I’ve recently had an F2H-2 game where I was the last one standing. By flying in such a way that forced my enemies to either head-on collide with each other, shoot their friendlies or break off - I could survive significantly longer than if you could blindly spray and pray through your friendlies. I still lost - I’m nowhere good enough to turn that kinds of odds around - but I managed to score one more kill, and since RP rewards are based on time spent alive: delaying the inevitable meant I received more RP. Over all, there was a near-collission, a collission leading to a spin and a teamkill.
Spoiler
Moments before disaster
Me262 survived, spitfire spun out. It eventually crashed, netting a 4th kill from having been damaged beforehand
Me 262 then almost gets on my six and…
You cannot do this kind of defensive flying if your enemies can just spray blindly at each other and not worry about collisions.
Conversely, I’ve had games where I had a shot on an enemy’s six and then my greedy teammates shot me out of the air, saving that guy. This is a good thing - you should not be allowed to have multiple people spraying blindly at a target from its six - there’s very little counter play to that and it is not realistic either.
ARB has been arcadified enough. Please don’t arcadify it even further, it still has moments it can be enjoyed for now.
Yet again team-killed in my F84F by a competing bomber - this time by player alxalxalxalx. This happens all the time and it’s not only a sad reflection of every a-hole that does it but a continuing point of widespread frustration which Gaijin isn’t contending with. Kind of outrageous.
Got killed by 2 squadded players - no provocation upfront, no kill steal, nothing.
At 08:35 i was shot down by this pathetic existence - after i dodged the friendly fire of his boyfriend. As i saw earlier that they were part of a 3 men squad and the 2 attacking boys had way too much energy it made no sense to defend myself.
Even in the unlikely case that i would have been able to shoot down one or two - latest the 3rd would have killed me.
isnt team killing such a nice gameplay feature of air realistic? its a feature, because gaijin added it. it can be done.
so why are you getting punished for doing it? gaijin literally can fire half of their support staff, and not deal with team kill support tickets, if they leave out this feature.
but no. they added team damage. thus, its a feature in the game, and people are free to use it.
does it make sense that the developer adds a feature, just to punish people?
gaijin, in what world does that make sense? why add a feature, just so you can punish people?
because that is this reality. team damage is open to abuse. it will be abused. because players are jerks. you add a feature thats open to abuse. you know you can stop that abuse by removing it.
why not removing it? it doesnt make sense why you keep in a feature just so you can punish people. you are the developer. we arnt talking about speeding cars. you arnt a government body. you cant set a speed limit. or tell manufacturers to built in speed limiters. but you can stop team kill abuse in this game, because you are its developer.
so stop team kill abuse. grow that brain of yours. just 1 IQ more is neccesary to step out of your handicapped position, and to become a normal, functioning, human being that is able to see, that team damage is nothing but a redundant feature.
Do you want trains of people all shooting and spraying down-range on some guy’s six without care or regard in the world?
Do you want people slinging missiles without worry about whose IR/radar signature it locks onto or god forbid, changes target?
Do you want people to happily head-on some poor sod without having to worry about shooting a friendly on that bandit’s six?
Do you want to turn air realistic even more into air arcade where flying in a stupid furball has no consequences or risk - in fact, it becomes the optimal strategy as you have incredible firepower by combining into a power-ranger and sending all your lead/missiles as a singular blob of aircraft?
Yes, griefing is an issue. Yes, teamkilling is abusable.
You don’t fix that by removing it. You fix that by improving spawn zones or early-match immunities - but never completely disabling it.
Disable friendly-collissions and friendly fire within the first 2-3 minutes of the match. That should solve almost all the griefing problems. Idiots teamkilling over “Kill/base stealing” will still exist, but doing so will take far more effort.
For that, make the teamkill penalty/algorithm far harsher.
People who teamkill by accident due to furballing/trains will learn to stop doing that before the penalties kick in, and if they do have genuine accidents - they should be rare enough to not be picked up. If you teamkill intentionally (no enemy within X radius at time of kill, happened multiple times over Y period of matches and time), then get your account locked for 30 days from playing ARB/air sim.
Imho you mix up support (other website) where you actually create a ticket and the dead letter boxes of in-game reporting of team killers. Even if you use the server replay site for reporting (for everything not chat related) we have enough evidence in this thread that gaijin manages team kills exclusively via an automated system.
