Can they monetize fixing it? Because if they cannot, they won’t do it.
This is the level of quality that is acceptable to Gaijin, this is the effort they show when there is no money to be made from something…
I agree, remove all armor peircing ammunition and move it down. The 4.3 vehicles don’t deserve to have an armored SPAA with superior gun handling and high pen running around spraying them down. Now if you want to talk about it being an effective SPAA instead of a tank destroyer, remove the AP rounds so it can’t annihilate other tanks, then move it down so it can be against aircraft it stands more of a chance against. You guys gotta think about ALL the vehicles that could be effected by a br change like this, not just the vehicle you want to move.
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Kugel can’t be lower than 7.0 because it has a 77mm HVAP belt with a 100 rounds even though 66 of them are HE?
But Russia can have the Praga with 91mm of penetration in a pure HVAP belt at 6.3?
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There is a large difference between the Kugel and Praga, the gunner is exposed, and can be killed by any machine gun. Does this survivability difference mean a .7 br downgrade when compared to the Kugel? Probably not, but survivability is a large part of balancing. I also agree the Praga is undertiered because of the belts. Even with only 33 rounds being hvap out of 100, the kugel can still be a devastating weapon because of the twin guns and fire rate.
I will always advocate for belts like HVAP, APHE, and APDS belts for SPAA to be removed. I doubt it will happen because people would lose their minds that they would have to use their SPAA for its actual purpose. If the belts went to anti air duty belts only, then maybe they could drop the tiers of some SPAA and fill in gaps where they would be quite useful against cas.
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Praga is impossible to kill if you don’t have an MG however, a Kugel is a one shot because it’s a square box Panzer IV that does not benefit from the no armor meta.
I just want to use the Kugel for SPAA, I don’t care for HVAP yet Germany gets their SPAA availability nerfed because of it’s AT abilities, which is stupid, especially after removing the Coelian, which means you’re back using the Wirbelwind from 3.7 to 8.3 or whatever.
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I agree with this. It should simply go to 6.7 so it can be used with the “WW2” lineup that has the Tiger 2 and such without needing to uptier everything to the Kugelblitz.
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It isn’t inpossible to kill without a machine gun. If you can’t hit that massive gun on the back, you’re bad. If you can’t hit the cab, you’re also bad. The kugel can’t be machine gunned, which makes a difference. Of course it gets one shot, most vehicles do when APHE are involved. I would assume people carrying maximum ammo in it, like the ZSU-57-2. You can sneeze on that things turret and it’ll pop.
I feel you, I’d use it too, but it doesn’t fit in a decent lineup. If AT abilities were nerfed, they could rebalance them to give better coverage. I’d love if they brought Flakpanzer 341 back, but I guess this new 6.0 SPAA shpuld be interesting.
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It’s AT is still worse than the Praga below it, and the Coelian at 6.3 is a Panther chassis that offers way more protection, that shoots APHE and doesn’t suffer a 10 second reload.
The Kugel can easily be 6.7 with a bit more pen when it’s 2 out of 3 of it’s shells in a belt are trash.
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I am aware. But you can sneeze on the Praga’s gun and disable it. You can bring up firepower again, but ignoring the protection differences of the vehicles will gain you no ground in the argument to get things changed.
I don’t know much about the 341, and what it carries doesn’t mean much to me. I want it because I enjoy the Panther chassis being used for an SPAA. I keep my 6.7 lineup with only Panther/Tiger 2 based chassis because I enjoy that Germany used them as a base for multiple roles.
I agree, it probably wouldn’t be the end of the world if it went to 6.7. It would be nice to have something other than the Ostwind 2, but this new one should be interesting enough I suppose.
The Wirblewind has a higher fire rate than any SPAA you listed, less .50 cals.
At 7.0 you can also sneeze on a Panzer IV, there is literally nothing in the game that struggles to kill it, it’s better against air because of 10mm of armor but so is the Skink and that’s at 5.3.
I agree, it probably wouldn’t be the end of the world if it went to 6.7. It would be nice to have something other than the Ostwind 2, but this new one should be interesting enough I suppose.
It would change nothing but actually give it a purpose in the game.
This doesn’t look like statistics that justify it’s BR.
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Send me a video of you killing a Kugelblitz with a 7.62mm machine gun, like you can do to the Spraga’s gunner and prevent it from ever firing as it cycles the gunner with the rest of the crew while you slowly murder them all one by one. Of course the Panzer IV chassis won’t hold against primary armaments at 7.0, but it can hold up against MGs, HMGs, and smaller autocannons.
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Or a video of a Praga dying in one shot without having to reload an HE shell, without an MG you’re in real trouble facing any of these trucks.
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You shoot the cab, you know, where 4 of the 5 crewmembers sit. Your being so contrary about this for no reason. The Kugelblitz crew CANNOT be killed by a 7.62mm machine gun but the Praga CAN be killed in one shot. I don’t know why you can’t accept those two things, but they are true regardless of your opinion.
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Armor needs to be factored in.
Armor+Weapons=Why its br is at 7.0 Although this is also due to players using it to kill tanks and other armored vehicles rather than just planes.
It sucks at killing ground vehicles, it’s the peak of heavy tanks at that BR, statistics clearly show it rarely gets ground kills and even for air kills it sucks because it’s facing jets.
Thunder skill is unreliable joke of a source. No legitimate argument can be made using that system.
No it doesn’t lmao. Go consult WT wiki and see for yourself.
Edit: Bored at work. Let me do the heavy lifting for you so we can put this discussion behind us once and for all. I will only cover rank III and rank IV SPAA as these ranks have the most in common with the Kugelblitz.
Spoiler
Bad firerate: 100-399RPM = yellow
OK firerate: 400-599RMP = blue
Good firerate: 600-799RPM = green
Godlike firerate: 800+ RPM = magenta
USA
- M19A1 - 120RPM
- M42 - 120RPM
GER
- Wirbelwind - 480RPM
- Ostwind - 250RPM
- Ostwind II - 250RPM
Spoiler
- Flakpanzer 341 - 250RPM
- Kugelblitz - 450RPM
USSR
- ZSU-37 - 160RPM
- BTR-152D - 600RPM
- BTR-ZD - 801RPM
- M53/59 - 450RPM
UK
- Ystervark - 997RPM
- Crusader AA Mk II - 450RPM
- Bosvark - 801RPM
- Skink - 450RPM
JAP
- M19A1 - 120RPM
- M42 - 120RPM
- SUB-I-II - 801RPM
CHI
- ZSD63/PG87 - 600RPM
- M42 - 120RPM
- Phòng không T-34 - 160RPM
ITA
- M42 Contraereo - 600RPM
- Leopard 40/70 - 240RPM
- R3 T20 FA-HS - 997RPM
FRA
- AMX-13 DCA 40 - 240RPM
- TPK 6.41 - 997RPM
- AMX-10P - 740RPM
SWE
- L-62 ANTI II - 120RPM
- Lvkv 42 - 240RPM
ISR
- TCM-20 - 701RPM
- ZSU-57-2 - 120RPM
Sweden and USA urgently need a new fast firing SPAA.
Kugelblitz needs to go down in BR.
Period
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That is not entirely correct, since there are some SPAA that after a few shots the cannons become desynchronized causing them to have a higher rate of fire, that is why despite having the same rate of fire, the Praga after a few shots surpasses the kugelblitz in cadence, which as the bullet has more speed, makes the Prague much superior to the kugelblitz in its AA function.
Speaking of which, this is my biggest gripe with SPAA implementation in WT. In the game, almost every SPAA fires all barrels at the same time, while IRL they used alternating fire sequence. One example for all - the M42 Duster.