I had a battle just now by the way:
Oh yeah, I thought I’ve seen a similar face on forums, but I could be mistaken, now that I think about it…
Although…
Nope, can’t seem to tag the fellow here.
So, uh… I’ve tried to stick to the end, but the game didn’t gave me enough points to continue with the last vehicle.
So, fellow forumites - is this DL? Or something else?
Fundamentally: you shouldn’t, so fair cop. However, look at how other, real-world cases are handled. If you agreed to join a football match with someone, and then left the pitch because you got fed up, you wouldn’t be surprised if they were upset about being down a player, yes? Apply this situation to other team-based activities you know, like board games, RPGs, whatever. Sometimes it happens, and there are healthy ways to deal with the situation - you don’t force people at gun point to play it, obviously :P but when playing with other humans, it’s not solely about you. Therefore, 1DL is not as uncomplicated as you make it sound.
Yes, yes, I know: WT is a team game that is terrible at actually fostering team play, and motivating people to stay. I agree. And people that want “punitive” solutions are not looking for true solutions, just for catharsis, imho. But that doesn’t mean they are wrong being upset.
I try not to 1DL for that reason, but sometimes I still do, as my frustration occasionally gets the better of me. I know I shouldn’t, ideally.
That said, I don’t think it’s reasonable to expect any one solution to magically “fix” 1DL. Such as fixing economy costs, rewarding active play time more etc. These can reduce the frequency of 1DL, but not eliminate it, because ultimately there are a billion possible reasons to 1DL a game, some legitimate, some debatable, and some dumb. Addressing them all is simply physically impossible.
The structure of the game, with lineups etc, is what makes 1DL possible in principle, and of course at times this actually plays into Gaijin’s hands (lower queue times, shorter matches, the whole premium thing). Which is why it’s only lightly dicinsentivised and why if you want it to go away, you have to rethink the system of lineups and spawns.
When you join a competitive sports team the expectation that you play and participate in a certain manner are inherent. WT isn’t like that. There are no rules about how you play(beyond tking/griefing/exploiting, etc) that is why it is allowed to bring a BR 1 tank into 11.0.
You can play passively or aggressively, you can play for kills or caps… the player gets to choose how they play.
There should be a competitive game mode that doesn’t allow for 1DL. Then casual players can play normals and people who want to play more seriously can play competitive.
That should be the argument being made by the 1DL complainer crowd. Not trying to argue about how people should play.
If people were 1DL in a ranked/competitive game mode then all of these complaints would be valid as it would be accepted that of you’re in that game mode you’re supposed to play to win
All vehicles should get 2 spawns, premium or TT doesn’t matter, a reason to respawn your premium for RP, to respawn the TT to spade it, effectively doubles the amount of vehicles in a game to help with lineups etc.
There are some, at times self-contradicting, rules. If 1DL was entirely rule-abiding, crew lock would not exist. If 1DL didn’t also indirectly serve some of Gaijin’s needs, the game design would be changed to eliminate it. Both things are true at the same time.
That said, a game of football between friends is not exactly or necessarily governed by a sporting body, there’s just a tacit expectation that we’re all going to play our part so that we all get to have fun. The moment one team is emptied, the competition ceases even for the winning team, so it’s absolutely normal for them to be bummed at a player throwing the ball and walking.
What makes this social element less prevalent in WT is that the other players are faceless strangers we have no personal connection to. I understand that. Since I have said that I myself do it sometimes, though I try to curb the impulse, you should understand I’m not waving the morality stick at you and saying BAD!! I’m just saying that just because the other people in the game are indeed faceless strangers, that doesn’t mean they don’t exist.
Crew lock was added before 1DL issue. It was added as punishment for leaving before battle start when players didn’t like that map or being in full uptier. Crew lock has nothing to do with 1DL.
In fact you can avoid crew lock with one vehicle lineup. If 1DL was not rule-abiding one vehicle lineup would not be possible.
That is the “structural” part I was referring to, when I said that
So, yes. The game design is the root of the issue, and the only place where you can actually “solve” it.
That said,
If they didn’t intend to disincentivise 1DL, and only cared about people not spawning at all, they would have considerably lowered the timer. There are matches shorter than that timer, at times, as I’m sure you know.
Gaijin wants you to not 1DL too often, but also wants you to queue up many times and buy premiums to skip the grind, and thus allowing you to only bring one vehicle along so you can fast track research. It’s self-contradictory from a player perspective, but it serves their business case.
I agree. That’s why I wrote in the post before that players are “barking at the wrong tree” attacking other players when Gaijin is one that sets up a game like that.
