I’m not doing just that. I’m also pointing out that you have far too little experience to make the claims you’re making.
No I’m not.
The one we have in the game is the “fighter” variant with 30 mm cannons snd Ne-20 KAI engines.
You have 3 games on the 30 mm J2M5, you’ve barely touched it. Much like how I won’t talk about how it performs (as I don’t have it) you should follow suit.
The muzzle velocity is 150 m/s slower and the HE rounds got their TNTe nearly halved and are now comparable to the 20 mm minengeschoße rounds.
They are not “worse perhaps”. They are undeniably worse. Sure, they are “fine” in the sense that they are still absolutely usable, but a lot of the vehicles that have these cannons were at a higher BR specifically because of how these cannons used to perform, being very high muzzle velocity and dealing very high damage.
Except now, as discussed, they deal quite a bit less damage and no longer have the speed advantage they used to have.
You never flew them, meaning you do not know how they perform. One more thing just because I do not often fly the J2M5 does not neglect that I still know her performance, as she’s just a J2M5 with 30mm cannons. The Japanese tech tree has several J2 series of aircraft. Who perform very similarly. Very few significant changes were made to the aircraft and its variations.
Also yes I agree the Kikka in-game is the “fighter” version it does not mean you should treat it as one, as its performance isn’t suited for a fighter role. If we were arguing about let’s say the Panzer IV and I never played it but you did. You are more qualified to discuss its performance than I am. But all I’ve been playing is Japan so I know what to expect for a majority of their aircraft and ground vehicles. I do not know what to expect from most German vehicles in this example.
I disagree entirely. It has fantastic acceleration among 7.0 jets, perhaps even the best. I once tested my min fuel Kikka versus a friend in a min fuel Spitfire Mk.24 to see which plane would reach 6 km in the shortest among of time from the runway and the Kikka won (disclaimer: the test was done a few years ago. While the flight models of the aircraft have not changed since then, it could’ve been some other altitude other than 6 km. Point is that the Kikka climbs and accelerates very well).
I’ve flown the J2M2, J2M3 and a tiny bit of the tech tree J2M5. The premium J2M5 not only sits at an entirely different BR compared to the tech tree J2M5, but it also has an entirely different armament. So even though I’ve flown all the other ones (except the premium J2M4 Kai), I still cannot speak for the J2M5 30 mm.
Also you have just not flown the tech tree J2M5 in RB. So saying that it’s “just a J2M5” is pretty moot as you haven’t flown that plane.
Sheer, absolute performance matters little when what matters is how the plane performs compared to the competition. That’s why actually playing the vehicles is important.
Yes, I’m aware, we weren’t debating on that. It was related to how you should treat the aircraft in-game and in-game it should be treated as a Jet Bomber, but now more I dig into it heavy fighter would also be a viable option.
Are you trying to use Battle ratings to determine an aircraft’s performance? cause by that logic the A6M2-N should be 3.7 because it is just a 3.7 with 3 pontoons. 2 that does not change the performance at all if the center one is removed which increases its speed to that of a 3.7.
Just cause an aircraft is at a lower Br does not mean it is by any means any better than its lower Br counterpart in the tech tree. BR simply determines a vehicle from speed, armor, or the most common cases its armaments. For the J2M5-> it’s 30mm cannons is why it’s at a higher BR with a higher skill gap due to having significantly less ammunition meaning pacing your shots and not aggressively holding the trigger is necessary. If I also seem annoyed I just woke up, and you know when you wake up you all gummy and angry and stuff.
I never made an argument like that. In fact I’m specifically not arguing about the performance of premium J2M5 and how it might be better or worse. I pointed out that it has a different armament, at a different BR compared to the tech tree J2M5, and as such faces different opponents with different performance levels.
The premium J2M5 is also lower BR than the tech tree J2M5, as they are 4.7 and 5.7 respectively.
No, that would rather dumb. As we’ve seen from the J7W1, it has horrid flight performance for it’s BR, so BR very clearly doesn’t actually determine aircraft performance.
All I’ve stated is that the same plane will perform differently if placed at different BRs, which isn’t exactly the most shocking information ever.
From all I’ve read, I agree with most every point you’ve made so far both in my own experience with the Japanese planes but specifically the J7W in particular.
I will also say, SinisterIsRandom doesn’t appear to know how BR ranges are truly balanced considering things like the Object 120 and Wyvern for example sit in BR ranges they don’t particularly belong in due to player performance another plane performance. That’s the main reason why a lot of Japanese 'super’props are worse off compared to what other nations get at similar BR’s, because of skill gaps between a small, niche nation compared to a popular, highly played main nation.
Also, thank you for showing me I wasn’t losing my mind and that the guns were in fact nerfed velocity wise by a significant degree for, reasons I don’t even know. I don’t think Gaijin even announced anything about the change from anything I’ve seen.
