Search and target lock are two different things entirely, and often two completely different radars on some vehicles.
More evidence Yall 2 havent actually looked into these tanks much.
Depending on how far away you are from the vehicle, that may not be high enough.
Thats where that graph I kept sharing a link to, and your two never looked at, comes into play.
Such inappropriate behavior…
Hi,
Comments have been removed and i want to make a point clear.
Under no circumstances is it okay to personally insult another user on the forum.
If you don’t have anything informative to post and would rather post to personally insult someone, Then don’t post at all or take it to dms.
Would have to redo this part
Though idk if i can do this part myself @katyushá Can I also say he doesnt know any thing about these SPAA?
So track one and keep scanning spawn. Full situational awareness
People won’t be thinking about attacking from the top when they found that they can’t see through the 1000m clouds.
You may wish to respond to something by disagreeing with it. That’s fine. But remember to criticize ideas, not people. Instead, provide reasoned counter-arguments that improve the conversation.
Have I played these particular 2 SPAA, no. And i never claimed i did.
But the way these SPAA work with their search and tracking radar I have looked into, enough that when I play against them and do decide to fly I have a reasonable chance of avoiding them.
You could too, if you cared enough to try.
Yes, this is why some SPAA have the 2 separate radars… I dont know where you were going with this.
Military radar, with the exception of the very early radars, can see into and through clouds. Clouds would only block a visual scan.
And
So,
:D I’m just going to quote everything. Clear enough.
Maybe we can lock this thread if you find this conversation meaningless
Maybe the mod should just close this thread then.
How am I going to respond when the logics are intentionally broken by irrelevant stuff? As shown above
To be fair you only replied by quotes.
I believe he actually tried to keep the convo going, so the logic is not really broken. Yours was little effort which killed the convo as you gave him nothing to reply to.
You don’t need to reply, if the convo is dead and you have nothing to offer then leave it. You aren’t obliged to reply to someone.
Feel like i’m teaching people how to have a conversation.
So:
I explained why people can track beyond searched elevation (as a continuation of further above) without losing situational awareness (In case anyone feels upset about STT tracking)
And here he replied
Clouds limit the height of CAS by blocking the view starting from 1000m height - I don’t assume people can’t understand this. Yet he stayed with scan elevation.
CAS won’t see anything above 1000, but SPAA radars can. Stayed with scan elevation and reinforced that CAS can be scanned at 1000m, advocating for higher alts regardless of clouds.
Why I feel he’s intentional instead of not understanding? This is what he is doing since the start of the thread.
Please don’t assume that I don’t understand how to have a conversation the same way as he assumed that we don’t know elevation, even though we have had far more SPAA games.
If this whole thing is too complicated to solve, we all agree to close this thread.
Best regards.
It’s not closed because i don’t deem it fit to close.
Anything else regarding it you can pm me as this is not the place to discuss staff actions, But until staff / OP wants the topic closed there’s no reason to currently. So i will end the conversation there.
And I explained the tracking and search are 2 different things. But you didnt pay attention.
Cloud cover doesnt block the whole map.
Some map and weather patterns are worse than others. If you are in a cloud heavy match, then dont fly CAS.
This is how it works in life, and since warthunder is a simi-realistic game how it works here.
Hence why during bad weather air support is usually grounded. At least before the advent of ground targeted air dropped munitions. Which havent been implemented in game yet.
I didnt assume, I based my comments off of what you and the other guy were saying, and quoted you when I replied.
You 2 arent here because you want to have a discussion about this, you just want someone to agree with you, which given the majority of responses here you 2 just dont know how to counter the SPAA you 2 spend the majority of time playing.
Seems we are out of topic, it doesn’t matter the weather is bad or not for SPAA, especially for ULQ players( yes, they can even see the planes in the clouds and shoot them)
For PGZ09 and M247, they can even lock any of CAS when they are respawned, especially considering most of the CAS at this BR don’t have RWR, these SPAA can easily ambush them because of their no tracers belts, And they can even intercept some F&F AGMs, such as AGM65 or AGM62, and that’s why they worth higher BR.