The problem I see with this ‘stance’ that many have taken here is it’s precisely like me with my pig dogs… I lead a pack, and I keep a tight fit… If there’s a dog that shows ANY QUESTION OF FEAR, it’s not in my main pack…
I won’t tolerate it as some day that dog will end up spooking, and WILL make others second guess.
And this is why I say that everyone who moans constantly about the game, makes this issue because it’s not stopped, and fixed early enough, and they have enough people saying ‘It’s the game’ ‘it’s the team’ ‘it’s gaijin’ constantly that they all convince each other that THAT is the reason they are having trouble…
But it’s not, and those of us who know, just know that cowards, breed cowards… It’s just so dumb that you can throw out ANY advice, and it will come back with a simple ‘No’ dismissing all of the actual facts and recommendations, just to concentrate on your busted knee because you can’t get that out of your mindset.
But that’s the point. Others are not moaning. Its you who is moaning about others not playing the game as you think it should be played. Others play as they seem fit and have fun in the process.
You’re trying to validate something as favoring gaijin because you think there’s an issue with queuetimes, but that’s if there was an issue with queuetimes.
Maybe you do wait at times for a match, but it’s not favored by the ODL, as much as the confirmation bias you get when you want to look from that angle.
Everything about the teams is right, and the fact that some pro footballers would actually be fined for not taking the pitch for whatever reason.
Whilst they can’t hold a gun to a head to make someone play, the fact is that these ODLs, being the subject of these discussions and constant throwouts in chat, are a problem, and will need addressing, because otherwise those who ODL, should just be stopped from queueing.
People are moaning because it’s the title of the thread… And it’s what we find in chat… Maybe you’re genuinely not looking around because you just want to validate the moan and groan.
Not really. As I said before I genuienly don’t care how other players play this game. My whole team can leave after 1st death and I wouldn’t care. You care because you play to win. I don’t play to win. I reversed that logic. I play to disrupt opponents team ability to win and if I disrupt them enough my team will win. Thats why I don’t care if players leave after 1st death.
That’s not why I care… And it’s EXTREMELY showing of the reason I remember quarrelling with you in the past…
It’s not because I play to win, it’s because I actually play the game… I haven’t cared about my stats or win rate for a LONG time because years back, and I mean YEARS BACK I showed to peopel that KDR/Winrate only matter to people who are overly precious…
Hence in one of the posts prior, someone is calling out my kill ratio, and some other ‘stats’ that they’d checked on my profile for, and it ended up being nothing.
So coming back to your points, well, people are complaining, it’s not just me, not that I genuinely am complaining about the ODLs, compared to those who encourage and partake in leaving because they think they know how the match is playing out 5 MINUTES IN then jesus… I had a match where 5 minutes in we were half a team down, and we played that entire 25 minutes out, and won…
So yea, I don’t see what you guys see in making reasons to explain passive play, but damn… I’d rather not have people throw in the towel, tell the enemy what the team is doing, and quitting out like they seem to, and that you accept that they do…
So are the others but they play differently than you which is not in line how you play and that bothers you. Again I don’t care how others play. I can still have fun if I am only one left in the team.
There is also different situation. Since there is no decent helicopter game on the market (apart DCS which is pure sim game) some players may see WT as their goal. So they buys premium helicpoter and play RBGF without touching any ground vehicle as they are not interested in them. According to your logic they are not playing the game but for them its treasure as they found their fun.
If 1DL was entirely rule-abiding, crew lock would not exist
It doesn’t exist specifically for 1DL.
Yea, further showing that you’re just a contrarian and that is all you do…
I think you need to stop passing out statements of positions for people who have clearly explained their positions because you’re really bad at it…
If you can’t handle dying, then don’t queue in a damn game where killing is the name of that game… And if you can’t function, then maybe you really are in the wrong mode and need to actually rethink your lineup.
Don’t be endorsing or validating PASSIVE PLAY because this PASSIVE PLAY is the issue. The picking and choosing of what maps to play, and modes to play, and nations to play is what shows a true ODL… Nothing but selfishness. Validating it in any form, is accepting it.
You can have that in every match being that you do, just take it all with you in to whatever mode you find your wet paper bag in.
It should be added, and lock the entire nation so they can’t just switch in another into the lineup and requeue…
Crew lock does lock the nation, but locking down one vehicle lineups is working against their main business model.
Then you stay frustrated if you like because they wont change anything which may affect queue time or selling of premiums. Its your choice alone.
