Su-30SM Nerfed

[An_Pigeon]

@GALWAYLION

The best thing the Grippen gets is the ability to turn real well, and has over six hundred flares to annoy people with. Granted it means absolutely nothing when you get slammed by five AIM 120s.

Genuinely the gripen, since it loses a lot of speed, plague of a delta, and its acceleration got nerfed ages ago, it struggles IMO at top tier in pubs, (not saying it should go down BTW not one of thoes gripen suffers folks). However, it really had its 15 minutes of fame and got shelved rapid style, the F16C will out do a gripen in practice as it carries more missiles, has a better radar as far as im aware and can retain its speed far, far better.

@GALWAYLION

because you’re focused on that one guy, you can use your manoeuvrability and flares to your advantage because it’s just you and him. Simple as.

exactly my point, ive beaten F16A’s with the mirage 2000C S4 but thats purely due to the fact I had the drop on them and out played them with positioning, IF that was in a 1v1 situation, theres no chance ill beat the guy if he plays it for energy.

@GALWAYLION

However, I can see why they cried: they enjoy seal clubbing.

Genuinely man the A10s and su25s are already slow at their Brs, the evev 9.3s can hit mach one which neither of them can, so the slow argument is out the window.

They literally folded what, 4 Br brackets? 10.0 > 9.3/9.0> 8.3 > 8.0 > 7.0 roughly 4 brackets stomped down cause idiots buy them. Hell the su25 was introduced at 9.7 xD

@GALWAYLION

Yeah, we still have the OTOMATIC at 11.7 for some odd reason, despite it being one of the worst SPAAs (I enjoy it for close ranges with proxies, but not everyone is “smart” enough to strafe run in the open. Most players prefer hurling AGMs from the neighbouring galaxy).

Genuinely no idea why the otomatic is the BR it is, not even as if ti can be used as a TD as it gets a whole ass twelve darts xD I want it for the fun of it as i find it incredibly unique but it is a 10.3 spaa at best. (considering we have the oso at that BR).

@_Renzo

My point was mainly that it’s the good players that say that the Gripen dominated for quite a while, meanwhile the mid players say it didn’t dominate.

You did not say that, at all.
You said the gripen still is dominant due to how it works in the tournaments against the F16C
Which i already pointed out, that pre nerf the gripen was a baby plane UFO as well as stomped literally everything. Post nerf it genuinely struggles with an F16C that is played right due to the acceleration, or lack thereof.

@_Renzo

I mean, stats is an easy answer. Usually covers 70-80% of the question of “Is this a good player?” question.

depends for air most my planes are positive (F8U2 was my first 10.0 back in the day so dunno if it is)
But id generally say now adays the gripens got the short end of the stick, like I said, in a 14.0 match id much rather use my F15A over the Gripen, it just lacks the damn power to keep up, excusing the Rdarters (i have british grip) the actual plane itself just feels so sluggish compared to the other jets around it.

Lets not even touch the EF2000 sitting at 14.0 while the ice and such are 13.0 xD

@AlvisWisla

The Gripen is still a UFO

It isnt a UFO at all now adays man, it had good AoA but almost all deltas do, its acceleration leaves it sitting in a horrible position, unless someones stupid enough to try and turn fight you, which as we stated above many times, it still is good at.
That is it, it loses too much speed for how much it ragains to be effective in most situations outwith a 1v1.

The fact I can beat gripens with the 16AJ now adays, speaks volumes about how its FM is significantly under performing. (as per the countless bug reports that were mentioned further above it uses the wrong FM as well as has lower thrust than it should)

also when did you even last use the gripen? youve got 62 matches in it, ive nearly 300 in it, about 100 from when the damn ARH patch came. and have watched it change quite a lot since it released.