And of course, till now this guy still doesn’t believe the air alert has been one of the most unfair function for SPAA
@katyushá I am not sure if I can put game records and compare with them is it offensive? Such as K/D or K/B? because till now he is still said we are lack of “skill”
I don’t believe its unfair. It somewhat evens the playing field. Tanks can scout for CAS, its only fair that we can kinda scout air targets too. To add, ULQ settings or low settings allows easy spotting for tanks too without the need of them shooting for a muzzle flash.
As for the OP, I do believe the PGZ09 and the M247 are highly effective against CAS as long as they know how to use them properly. No one should have bad K/D with them honestly unless they go fight tanks with it lol Also I tried locking unto AGMs with the m247, it doesn’t lock properly on them so I have to eyeball the AGMs which is difficult to do when they are just a pixel size. Can easily lose track of them.
What attention is needed here when SPAA can always scan+lock before reaching elevation limits…
Why not say “there are matches without clouds” xD. Sadly for our matchmakers, they do block much to the whole map.
Classic troll sentence in a balance thread. See “If too weak, dont play it”. Also “If maps too small, dont spawn TDs”
So from a game balance view, they are weak.
When we have more games. Going back to we don’t own our account sentence will you?
Oh also,
Again, tracking radar is separate from search radar. Both of your favorite tanks have separate tracking radars. The tracking radar will elevate with the main gun, other wise it couldnt track effectively and would seriously limit the tank, the search radar will not elevate with the gun and is static as far as the elevation of its search pattern. (unless you park the tank on a hill.
This game is meant to be realistic, not a perfect balance. Is it perfectly all round fair? no, but then again its not meant to be.
Classic troll sentence from people that dont understand vehicle limitations.
For example, if a small city map comes up for you to play and you choose to play a hull locked tank, you will have a more difficult time playing that tank than a tank with a rotating turret.
That doesnt mean the hull locked tank is underpowered and the rotating turret tank is over powered.
It means certain tanks are better than others in certain situations.
Just because YOU put yourself in a disadvantageous situation doesnt mean it is the vehicles fault.
If you choose to fly CAS in a map where you are struggling to see, that is a YOU problem.
I made that comment given your comments on here. Yes your account has alot of games played congrats, but given your level of knowledge on how the game mechanics work its difficult to believe that you have actually played all of those games.
Im sorry if this upset you, but at this point its a statement of fact not an insult. You ignore any and all contrary information presented to you and actively insult everyone that has less play time than you.
Again, with intentionally flagging content that doesnt violate any of the guidelines.
Played a few games alongside China 9-9.3 earlier, and one of the biggest complaints (I saw from the CAS players ingame) against the PGZ09 and its AHEAD rounds are the lack of tracers. Think CAS are too used to SPAA like the M163 where you can see the tracers and stream of shells from across the globe.
And that is by design. Just like stealth belts for aircraft. Tracers were needed before automated guidance so the gunners could correct their aim easier, but were still used later as they are also good at setting fires.
However it is harder to defend if you dont know you are being fired at… So some armies removed the tracer rounds.
CAS lovers are always going to complain if the kills arent as easy as it is for them to spawn an aircraft.
Drive forward, do one or two things, die, then spawn the aircraft.
Fly forward, drop bombs on already marked targets, and either lawn dart themselves into the dirt, or fly back to air field.
If anything interferes with those steps there will be complaints, lol.
I think Gaijin massively over plays the brightness of tracers in game as well. Sure, during a night battle they would be easily seen, but during a broad daylight match they should only show up clearly in thermals.
Yeah, I know.
Yup. The thing with these CAS pilots is that they’ve obviously never used the PGZ09’s AHEAD rounds. The laser ranged proximity sounds better on paper than in practice. When they work, they work great. But there are times when your rounds will explode too early or too late. The rounds themselves don’t have enough HE-filler (unlike the WZ305), so those near misses can be all the difference.
Basically, if people only complained about things they’ve actually played themselves, it would cut down on a lot of the complaining in general - not just because most complainers seem to be one-nation wonders, but because it gives you an understanding that when you face a vehicle you often only see one aspect of it.
