Pantsir gets ridiculously fast missiles on a platform that’s leagues better than everyone else’s. That said, still outdated, we should be getting platforms to engage CAS 10-15km out, easily.
CAS shouldn’t get free lunches all day, they should have to work for every inch to get to the battlefield and drop their load on your face.
Literally play Russia, and see for yourself.
So much better that Pantsir is equally likely to kill a CAS aircraft as the other SPAA.
Equally likely as in it either will or won’t kill it, then sure it’s just as likely as any vehicle.
If you mean that it’s equally on par with its peers, then you’re delusional.
But I think the entire premise of SPAA in this game is silly. CAS should have to WORK to get to the battlefield, it shouldn’t be anywhere near so easy to even get tot eh battlefield in contested airspace.
You can’t fly high easily because SPAA should be able to lock and fire and put you defensive with missiles that actually pose a threat for quite a good deal of distance. If you fly low to avoid detection you’re subject to manpads. This game doesn’t model that and I think it’s silly, we have them around the airfields. They should be over the map too.
That’s my own opinion on the CAS matter but I know I’ll probably get 10 replies calling me a smooth brain and stupid because I expect a game that wants documents from manufacturers to change vehicles and alludes to being realistic, to model the challenges CAP and CAS would face on a battlefield. The work shouldn’t solely rely on SPAA since it’s located in a specific area and jets have a whole map to choose their routes.
The issue I see with Russian SPAA is that the Pantsir should have never been added. Gaijin themselves said they cant find any other SPAA that exists comparable to it in the real world, and knew that it is far more capable than any other SPAA; they knew, yet they added it anyway because the “Tunguska wasn’t preforming well enough”
The reason the Tunguska wasn’t preforming well enough was because people didn’t spawn in it, because they had heaps of aircraft that were far more capable to use, like the KA50 that is arguably better at AA than most SPAA too, or was at the time, and aircraft that could nuke tanks from orbit with KH-23’s. its not that the Tunguska was under preforming at all, its just that there were better choices.
So Gaijin added the Pantsir. Controversial at the time, and still controversial now, considering it out preforms all other SPAA in the game in both range and abilities. Again, Gaijin knew they couldn’t find anything to compare it to outside of Russia, but added it anyway and now other nations have nothing that is even remotely comparable to it, and its too late to just remove it.
No other SPAA works on the near undetectable K band radar, no other SPAA has 20km range, no other SPAA has predictive tracking ((except the TOR-M1 which is also Russian technically)) and thus, it shouldn’t have been added in the first place because its clearly unbalanced. but Gaijin didn’t care, and still don’t care. You get next to no reward for shooting down aircraft using SPAA, and the only team with great SPAA also have SOME of the best CAS jets in the game, while every other nation is left to suffer.
Yes I think Gaijin did this out of a clear bias towards the Russian team, because there’s no real other answer until someone can explain to me why it is better in every single aspect by a vast margin than any other SPAA in the game.
I understand Russian doctrine is different IRL, and I understand that the capabilities of it are correct, but if you are going to add something that is completely overpowered to a GAME, then you need to consider if it is the right choice; and if you add it despite knowing its overpowered compared to everything else, then that shows a level of clear bias or ignorance towards the complaints or concerns of the playerbase.
The Tunguska was doing great. It was AS good as the ADATS when it came to shooting down aircraft, and the Pantsir wasnt needed.
Just to clarify, I’m a ground user and hate aircraft, but if things are going to be balanced, everyone should be either as good at shooting the aircraft down, or just as bad at shooting them down. not one nation being at a huge advantage over the others. that’s called “Balance”
Gaijin is adding the Canadian Skink to the US Tech Tree as well. Sure it’s copy and paste but folks such as myself didn’t agree with it going to only the Brits. So it is nice to see it in both trees instead.
I’m fairly sure they nerfed the Tunguska a bit before they introduced the Pantsir too.
They did; but it didn’t need it, not one bit. They did it so they had an excuse to add it. ((a friend of mine mained Russia and claimed it was the best SPAA of its time, before the nerf. that nerf only lasted a month or so before they added the pantsir.))