The shell velocity has to have been within the last year at minimum. The flight model changes were later but I don’t remember the real-shatter lowering the shell velocity initially.
I’m almost certain that change was within only the last 6 months or so, and after the flight model changes about a year/year and a half ago.
If you are incessant on playing Tier IV Japanese Air TT I’ll recommend you the following
A6M5 Ko & Otsu
A7M1 & 2
Ki-61 Hei & any of the Ki-84 even if the IJA has objectively the worst 50.cals and 20mm’s, especially in comparison to their IJN counterparts which are goats
J2M3 & 5’s even if you cannot oppress the enemy team the same way you can with the J2M2
J6K1 if you have it
Otherwise i’ll avoid everything else like the plague
The J7W1 is a very strict BNZ aircraft and will punish you for deviating from it. It’s not the worst aircraft out there however it is one of the most unforgiving.
The N1K’s are very underwhelming, they get bodied way too hard by fighters at it’s own BR.
The G8N1 is a fun bomber in gunship mode, however it’s bombload is seriously lacking to the point that it should be avoided outside of memeing for that exact reason alone.
The A6M5 Hei & A6M6 are way too heavy for their frame and the survivability isn’t much better in comparison to other A6M5’s, the J2M4 is also way too heavy.
Finally the Ki-87 and Ki-94 II is what happens when you combine all the downsides of the C & H Ta-152 with none of the redeeming qualities of either and i don’t even like flying the Ta-152C (Fly the Ta-152H instead)
Since when? It’s been a few months since I used them but I remember Ho-103 being some of the best .50s in the game, performing pretty much how I’d expect 20mms to perform.
They are not as ridiculous as they used to be anymore.
Actually hard to to judge how effective they are in comparison.
I couple of months ago I tested them to see whether the belt with 2xAP + 1xHE was better or the air belt with 1xAP + 3xHE.
They felt about the same. The air belt is probably more effective against fighters with wing fuel tanks while the belt with more AP is just decent in general.
I would disagree when it comes to flying the A6M5’s as of late, because at 5.0 (a full BR above where I used to play them) they just do not keep up with the things they face. They really no longer have the speed, the climb rate isn’t as competitive anymore, the only thing you have is turn rate, and using stupidity against your opponent which is not a very balanced way of doing things.
Same with the Ki-61 Hei in that sense- it just doesn’t seem to be competitive at it’s BR as far as actual performance goes. I do however agree that the N1K’s get bodied at their own BR which is a shame because they aren’t bad aircraft at all. The G8N is mostly for gunshipping so a lacking payload is not a huge downside.
I will also say, however, I have an absolutely wonderful time with the Ki-67-I Otsu usually when using it as more of a heavy-fighter with fairly competent guns between the HE filled 50’s with high fire rates, or the 20mm cannon which still packs a decent punch.
I’ll also add, the LATE IJA 50’s seem to be fairly solid. Good velocity, high fire rate, and good ammo belts to choose from that hurt. The 20mm cannon meanwhile is a faster fire rate, bit slower in velocity, and similar belt layouts compared to the IJN 20mm Type 99 Model 2. Overall for 50’s though, I prefer the IJA’s over the IJN’s.
used them but I remember Ho-103 being some of the best
No they are not especially considering that Russian 50.cal’s, M3 Brownings, Akan m/39 and Type 3 exist. The Ho-103’s are essentially worse Breda Safats. The Type 3 are way closer to M2 Brownings with the US late war belts, though somewhat better than M2 Brownings
I would add that the IJA aircraft 37mm are also the worst
Guess it performance stats just don’t seem like it would be very worth while. The top speed overall seems slow for the BR, same with climbrate relative to what it faces- though the offensive armament is competent/a little on the heavier side. I know the Ki-61’s do handle surprisingly well for what I would’ve expected when I played some of the lower Br rated ones.
Overall I usually look at the aircraft as something that more preys on people being stupid/not knowing how to fight it/throwing away their advantages over having something it can pull on someone else other than surprisingly good handling or incredible speedy escapes.
Care to explain what it is that makes the Ki-61 Hei excel when used proficiently? Haven’t heard anyone speak of it much at all, much less in such a fond way.
Ehhhh, the Ho-103 12.7mm is VERY strong. The IJN 13.2mm not so much - the IJA was also much faster to adopt that 12.7 and put it on planes, as early as the later Ki-43-1 models (we only get one which represents all of them, woe is us. Btw that plane slaps).
The ‘late’ Ki-61s suck. Same flight performance as the 3.3 Ki-61-1 Ko (which it and the Otsu are the best Ki-61s) but sit a whole BR higher.
The rest are decent, not sure on which rank is which but I’d add the Ki-84s for sure, they’re pretty good. A7M2 and J2M3 are my personal favorites.
Ki-100 is probs rank3 but it’s also very capable, same with the A6M3 mod22 Ko.