The Game Masters admit that they don’t interfere with this system. You find a few posts above a guy with 150 team kills in a few days / weeks. Besides that: Firing GMs make no sense as they are volunteers working for free…
Whilst i agree that some players are simply jerks and Ground RB works at least for pure tank on tank engagements without the friendly fire option i agree with other opinions that friendly fire and damage is somehow realistic.
Nevertheless i support this and other suggestions if they look good enough to minimize the overall problem.
Imho the sole reason why gaijin stopped last year their practice that you had to pay your own repair cost in case you got team killed was that it looked very suspicious regarding certain consumer laws that you could lose real money (like if you bought SL for GE) due to that.
The points you mentioned before are already in place. Reckless shooting / spamming missiles etc. happens today. The situations you described happens simply because there is no effective deterrence in place.
Without an effective deterrence workarounds like disabling friendly fire for a limited time or when no enemy is near are suited to reduce the number of team kills - but it is just scratching the surface of the problem:
Gajin is not interested in fixing the team killing problem - as from their pov there is no problem; otherwise they would have fixed it years ago. Either with a smart technical solution or with really hard punishments which would be so severe that nobody would risk his account.
Very hard and immediate sanctions to avoid team killing has zero economic benefit for gaijin as even teamkillers spend money. The team kill victims have besides some few boosters paid with GE no losses - that’s why gaijin denies any issues.
They look like the guys from youtube: Uploading of copyright protected movies (even Deadpool 3, watched it 3 times on yt) is forbidden, but it creates traffic and generates add income; they just delete the uploads after some time, channels still exist even if they uploaded multiple times those movies…
The game in itself is just representing humans / society as a whole, that’s why you have cheaters and fully intended team killing / griefing in the game.
If you remember the guy able to kill whole lobbies (his own team by kicking them out and the enemy team with a cheat (16 vs 16 in jet Air RB) you might get my point.
Linking the vid would give me a forum ban, but you can go to yt and lookfor the key words “invisible”, (banned) and (246). Even if they closed this gap i still have every few weeks strange matches in which i get kicked out multiple times…
I mean they turned it off in GRB cause of the amount of griefing going on, why not for ARB , its ludicrous at this point, half the time its either some goon base chasing or some absolute clown just ragging on the team.
had a guy spawn a Tu4 on the runway a month or so ago and spray down the whole ass runway.
or some clown launching 6 amraams for example, those 6 missiles dont just vanish and if launched at around the same time slaps about 4 people at least.
Team killers with more than 3 kills in the past month should get a red nametag in battle and their team kill count should be displayed so everyone knows this player is an enemy.
This penalty should last for 6 months.
Having the red nametag will reward anyone on your team with 50GE and 10,000SL for killing you.
Sorry, I somehow missed this thread.
I was trying to get a read on how the community feels about TK’ing a TK’er keeping in mind not all TK’s are intentional.
That is too harsh, and you shouldn’t reward players for teamkilling too.
Gotta love it when I TK a friendly in sim, then end up with a couple others through other means, leading to me being forced to not play WT for 6 months!!!
Imho the proposed punishment looks quite reasonable for prop Air RB.
The problem is that at least as long as gaijin is unable to solve the teamkilling by ramming issue (you got rammed unintended or on purpose and you are blamed as team killer if the rammer crashes) the proposal would simply offer the possibility for the usual suspects to troll even more; all they have to do is to crash into your plane.
Air SB needs special rules, same as jet BRs in “Missile Thunder” - at least as long as missiles tend to go rogue and have their own opinions where to go. If you lock on a friendly on purpose: See point #1.
But the devs won’t change anything. Otherwise they would have solved this issue years ago.
Teamkilling in sim battles should be handled differently, but in air rb and ground rb team killing is more easily defined as malicious as the nametags make it clear that they are your ally.
Obviously the system should record the gameplay each time you team kill and after 3 the recordings will be sent to a human for review.
If all 3 team kills are marked as non accidental then the punishment shall ensue. For instance a stinger or AAM deciding it wanted to target an ally would not qualify, but shooting down 3 allied planes after takeoff would.
if a player is going to squad up with his buddies and bring in a team of biplanes then im going to shoot them down. It shouldn’t be allowed but it is the same to say teamkilling is against the rules but we can still do it.
Friendly fire was a problem in GRB all those years ago and it got removed. If it is that much of a problem in air battles then it can also be removed.
