Helicopter's max BR needs to be increased

[UniqueScorpions]

Dogfights ? Last time I checked GRB was for tanks. Not dogfights.

GOOD SCREW PLANE DOMINANCE, I am so f**king sick of getting bombed regardless of BR. I just played a match where an m18 got 1 kill, hopped into an F4U and then got 8 more ground kills, and 2 aircraft kills.

CAS in terms of planes is unbelievably BROKEN I AM SO FED UP WITH PEOPLE SAYING ITS NOT. This kinda crap makes me want to quit WT for good.

At least helis are LEAGUES easier to kill. All a plane has to do is a quick turn and you avoid 90% of aams. Unless they’re plane launched.

[rainy2000]

@UniqueScorpions

Dogfights ? Last time I checked GRB was for tanks. Not dogfights.

GRB is combined arms, focusing more on Ground but facilitates both air and ground combat.
I prefer that over what would be just WOT with better damage models.

I understand that CAS can be frustrating, and so I believe having the option to queue in for CAS-free lobbies would be an interesting addition - and definitely helps if you don’t have an aircraft of your own or SPAA to farm them with.

@UniqueScorpions

CAS in terms of planes is unbelievably BROKEN I AM SO FED UP WITH PEOPLE SAYING ITS NOT.

Depends on the BR I’d say.
Most Low Tier BRs (1.0-6.7) have fairly decent SPAA (Skink, Wirbelwind, ZSD63/PG87) and some broken SPAA (Coelian, Ostwind II), as well as fairly decent CAS aircraft (P-47D, Yak-9UT, T18B, Do 335, Pe-8 / Lancaster) and some broken CAS (Yak-9K, Tu-2S).

Most Mid Tier BRs (7.0-10.0) have much more potent SPAA compared to CAS (Gepard / Gepard 1A2, ZSU-23-4M2, PGZ09, ZSU-37-2), especially the M247 and Imp Chaparral.
They also have very potent CAS, but can struggle to kill AA / Air if not really careful (Scimitar, Sea Vixen, SAAB-105G, Ayit, Alpha Jet, F-84G-21, SK-60B, A-4B).

Top tier (10.3-12.7) has some of the biggest difference in capabilities between AA and Aircraft.
You have some really good SPAA (Like Strela, Type 81, Pantsir, 2S6,), but the CAS is much more difficult to kill, especially in an uptier.
The Pantsir (12.0) can see the AMX A-1A (11.0), which the AMX has no chance of killing.
On the other hand, the Pantsir can see the Eurofighter and Rafale (12.7s), which the Pantsir has near to no possiblity of defeating.
Those Top Tier aircraft can also fight other air, which makes them invulnerable if played correctly.

Top Tier needs the most decompression (in my opinion), especially by decompressing the AIR BRs for GRB, as well as the 7.0-9.7 range for ground vehicles (but you can only correctly decompress that area if every BR above it decompresses too.

[UniqueScorpions]

Lmao. Okay.

@rainy2000

@UniqueScorpions

Dogfights ? Last time I checked GRB was for tanks. Not dogfights.

GRB is combined arms, focusing more on Ground but facilitates both air and ground combat.
I prefer that over what would be just WOT with better damage models.

I understand that CAS can be frustrating, and so I believe having the option to queue in for CAS-free lobbies would be an interesting addition - and definitely helps if you don’t have an aircraft of your own or SPAA to farm them with.

@UniqueScorpions

CAS
in terms of planes is unbelievably BROKEN I AM SO FED UP WITH PEOPLE SAYING ITS NOT.

Depends on the BR I’d say.
and some broken CAS (Yak-9K, Tu-2S).

Let’s skip the A-1H, A-2D, (pretty much a lot of USA aircraft, etc etc).
Shows a pretty odd narrative when you list only Russian air craft as broken.
Also, how is the TU-2S broken? The 1000kg bombs are worthless. Just take 500s.

And I do believe some cas elements should be necessary but they have to be kept in checks for balance sake. Therefore, there should only be:
1 fighter
1 strike fighter / bomber
And 2 helicopters allowed at any point in the sky per team.
That is 1/4th of a team which is still usable by far.