But on that you don’t look at something and say “well everyone is preforming at say… 7/10, and this Tunguska is preforming at 8/10 - so we will nerf it to… 6/10… then to compensate for that, we will give them something that is 9/10, while everyone else has their 7/10’s” again, its just clear bias. they could have easily not nerfed it, or nerfed it to have the same performance as a NATO SPAA, until they find something that is equal in capability to add to each nation.
you dont look at the best currently available and be like “double it.” - the VT-1’s that some nations get are completely un-usable after a certain range, while the pantsir missiles arn’t (mostly due to predictive tracking, non detectable radar, and non visible missiles). and most radars are detectable, where the pantsir’s usually isn’t. its just… a clear bias.
if you are going to add a new vehicle, you make sure all nations have something near or comparable. if they dont, you artificially nerf it so it is on par to those things around it. - all SPAA should be as good as one another or as bad as one another, with no one standing out to have massive qualities over the others. That’s how balance works. if you ignore that, and give one nation something vastly better than others; thats called favouritism and bias.
The spikes take so long to get there tho :(((
The US has the best cas at basically every br. They also get great anti-cas fighters. In most cases, US gets planes that do both very well.
If any nation dominates the skies above ground rb, its the US
And Russian main said Sweden are broken OP when they got all these lol
all spaa are kinda weak if you are against a good pilot in f16c armed with agms or su25 with kh38s, also the missile lead thingy is kinda worthless on pantsir because what ends up happening is it leads significantly and when the booster runs out the missile turns into a semi brick that only responds to finer input so if the plane turns in a different direction you now have a missile that is massively far in one direction and doesnt have the energy to turn the opposite way and catch up on the new path, also if the target is low or diving straight down it usually slams into the ground
perhaps its more potent on the tor with its permanent booster where it always has energy to make significant course changes but on the pantsir its far more effective to direct fire since it can afford to travel a bit further distance in exchange for only needing to do fine adjuments if the enemy changes direction
well… with the new wonder round Russia suddenly got 3.0 (in a downtier) and up to… what? 6-7ish.
Ive allmost stopped playing at that BR because when the Yaks and Tis-mas comes rolling in, half my team goes bye bye.
But yet it still has that ability. you combine that with a radar that most aircraft cant detect, and a missile with no identifiable smoke trail, you end up with a something that you don’t know has been fired at you closing at rapid speed and tracking your movements. you cant dodge what you cant see; and when you spawn, if a pantsir can see you, because the range aircraft spawn in at, even a full g-lock turn sometimes cant help you avoid the missiles because of their speed.
Pantsirs are clearly straight up better than every other SPAA at most ranges (close, medium and long) but this doesn’t mean they’re unkillable, just very annoying and badly balanced when compared to others
I love the amount of hate in this post
pantsir should have been added in-game, maybe with these days’ updates with far better cas coming in every update, not in the past
pantsir missiles turns to a brick after 12km and any significant change in plane trajectory makes the missile miss, so why not lop gbus from that far ?
pantsir has 2 radar bands, 1 detectable by every nato rwr, the Search band and the radar lock using K band, the question is why not taking precautions when seeing that S1 on your rwr and instead fly in a straight line to death ??
pantsir uses IRST and you can’t detect it ??.. gaijin is merciful enough to not fix the famous bug in which you can’t lock in irst or radar without Search radar turned on (Every spaa)… so why do you still not go down when you see it on rwr ?
So yes, this entire thread is a bunch of skill issues who can’t deal with spaa
i have done enough tests against pantsir, whether with friends, or in battle. and guess what, i mostly die to enemy CAP or those IR carriers when doing a pass over battlefield, because their spaa is bad, whether it be pantsir/flarak/ADATS, they are trash
the only times i truly died to those types of spaa (Saclos/Beam-riding) is me doing a suicide run
Next step: China gets FK-1000
Because Soviets have SPAA that can much more easily shoot down AGMs
Wowzers, so short, I hope they fix this so that the Pantsir can kill people 4 times as far as other SAMs instead of only 2
but isn’t other spaa good for 9km and bad at that 10km mark ?
git gud