[Coldisthevoid]

this is incorrect they have an incorrect fuel weight as such they need to run less fuel in game than SU-27 footage shows for the same maneuver see the SU-27 hud footage vs the recreation in-game, this is likely because the su-27 uses ‘over fuel’ and ‘standard fuel’ and their just calculating the weight wrong because of it since half fuel could mean 50% full or 25% full depending if its standard or over

[AlvisWisla]

Right now Su-27s slightly out-perform F-15s, and Su-27SM even gives F-16C a loss streak.
I highly doubt Su-27s are Rafale equivalent as your posts are implying.

[GALWAYLION-live]

Leopards in general are dominant on ground. Personally not a fan of the Stridsvagn 122s because of the dreadful thermals (I personally use the CV120 over the Stridsvagn), but I digress. It’s all dependent on how you play. I would rather use the Hungarian Leopard 2A7, but that’s also because I can equip the Centauro 120 with it in a lineup.

[Coldisthevoid]

did some gamer ego check you in the su-27 or something? its FM is largely accurate to real life footage at airshows and hud footage its fuel weight is just incorrect which doesn’t exactly effect it until its low fuel already basically its full weight is correct but its empty weight isn’t

[AlvisWisla]

@GALWAYLION

Spoiler

Su-27 with 19.6 deg/s.

F-15A with same afterburner fuel time of 3.27 minutes: 18.8 deg/s.

Spoiler

[GALWAYLION-live]

I’m fully aware it is not that good in Pubs, but what makes it good is 1v1s, where most American players are so confident in their missile abusing strats, they forget one teeny thing: they’re within 5km, not really enough time to lock and spam multiple missiles.
Plus, I do unlimited fuel and ammo, which means I’m not running 20-30 minutes of fuel, afterburning my way to the front lines. Minimum fuel means maximum manoeuvrability. Something that BVR enjoyers cannot comprehend.
It honestly feels like I’m a final boss when I do 1v1s, just because my friends will be like, “noooo, not the Grippen” when they see the flags change to Sweden.

Although, I’m pretty sure the Su-25 came out with only dumbbombs and rockets when it first came out at 9.7, it didn’t have the funny AGMs that it now has. So honestly, that is understandable to why it was that low when the game’s max BR was like 10.0, although it certainly belongs around 11.0 now.

[Anonymous4245]

Why would you even use the AGMs on the Su-25 when the S-25O is way better

[An_Pigeon]

@GALWAYLION

I’m fully aware it is not that good in Pubs, but what makes it good is 1v1s, where most American players are so confident in their missile abusing strats, they forget one teeny thing: they’re within 5km, not really enough time to lock and spam multiple missiles.

Precisely man, like you said outwith the 1v1 area the gripen falls on its arse now adays, its still decent, but theres many, many planes that surpass it.

@GALWAYLION

Plus, I do unlimited fuel and ammo, which means I’m not running 20-30 minutes of fuel, afterburning my way to the front lines. Minimum fuel means maximum manoeuvrability. Something that BVR enjoyers cannot comprehend.
It honestly feels like I’m a final boss when I do 1v1s, just because my friends will be like, “noooo, not the Grippen” when they see the flags change to Sweden.

I got each of my planes figured out, to the point where i usually take about 16 mins of fuel and a tank, so for f16 i drop it about 10km away, and by the time the distance has closed im at an optimal fuel weight for both sustained fighting and dogfighting.
not like im arriving with 3 mins left and scared to afterburn.

Gripen the same idea just different fuel counts.

and if i cant take a fuel tank E.G for the F14A and IRIAF, i take about 44 minutes and burn it off so im at about 18 for when people are merging etc. a lot of folks cry planes cnat dogfight but then have like 30 mins fuel going into the merge xD

@GALWAYLION

Although, I’m pretty sure the Su-25 came out with only dumbbombs and rockets when it first came out at 9.7, it didn’t have the funny AGMs that it now has. So honestly, that is understandable to why it was that low when the game’s max BR was like 10.0, although it certainly belongs around 11.0 now.

yeah the S250s are nice af though to be fair.

