They are some of the faster 7.7/8.0 tanks.
It’s still an advantage.
It still does matter.
I’m not sure what you mean by this. Having a turret with ok gun handling is such a massive upgrade over a turretless design (such as Bkan or M44)
And the modern equipment and mobilty what makes them undertiered.
What do you mean by this?
Also, what other 7.7 and 8.0 tanks (excluding stuff with autocannons) have an LRF?
PzH 2000 has smokes, automatic gear which means 60 forward and backwards. This thing doesn’t belong to 7.7.
@Ion_Protogen
And SU-152 is one of the faster 4.0 tanks thanks to its 600HP engine on 45 tons.
G6 has the fastest gun traverse of all howitzers, and is 6.7.
The modern equipment makes them 7.7 instead of 5.0.
To reiterate my claim: There are equivalents and superior vehicles to these howitzer vehicles around their BR.
Ikv 91, firing superior ammo with a laser rangefinder at 8.0.
Strv 103 firing superior ammo with a laser rangefinder at 8.0.
Every Patton: 7.7 with standard rangefinders firing superior ammo.
AMX-10M, 7.3 ATGM launcher.
M47 105/55, standard rangefinder firing superior ammo.
OF-40, 8.0 faster firing superior ammo with a LRF.
Type 69, 8.0 heavily armored firing superior ammo with a LRF and two plane stabilizer.
ZTS63, firing on-par ammo with a laser range finder.
M41D 8.0 with thermals firing on-par ammo with LRF.
Swingfire, 8.0 ATGM launcher firing superior ammo.
Marders, ATGM launchers.
RakJPz 2, 8.0 ATGM launcher that’s faster.
BTW you’ve yet to use any howitzer, and I have no clue if you’ve learned how to defeat light tanks cause that information isn’t available.
SFmerc’s PzH2000 performance is identical to Maus and both are far worse than Turm III.
El_Tigr has no experience in these howitzers.
So learn how to counter lightly armored vehicles and listen to experts.
Oh, and by all means stat-check me. You’ll find that VIDAR, Sholef, AuF1, PLZ05, G6 all do not exceed my performance in medium and heavy tanks.
Oh and stats don’t tell the whole story, cross-analysis will do more than anything else.
Howitzers exist from BR 1.0 to 8.0 all firing the same ammo. All that changes is subcontexts.
Just cause I can frag an Abrams with a Sholef or M44 doesn’t make them OP.
@Byhesher Smoke is a basic functionality of tanks at 7.7. Automatic transmissions aren’t modeled in War Thunder, they’re modeled as manual transmissions still cause WT doesn’t have automatic transmission code.
:-)
Seriously? You mean the 7.7 lineup, with which you can’t even achieve a 40% WL ratio and have a KD of 0.5?
Let’s leave it alone, huh?
Thanks for proving that Germany has a great 7.7 lineup.
You have to label your sarcasm somewhere.
Even if it is quite obvious here, you can rarely see it in the written word.
I think the one thing people forget about these howitzers is their total lack of gun depression for the most part…
Albeit, I do believe the more advanced howitzer vehicles (Pzh 2000, VIDAR, Sholef once it’s bloody fixed) should absolutely be bumped up .3-.7 BR, but the rest can pretty handily stay where they are.
“What do you mean you don’t like one-hit-kill laser rangefinder SPGs from the 2020s with 3rd Gen thermals facing 1940s tanks??”
And SU-152 is one of the faster 4.0 tanks thanks to its 600HP engine on 45 tons.
G6 has the fastest gun traverse of all howitzers, and is 6.7.
Lmao so disingenuous
SU-152 is a one trick pony just like the KV2, it has nothing going on for it
Saying the G6 has the fastest turret traverse is also misleading, since it can do it in a narrow cone, plus it’s a wheeled vehicles, so no neutral hull traverse like an RC car (which the PzH2000 and VIDAR get), so changing the fire direction is very sluggish
Wishful thinking! That simply doesn’t happen. 9 out of 10 games your opponents are T55 AM 1.
Hahah, yeah. God, I hate compression so much.
Recently I started playing 7.7. It can be very fun… until the 8.7 matches come.
What business do 1940s-1950s heavy tanks have facing fully-stabilized MBTs with composite armor and APFSDS shells!?
This is the result of this BR area being stupidly compressed. You average 7.7 has just as little business fighting T-55AM1 as it has fighting Pzh 2000.
And then there’s playing 8.3, where you face endless 9.3 uptiers with vehicles that are just as bad…
Game needs decompression all around, badly. AT LEAST 20.0 should be our top end by now, Ground Air and Naval.
That’s exactly why I play the T55AM 1. Whenever I get pissed off by the matchmaker again, I take advantage of him. The T55AM 1 has an absurd win rate.
It’s really hilarious that people here are crying about a howitzer that can only shoot what’s in front of its lens, while a T55 AM1 and its non-premium variant from 7.7 to 9.3 dominates the games.
WOW. A tank that is not a total casualty in the Germans’ BR 7.7. Reminds me of the Leo 2A7. As soon as something isn’t below average or terrible, everyone here cries.
@El_Tigr3
So your argument is now that artillery are one-trick ponies, which I’ve been arguing this entire time.
And you claim that take is “not knowing what one is talking about” and “disingenuous”. You’re calling your own post “disingenuous”.
@Get_HeshED
T-55AM1 isn’t even a top 5 8.7, it’s good, and there are 5 - 10+ 8.7s that are better than it, and howitzers are not OP things.
No, my argument is not that artillery is a one trick pony, My comment clearly stated that KV2 and SU-152 are a one trick pony, specifically those 2, but you chose to ignore it and instead change the entire narrative
That’s why I’m calling you disingenuous
@El_Tigr3
Except they’re more versatile than non-armored howitzers due to being armored.
SU-152 and Brummbar can be part of the front line, M44, Sholef, 15cm slG [despite its reload], and the 7.7s cannot. They lack the armor needed and are exclusively support vehicles.
Not only that but you have no experience in howitzers and little experience defeating them.
Most people here have hundreds of hours in and defeating howitzers.
The more your posts claim sincerity is bad, the more you admit everyone else is correct.
If they give the vehicle its spall liner and thermals, then I’d love to see it go up.
Also, still irked that the Sholef remains horrifically incorrect
You’re wrong here.
I don’t think many 7.7s can go 60km/h forwards and in reverse with 17.3 HP/t.
That 5s reload is also amazing for 7.7 and you’ll also aim for mostly the same part of all tanks in order to kill them, their turret cheeks.
PzH2k could definitely go to 8.0.
There “aren’t many” 13HP/t tanks at 4.0 either.
As for ~7.7 with around 17.3HP/t [obviously significantly better is included]: Leopard 1, Marder, AMX-13-90, IKV-91, VIDAR, AMX-30, AMX-50, Lorraine, AMX-50 Fosh, AuF-1, Sholef, OF-40, Type 69, ZTS63, Type 99, M47, Ho-Ri Production, Object 906, Batchat, TO-55…
And the 8.0s are firing better rounds, and many having laser range finders of their own.
PzH2000 is fine where it is, and I’m saying that as someone that exclusively fights it AFTER making sure that it’s balanced in-case I had biases one way or another.
A cross-analysis does wonders.
I highly recommend playing the PzH2000 or acknowledging your Type 99 record as being equivalent before being certain of your opinion.
Cause while a LRF increases consistency, for experienced players it’s closer to a marginal increase than a complete increase; and it doesn’t stop enemy tanks from moving right before/after shooting making you miss the shot.