Again, odd you don’t list the Adats, or the Swedish spaa as being good. Adats is an anti tank king.

As far as decompression, the planes are already what, 12.7, 13.0?
They need to add passive spaa, like the Gepard to hold the rear (heli pads technically) as that’s how a realistic battle would occur, advancing troops would be covered by spaa within a decent range.

[rainy2000]

@UniqueScorpions

Let’s skip the A-1H, A-2D, (pretty much a lot of USA aircraft, etc etc).

Sure, I could’ve included them.

@UniqueScorpions

Shows a pretty odd narrative when you list only Russian air craft as broken.

No, not really?
Do you see only Russian Vehicles in Mid Tier or Top Tier?
Why did I not spend the time to include the Su-34 or Su-39 if I were so keen on saying Russian aircraft are broken?
I wonder why you may think that…

@UniqueScorpions

Also, how is the TU-2S broken? The 1000kg bombs are worthless. Just take 500s.

How are they worthless?
They are incredible at taking out SPAA at far ranges, and then you can bomb the tanks with the 4x 250kg bombs.
The flight model, the rear gunners, and the forward armaments are also great, especially for just 5.3.

@UniqueScorpions

And I do believe some cas elements should be necessary but they have to be kept in checks for balance sake. Therefore, there should only be:
1 fighter
1 strike fighter / bomber
And 2 helicopters allowed at any point in the sky per team.
That is 1/4th of a team which is still usable by far.

I can see that.

@UniqueScorpions

Again, odd you don’t list the Adats, or the Swedish spaa as being good. Adats is an anti tank king.

ITO is decent, don’t get me wrong, but then you realise that the Pantsir is just better, and is at the same BR.
ADATS is an anti-tank king sure, but I am talking about SPAA duty, not anti-tank duty.
It’s good at taking out helicopters, but they can even struggle against things like Su-25T / Su-39.

@UniqueScorpions

As far as decompression, the planes are already what, 12.7, 13.0?

12.7, which is not enough.

@UniqueScorpions

They need to add passive spaa, like the Gepard to hold the rear (heli pads technically) as that’s how a realistic battle would occur, advancing troops would be covered by spaa within a decent range.

Maybe.

[MotorolaCRO]

@rainy2000

Most Mid Tier BRs (7.0-10.0) have much more potent SPAA compared to CAS (Gepard / Gepard 1A2, ZSU-23-4M2, PGZ09, ZSU-37-2), especially the M247 and Imp Chaparral.
They also have very potent CAS, but can struggle to kill AA / Air if not really careful (Scimitar, Sea Vixen, SAAB-105G, Ayit, Alpha Jet, F-84G-21, SK-60B, A-4B).

Most SPAAGs (not including M247 and PGZ) can be countered by missiles like Nords.
Stingers are quite nice against stalling or afk targets, but against something with TV bombs/missiles they don’t stand much of a chance.

@rainy2000

Why did I not spend the time to include the Su-34 or Su-39 if I were so keen on saying Russian aircraft are broken?

I get the Su-34, but why Su-39 ?

@rainy2000

ITO is decent, don’t get me wrong, but then you realise that the Pantsir is just better, and is at the same BR.

ITO is definitely the best of the rest as it was the best AA until Pantsir showed up.

[UniqueScorpions]

Lmao pulled my stats, but didn’t bother to look at recent games.

I stopped playing Russia for the most part, I’ve mainly been playing Italy or France.

But no, based off of your comments previously it’s kinda odd you only pointed out Russian aircraft.

I could also bring up the A-10C, A-4E, etc
Or the Rafael, EF2000, etc etc.

There’s many good or broken aircraft across all the nations in game. Bar Italy pretty much.

Lastly, the 1000kg bombs for me, even with direct hits are super buggy and never do damage, it’s the bomb itself, so I started to use the 500s and had a much better time.

[RavenGuardMarine]

@Commodus6504

It feels like half the Russian or American team consists of jets that are constantly circling over the helifields.

Of course we(all nations, not just US/RU) are it’s my job as a CAS/CAP player, to hit the ground and keep the sky clear. Helicopters, of the FNF type can only reasonably be targeted by a jet.