@Anonymous4245

Why would you even use the AGMs on the Su-25 when the S-25O is way better

The 10.3 doesnt get the KH29Ts does it? only the damn laser guided ones?
Ive got the event su25 so ive got the big ol ATGMs with the S250s along side it

[GALWAYLION-live]

Because it’s funnier to slam someone with a missile from 5km away when they can’t do anything about it? CAS doesn’t require skill, but hey, might as well play with the least amount of skill if you want to smack someone. Work smarter, not harder.

[AlvisWisla]

@An_Pigeon

but theres many, many planes that surpass it.

Su-27SM, F-18 [barely], Rafale, and Typhoon… that’s not many, that’s 4.
Soon to be J-11B, but that’s 5.

[Anonymous4245]

No, only the upgraded Su-25s gets it

[Anonymous4245]

Using the Kh-25ML and Kh-29L is actually harder with the base Su-25 because Klen-PS is only a laser designator. Flinging S-25O with CCIP is more brain dead

[GALWAYLION-live]

Huh, I must be mistaken then. I’m probably thinking of the Su-25T then

[An_Pigeon]

last I checked the F15A, F16A, su27sm, rafale, typhoon, all beat the gripen now adays.
I think even the mirages beat them quite readily, hence why so many people use them in the dogfights.

The J10A also beats the gripen easily.

Whyd you leave out the F16A and F15A? as well as that, the F15C and 16C both beat the gripen in every single aspect bar AoA, which Again i stated, in teh current meta at top tier.

The 16C, 15C, 15E, Ef2000, Rafale, su27SM, J10 and mirage all beat the gripen to the punch.

[Anonymous4245]

Yeah thay’s why br for br, A-10A is actually better because it gets Mavs (so better stand off ranges) and iirc 2 double racks of 9Ls?

[An_Pigeon]

The TT A10 gets 4 x 9L yeah, however it is far slower than the Su25 (200kpmh)

but yeah teh A10 is also great due to the agms, and GBUs as well if u cant spawn with the mavs

[AlvisWisla]

F-15 gets its tail handed to it by Gripen, and Gripen still out-dogfights F-16A unless the F-16A gets fuel advantage.

[GALWAYLION-live]

Dealing with people who regurgitate the whole “Grippen OP” thing is a bit frustrating, since you know they are parroting what some obscure YouTuber (or TikToker) said. It reminds me when I talked bad about the Tor, and I was suddenly harassed by many about how I have a “skill issue” and that the Tor is “literally the second best SPAA after the Pantsir,” with their reasonings being… copy-pasted by the Wiki.
“You can literally lock onto two planes at once, bruh!” which is sound, except for the tiny problem of… you have to be in formation to get two locks. I don’t know about you, but no one flies in formation in Pubs… well, except for that weird guy who plays Nightcore music while rocketing people in a Ka-50 with his friend. You have probably seen the videos on Facebook or whatever.

Anyways, unfortunately we will always run into those people that will scream “skill issue” if we mention anything that goes against some personality’s opinion. The best part is when you look at their card, and they’ve never once played that plane/tank, much less ever played in that BR, but will still swear up and down YOU are the problem.

[An_Pigeon]

again, the F16A can maintain its energy far better than the gripen can, also those charts as far as i can see actually show that in the top line that the F16 can maintain the harder turn for longer than a gripen can.

the gripen trumps it in AoA sure, but as far as sustained dogfights got the 16A will beat a gripen almost every time.

@AlvisWisla

F-15 gets its tail handed to it by Gripen

Genuinely it does not at all, ive hundreds of games in both planes, the F15A does not get its “tail handed to it” by the gripen unless you try bounce into an instant turn fight, the F15A has far better thrust and sustained rates than the Gripen.

Thats like saying an F5C loses in a turn fight with a mig21, well yeah dont turn fight it.

Edit: as well I stated in the current meta, unless your trying to turn fight the gripen is objectively worse than every plane I listed bar the 16A and 15A due to the lack of ARH missiles.