The Leclerc is in dire need of a buff

Machinery of War Discussion Ground Vehicle
6258

eh their SPAA after the patch which introduced multiple vehicle SPAAs fell off a cliff in effectiveness.
Though teh new pantsir is pretty decent at shooting down munitions I personally haven’t seen it do enough to say it’s OP outside of the aformentioned point on munitions.

The CAS though as well as the malarkey with the BMPTs is just a pain.
the BMD I’ve struggled with but the BMPT is just a pain in the butt. Which is not a skill issue as some say they genuinely just do not take damage, fired a DCT 10 clean through ones engine deck earlier and the engine stopped the whole round.
A 125MM top tier dart.

Those same thing happen with overlapping layers or shot traps on other MBTs, ERA on nato tanks while nowhere near as effective still causes some weird Sh*t to happen every now n then.

How do you mean disappeared? the russian MBTs it goes two ways either the tank turns into a spacecraft or the round passes under the auto loader, if you hit it and it hits modules then it’s not disappearing.

The main killer for russian MBTs has and always will be reload rate + mobility issues.
The BVM is more mobile than the 90M for example but still has a 6.4 second reload, the 90M has armour but no mobility especially backwards + a 7 second reload.

I would prefer my leclercs without these poorly implemented turret baskets.

1 Like
6259

Leclerc and Challenger 2 are still my best top tier tanks.

1 Like
6260

Let me rephrase that “The main killer for Russian MBTs has always been somehow not killing the other guy with the first shot despite being completely armored while the other guy is either half or completely naked”

Yeah buddy, if you somehow don’t kill the other guy even though you only have to click on basically anywhere on him while he has to aim for your tiny lower plate (and still not being sure you won’t survive the ammorack one way or the other), that sounds more like a skill issue than a reload issue lmao

8 Likes
6262

I’m sorry what?

again if you think 1 that russian tanks have a “tiny” lower plate it shows, also as do your stats lol. you’re nearly 2.0KD in every nato vehicle at rank 7 and up but negative in every russian one? , well the french ones you’ve used.

It makes zero sense at all, to act as if they’re some OP nonsense then be bad with them.

The russian MBTs reload, mobility and survivability is beyond horrific.

6263

I ain’t too good with the CR2s but the leclercs are nice to use tbh, not got either spaded yet right enough
got the S1 and S2

1 Like
6264

You can’t understand how my Russian vehicles, which have not all the modifications, and for many, not even APFSDS unlocked, have worse performances that my Aced vehicles ?

Truly, Russia players are something else.

6265

Russia players are something else? You pay pretty much exclusively France, I’ve almost every tree at top tier now.
I’ve thousands of top tier battles spread throughout the trees.

How can you not understand that if Russian vehicles are so over powered that your own stats would reflect that, with or without being spaded and aced.

That’s a copout argument from someone who’s own performance contradicts what they want to paint.
The Leclercs didn’t need the turret basket addition before getting correct armour implementations, but they are in fact better vehicles than the Russian MBTs.

6266

You play VBCI/AMX-32/AMX-10RC, you get easy nukes.

You play Leclercs, it’s horror, and you’re actually lucky if you get 5 wins in a row against Russia (it never happens).

Tells you how nerfed NATO vehicles are at top tier, and how dominant Russia is there.

2 Likes
6267

I’ve been doing quite alright in my ariete, and VRCC which is a 9.7 light at top tier.

the Leclercs turret basket addons were a bit of a bad move, but overall they’re strong as hell tanks, teh dude I was responding to above has most his KD from them , go check his stats out with em.

6268

I’ve been doing quite alright in my ariete

vs

“I’m never dying in my BVM, and win every single game”.

It’s all about relative performance. Russian players simply don’t sweat at top tier, compared to NATO.

6269

I die quite a lot in my BVM and I’ve not got a great winrate with it lol
That statement just shows how little you either know about top tier in general or specifically how to play at top tier.

They do in their tanks, the issue is their CAS is nice and strong, not that france with teh rafale and Hammers is lacking mind you.

1 Like
6270

Russian MBTs favour lower skilled players.

Higher skilled players prefer NATO MBTs because they offer more than just armour.

No wonder the average player is struggling playing NATO vehicles at top tier.

