re still lying and putting my words into my mouth, i stated that its not hard to one shot Abrams through hull shots, gotta give it to you tho you’re quite good with playing words.

@MotorolaCRO

Admitting that you were wrong isn’t that hard buddy, at least for people that aren’t pretending they are know-it-alls.
You claiming that M1’s UFP bouncing shots is nothing more than a “cherrypicked spot” is really wild

I dont see any bounce on that angle like you claimed, seems to me your claim is quite cherrypicked.

@MotorolaCRO

I think you’re the devil’s advocate in this discussion lol.

I suggest stop looking into mirror, lol.

@MotorolaCRO

I think it’s safe to say hitting M1 in the hull isn’t a free kill

Picture above proves otherwise.

@MotorolaCRO

You also seem to not know what decent means, or just pretend you don’t know like many things above just to suit your agenda.

As i’ve said before decent doesnt mean anything when your weakspots are as big as moon and can be easily exploited by enemy players, this is like saying ‘‘hey shoot me here so i can bounce of your shell and claim that my armor is decent’’.

@MotorolaCRO

T-tanks and Leopards might have better armor, but you somehow forgot about all other tanks at that BR

I dont but this discussion is about Abrams and im tired that people like you who always loves to bring other tanks into Abrams discussion.

If you wish to discuss how bad other tanks are use proper threads for that.

All i see derailing the main object and purposely devil advocating from you, if you got nothing else dont derail this discussion further.