They can be harassed and targeted by AA in terms of SACLOS helis, but AA is of no real concern to a FNF heli. Which puts that jobs squarely on the jets plate. If we let you sit, you can easily flop the field to your advantage.

Especially since gaijin refuses to make rotors return radar hits you can target helis effectively from a distance like reality, it leaves one course of action. Constant passes over the Pad with Mk1 eyeballs to see if you’re there.

@UniqueScorpions

Again, odd you don’t list the Adats, or the Swedish spaa as being good. Adats is an anti tank king.

If you’re spawn trapped, sure.

[HondaCivici]

@MotorolaCRO

I get the Su-34, but why Su-39 ?

If there were SPAA that are like the 2S6 at 11.0ish, it wouldn’t be much of an issue. Because there isn’t, it can easily cause havoc.

This doesn’t mean it’s useless in uptiers. The Kh-29TE are extremely good at taking out ADATS, ITOs, Flakrad, etc.

[MotorolaCRO]

@HondaCivici

If there were SPAA that are like the 2S6 at 11.0ish, it wouldn’t be much of an issue. Because there isn’t, it can easily cause havoc.

With 29TEs it’s safe to assume Su-39 will stay at 5km+ from the battlefield and at those distances Osa is pretty much on par with 2S6, so I’d say other nations have some chances to fight this thing.

[HondaCivici]

@MotorolaCRO

Su-39 will stay at 5km+

that’s the thing, they don’t. It can be fired 10km+ and hit targets with ease. The OSA may be able to intercept (that’s if they react in time) the KH-29TE but it cannot take out the Su-39 at those ranges.

[MotorolaCRO]

So 2S6 can take out planes at 10km+ of range, where did you get that from ?
It has a maximum range of 10km shown on the stat card.

[UNKNOWN_PILOT]

skillissue

[HondaCivici]

maximum range does take in account of a plane moving… It is the best case scenario

[MotorolaCRO]

But Osa has the same maximum range as well.

[HondaCivici]

The issue with the OSA is that it has a fixed elevation when it launches it’s missile. This means if it doesn’t detect an AGM in time (which will most likely be the case), it’s missiles will overshoot. In addition it has no guns for last minute interceptions

[MotorolaCRO]

I’m talking about killing the plane at long ranges.

[HondaCivici]

The 2S6 will also struggle heavily at those ranges. The reason why I brought it up is because it’s one of the only spaa at that BR that can intercept agms effeciently. Should’ve clarified that.

[MotorolaCRO]

I’d say Osa has better effective range to engage planes and with it’s radar it should be able to pick up Su-39 before it even launched a missile, which gives it some time to shoot down the missile.

Su-39 will also struggle a lot defending itself against enemy air.

[Commodus6504]

@RavenGuardMarine

Of course we(all nations, not just US/RU) are it’s my job as a CAS/CAP player, to hit the ground and keep the sky clear. Helicopters, of the FNF type can only reasonably be targeted by a jet.

There is no problem with jets chasing helicopters. The low effort required by the jets to reach the enemy heliport makes helicopters obsolete due to the normal number of jets in the air today. No matter whether they use FnF or guided missiles.

Furthermore, there is no chance for the helicopters to defend themselves (if the jet is on the same BR and the player is not brain dead) or to carry out their task.

@RavenGuardMarine

hey can be harassed and targeted by AA in terms of SACLOS helis, but AA is of no real concern to a FNF heli.

Your statement that AA shouldn’t be a danger to helicopters (including FnF) is based on your inexperience with helicopters.

I also have to expose an FnF Helicopter on most maps. The ability to hide behind a tree line may be nice. However, this is of no use if you don’t see anything just above the tree line.

A few maps are suitable for this. Mostly maps with high mountains and little vegetation. On these maps it is particularly easy for opposing jets to catch you.

Helicopters are unnecessary in most situations. Unfortunately that’s how it is.

[HondaCivici]

Not by much and again, engaging targets at those ranges will most likely miss. Majority of spaa sit at spawn which makes them a very easy target.