But the main reason Russia has been curb stomping (especially at the moment) is because of the BMPT, the Pantsirs, their helis, and their Su-30s.

Their MBTs aren’t carrying them – especially not the T-80BVM and T-90M.

3 Likes
6271

Remove that BMPT and there would be half as much CAS on the field due ot how easily it is to open teh door to a SU30 or some sht like that.

It’s ridiculous this thing,.

2 Likes
6272

Well even if the BMPT gets removed, the free 12.0 Pantsir and the Iron Dome Pantsir SM-SV is enough to let most Su-30s and Mi-28NMs have air supremacy over the battlefield unless you mean that the initial number of players able to spawn CAS would get cut in half due to the higher difficulty of getting them in the T-90M / T-80BVM.

1 Like
6273

Aye but there would be less of them is my point.

2 Likes
6274

What do Leclercs have to offer, except bad mobility because it’s too fat, no armor, and a quick reload rate useless because you don’t play mbts in close quarters ?

6275

Leclercs have turret cheek armour that can withstand ~570mm of penetration (not great but not unusable), the only NATO MBT (besides the Merkava) that doesn’t have a prominent NATO Hump (it can shoot behind itself), has quite good reverse speed and general acceleration, good 5s reload, and decent gun depression (not great but not bad).

The Leclercs should be 12.3 in all honesty, just like the 2A6 and 2A5.
The T-80BVM and T-90M could well as be 12.3 too, along with the Black Night and Chally 2E.

4 Likes
6276

Wow man it has a strong turret cheek!

Most likely will bounce 99% of the shots on its hull.

Bad acceleration, it’s actually more or less the same than russian MBTs, it’s fat. The hump thing is good yes, the gun depression is bad. The 5sec reload is basically the same than the 6.4 of russian mbts, can’t even see the difference in long range battles.

It should be 12 or 12.3, and the bvm/90m should definetely NOT be at 12/12.3. lmao.

6277

It’s not completely unusable, unlike the Ariete’s:


Even if they do penetrate (like if you were not facing them), the chance that it penetrates and ammo racks you is quite low (unless they’re shooting ~610mm+ rounds).

The hull is only able to tank ~550mm for a small slither of it – not a good hull to be fair.
image

You can sometimes ricochet shots with the UFP if you use your gun depression, though I wouldn’t really rely on it:

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The acceleration is actually above average…especially for top tier. Have you played the Black Night, Strv 122B+, Sep V2, or 2A7V?

The T-80BVM is quite good in terms of acceleration too, so ‘more or less the same than russian MBTs’ (I assume you mean T-80BVM here and not the T-90M) is a compliment if anything.

-10 is great. -9 is also good. -8 is pushing it (which is what the Leclerc has), but there are plenty of other MBTs with worse gun depression:
Type 10 / TKX has -7 (though tbf they can use suspension controls to make it ~-12)
Merkava Mk.4 has -7
T-80BVM has -5
T-90M has -6
ZTZ99A has -5
Oplot has a whopping -4!

Leclerc is not doing too badly in this department. Not at all…

No… 5s is a lot more usable than 6.4s.
Maybe it’s not as noticeable at long ranges but definitely in CQC (which is what most maps are, especially around capture points).

12.0 may be pushing it but I could possibly agree.
I think it receiving a better dart and staying at 12.7 or moving down at 12.3 would be better.

12.0 no, but I could definitely see them being 12.3, like with the 2A5s and 2A6s.

And like I said before,

image

I used to be in your shoes and I used to think the Abrams was really bad compared to the T-80s / T-90s because they could shoot (relatively) anywhere while I couldn’t.

But the more I played (especially with other countries) I started realising that armour (while important) is not the only thing that makes a vehicle good. Reverse speed, reload, and gun depression is really useful as well.

If I had to choose between having armour or reverse speed, reload, and gun depression, I’d now take the latter, but being able to choose both would be great.
The Leopard 2A7V / Strv 122s have all those aspects, and it’s why they’re considered some of the best MBTs currently in-game.

If you want, I could try showing you some tips and tricks that helped me

5 Likes
6278

It really couldn’t unless they remove the spall liners the T-90M should not be seeing 11.3 tanks.