Idk - but the main hurdle for any suggestion is to get an upfront approval by gaijin (so that it can be presented within the forum).
So there is, ofc, the possibility that something similar was proposed several times in the past - but never presented in the forum.
The biggest hurdle I see are the players who like to take the law into their own hands for whatever reason and want to prevent such a system.
I am not sure about that.
So without reliable data (how many team kills happen in total and at which BRs) it is actually very hard to come to the right conclusions.
Even without data i would guess that the majority of team kills were committed by 12-16 year old kids either based on missing experience, frustration or plain stupid / reckless behaviour.
From my perspective the easiest way to get rid of 70-90% of team kills in Air RB would be to disable friendly fire (or no damage output but depletion of ammo) within the first 60-120 seconds of each game.
And then a severe punishment like proposed above.
Imho gaijin is simply not consistent - they claim that friendly fire is part of their understanding of reality (=realism) - but they simply forget that this “realism” needs to be accompanied by consequences as irl friendly fire in aerial combat is/was rather rare (so statistically insignificant) and led to consequences - but team kills in wt have no consequences…
Your description of reckless team mates bombing no matter if friendlies are near or not is imho the direct result of missing consequences.
I don’t know if anyone has ever said that to you before … you have a really pleasant way of presenting your views in an understandable way. I just had to get rid of it. o7
I am very, very surprised to found out that the auto-banning/kicking system has such low performance. Maybe there is some technical difficulties in terms of determining tk behavior in the middle of a dogfight, but it shall be very clear that team killing in the first 3 minute of the game, close to the airport, is absolutely on purpose. I have been, and noticed dozens of team killing right after takeoff in top tire RB battles. If the closest enemy plane is still 70km away and you can’t even see them on radars, then there shall be absolutely no reason for one to use their misses at such range… At least a new mechanism shall be put in place:
You find a list of GMs here:
https://forum.warthunder.com/u?asc=true&group=Game%20Masters&order=username&period=all
As written earlier in this thread:
Your description of the team kill experience of your friend looks like griefing. So go to the server replay site and search for the match, then perform a report for griefing.
I like your ideas in general.
But the game has way too many flaws to justify an immediate account ban. I still see team kills via ramming - and the guy who got rammed is blamed as a team killer. Following your logic he would be out…
Some story for losing a plane or reduction of RP.
You might scare some (base bombing) griefers, but guys team killing out of frustration or team kill to prevent others to get ahead on the leader board don’t care about RP, same as guys acting as Judge Dredd…
Thanks for the info!
I think in the end of the day, and auto countermeasures could only deal with 50% of the situation… Many other method of team killing, such as ramming, is nearly impossible to be identified by bots. In most cases, they have to be checked by the game master or by gaijin staffs. Unfortunately it seems like game master has no power to take action on it (as they are more as volunteers then officials) and gaijin doesn’t really consider the team killing business as a “urgent” issue. It is very surprised that a similar “close to airport=autokick” idea exist on the old forum in 2018, and six years later nothing is implemented…
I will say the key is to separate the whole team killer group into smaller fragments and deal with one at a time, it’s always better to have less team killers, so first we deal with the base bombing team killing and pure griefers (near takeoff time team killing), then manually focusing on leader board stuff, which is much more of a headache as manual ban by GM/staff is the only option. The key here is first try to stop those that can be easily stopped with a few line of codes, then focus on the hard part. Afterall, having 10 troll focusing teamkilling for fun is still better then having not only 10 troll but also another 90 base bombing teamkillers as well. The lesser the better.
Thanks for your dedication on the whole issue. It is nice to have someone continue to monitor and discuss an issue.
A new team killing thread:
Alright. I got a question for anyone who reads this.
In a match earlier I accidently descended upon a friendly jet. It was very smooth and it didn’t damage me, and I don’t think it damaged my teammate. Anyways, it was only bc I was typing in chat so I was focused on that and did not realize there was a guy under me. Anyways, when I accidently bumped him I quickly through myself off of him and apologized. Anyways, he proceeded to shot me down with a missile after I apologized.
Do y’all think that was called for? Was I in the wrong for that?
Well you apologized and he probably interpreted it as “intentional”. Be more aware next time. TK isn’t justifiable in any aspect.
FYI - In this replay:
https://warthunder.com/en/tournament/replay/227978818285659448?public_key=UOWlwLc8M1wOUKRPSEy9
you can see me getting team killed (at 11:51) by the player: @MrColimba
Totally unproved - a clear team kill due to griefing - so the classic sc*m polluting Air RB lobbies on top of plain stupid team killers.
It would be great if you could use the replay site to report this sc*mbag - for griefing, as team killing reports are useless as we all know.
@OrsonES - i saw that you took action a while ago vs a guy who team killed a nuke carrier - that case and mine are identical, we were both killed by griefers; you might consider a similar handling. Thanks in advance!
Just remove the friendly damage in air rb, 90% of the games someone is tking someone.
I have discovered a dude who, in all of his battles for a period of a few days (I did not bother to look any further) did the following:
He did this battle after battle after battle. I looked at like 20+ replays and he just kept doing this. He even made a youtube video showing his technique.
Do you think this guy, responsible for killing dozens upon dozens of teammates, got banned? Nuh uh.
Because the automatic ban threshhold is extremely high, and most.of his kills were not even counted as kills at all.
As long as the current automatic system stays in place, people like that will have a field day.
There were several posts/threads about this teamkilling / ramming guy (described in the post above) in this forum, i watched the video on yt some time ago.
Do you think it is possible to perma ban such guys within the overall approach of gaijin regarding fair play? I mean botters and other cheaters got banned for ToS violations - and this guy is circumventing your auto-ban system, so also a clear violation of ToS…
Imho such guys are way more detrimental for the game as a kid with a 5$ bot script bombing bases in Air RB, so when botters get banned - why not such guys?
A short reply would be highly appreciated!
Was that guy’s name very close to Cpt. Obvious? :) because if not, then even better - we’ve got multiple aces decimating players.
How about having some kind of marker that planes can use to designate bombing area so that allies know to keep out…
Just killed two teammates over two matches after saying what cap point i was going to bomb
They just drove there like it was stroll in the park,so kills like these add up and i get ban because of zombies .
Another example of how team killing has an impact on the numbers game in Air RB.
In this replay:
https://warthunder.com/en/tournament/replay/236292565003275113?public_key=UOWlwLc8M1wOUKRPSEy9
…you see 2 Wyverns teamkilling 2 own players right after spawn. Together with the auto-kick after 2 teamkills my team lost 6 (!!!) aircraft out of 16.
Just by chance my team managed to win as 3 of our team scored 3 kills and the last enemy traded (despite he had a irrecoverable ticket lead) in a totally unnecessary headon after ~ 20 minutes…
When is gaijin ready to punish such behaviour so hard that there is a feared and actually functioning deterrence in place???
Edit:
The 2 Wyvern were squadded and spawned at airfield - based on their behaviour this “team kill session” was planned. Both are lousy players and “Knights of the Order of clueless Premiumplayers” - based on the amount of premium planes both players have bought a 60 or 90 days ban for fully intended team killing would have prevented this…
Often questioned this in the past…
I’m sure it can easily be coded a lot better, and not need to disable the friendly fire as that makes it more gamey.
Like in Arcade… You don’t actually cause damage yet the message comes up that you’ll be kicked back to hangar…
Just needs to be thoughtfully planned out and encompassing of some of the more stupid ways these guys are doing what they are doing.