For few months now I have been noticing while playing high tier naval, shells under waterline seem to just dissapear and do no damage. Making some ships feel more durable than they should be, especially considering for example Italian and French sadly battleships having pour accuracy. (Dispersion on Jean bart is so bad that at 15km My shells dispersed everywhere but enemy ship and accidentally hit a missile destroyer 250-300m away from ship I was aiming at killing the destroyer, but that is besides the point)
Do shells once they hit water just dissapear or is there something bugged? I know shells interact with water, like bounce, but about the penetration bellow water line I have no Idea what is happening or how shells interact with water, how water reduces penetration if it reduces it.
I basically just want to know if its bug, or feature, or some oversight.
As far as I know, shells hitting the water and disappearing has been a thing since day one or the japanese would be the undisputed queens of naval since their shells were specifically tailored to the concept of diving.
Why… cant it be modeled in some way to allow that? cause some ships are more durable cause of this, and it would add more realism and interesting gameplay than just shoot until you destroy sections (unless your in french ship which has lowest compartment health out of all toptier ships, needing only one salvo from ship to destroy it), this would give us more options… I guess gaijin devs dont want to deal with math regarding how water effects shells/how much it slows them down, but for some reason they created their own “formula” for tank munitions
I cant provide much data/bug report cause as far as I know and from what I talked with people from INAVY discord (GunshipYTs Discord server) some also noticed it as well that shells once they hit water (unless they bounce) seem to just dissapear not damaging a ship, tho as far as I know nobody sent out bug report, cause they arent sure if its feature/hardware limitation or actually a bug. I sadly cant do much testing currently due to some things, and quite frankly randomness of naval guns with dispersion makes testing difficult, cause its hard to get accurate results.
You could not reproduce this kind of hit in game from any distance. This is Mogami hit into shell room versus Boise from 7km.
Spoiler
In the engagement Boise was hit a number of times, twice by fire from a Japanese heavy cruiser from about 7,500 yards (6,900 m) range. One hit exploded upon impact on her armor causing little damage. The other penetrated under the waterline and exploded in the 6 in (152 mm) magazine located between number I and II turrets causing a powder fire and flooding, putting turrets I, II, and III out of action and causing a number of casualties[11] including 107 killed.
Here is replay with my test with similar ships, all shells that touch water just disappear and not doing any damage on underwater parts of the enemy ship. no underwater hits.zip (4.8 MB)
And here is video of it, all shells that touch water never reach ship.
And here it is, there is “the underwater hits” but they just doing no damage when exploding right in the modules. No wonder why Scharnhorst was immortal before Leviathans arrived with their big guns.
Spoiler
This from first test, i thought there is something fishy
Jesus. One would think they be able to find such fatal and obvious flaws themselves. But to simply deny it because some data apparently is missing, on such an easy to reproduce bug, where they could have just went into test drive for 10 minutes or in a custom and tested it themselves, when someone took the time to report that, thats just something else. For how long has that been going on with the underwater shells? All the time i just thought the removal was intentional bc they didnt like the old modelling (back in the days when it was working) or just believe its too complicated to model or too much for the servers to handle? thats gonna be fun if subs finally turn up but no underwater shells…
Thats exactly why i dont bother with bugreporting stuff. Tried once, never again.
“The report should include steps to reproduce, unedited screenshots made by the game engine, .clog and replay files with timestamps.”
Then u cant upload .blk files of shell hits because the file extension isnt supported. When you try to upload the client side replay in .wprl format the filesize is too big. Then they want in game recreatable screenshots of it happening on the server side replay when for lots of naval matches theres no server replays.
I had to create a dropbox account extra for that to be able to upload a .wprl file because 16 mb is too big for the official bug reporting site to upload. They basically want you to provide data that is impossible to upload with a bug report on the official bug reporting site that specifically exists just for that.
Yeah, nah, thx. I value my time, maybe they got that wrong because im playing lots of WT. Easy to be mistaken…But i wish the best to your bug report and on the endless journey to get at least a couple of words out of them acknowledging that it is, in fact, not working at all. IF it even should…But u also wont get such a statement so youll be forever guessing whats actually going on…Intentional? Bugged? Removed? A mystery…forever. -->“Not a bug”
From the devblog:
“Having said this, we found a bug where in one very specific combination of events, a projectile could hit the underside of a ship, where there’s little to no armor. A fix for this was released in a very recent update, so this should not be occurring again.”
“A bug where projectiles could interact incorrectly with the water causing them to hit the underside of ships has been fixed. Projectiles could ignore the surface of the water and hit a ship from below. Because of this bug it could seem for example, that 100-140 mm shells could penetrate the main armor belts of ships.”
Though i cant find a datamine from that long ago which shows what actually was changed
EDIT: Found this:
2.35.0.33 → 2.35.0.34
Max shell travel distances in water:
100 - 113.9 mm: 10 -> 8 m
114 - 126.9 mm: 12 -> 9 m
127 - 129.9 mm: 13 -> 10 m
130 - 132.9 mm: 14 -> 10 m
133 - 151.9 mm: 14 -> 11 m
152 - 179.9 mm: 16 -> 13 m
180 - 199.9 mm: 18 -> 15 m
200 - 253.9 mm: 21 -> 16 m
254 - 279.9 mm: 26 -> 20 m
280 - 304.9 mm: 29 -> 24 m
305 - 342.9 mm: 31 -> 25 m
343 - 355.9 mm: 35 -> 28 m
356 - 380.9 mm: 36 -> 29 m
381 - 409.9 mm: 39 -> 30 m
410+ mm: 39 -> 33 m
But that shouldnt cause the issues of no shell doing any damage as soon as its underwater.
Maybe you can search around in the datamines of the Alpha Strike Update (Should be 2.35. …) maybe you can find something more that supports or gives an idea what the problem could be? But i think in the end its solely on the devs acknowledging that something is off and to seriously look into what it could be. Like, thats not our duty to fix their game by looking through datamines which only show changes, not all the other stuff thats in place that wasnt changed…
@Stona_WT@Smin1080p_WT Could you comment on this behavior of the naval shells? It lead to situation where one ships are easy to ammo rack and others just immune to that, or situations where all crew compartments are dead but you can not reach modules under waterline so enemy survive way longer than he should, because your only option is dig out rest crew by 10-20, from the barbets.
If one thing is certain in this universe then it is that something is always wrong with naval shells :-D
What exactly is wrong, thats the hard part to find out^^
