I am using the Russian Mi-24 V and the Hungarian Mi-24 D versions rn, grinding the heli trees in ground RB.
As I remember from back when I was grinding the Gepard, chaff used to spoof my radar lock, so I tried pre-chaffing when doing attack runs…and I can’t say it did anything… i tried pure chaffs and flare priority. didn’t affect the radar lock.
Then I started to use them with 9.3, 10.0 lineups, thinking maybe flaring early Iglas and Stingers gonna be more easily doable.
So I tried pre-flaring and increasing the deployed flares, I tried using reinforced flares and ended up again at the conclusion that these countermeasures don’t work at all.
Early missiles, such as the Stinger and the 9M39 do not get affected whatsoever, no matter the intensity, type of countermeasure, pre flaring no pre flaring.
Are these just broken or what? Iam coming in from 3.5km, pre-flaring and the sam is just straight flying into the cockpit. I can smash the flare deploy button as hard as I can, I can make a Christmas tree behind me, from all the popped flares, it does not work.
Its been a while since chaff affected ground based radars whatsoever. Maybe back when chaff was first added?
Ground based AA radars got actually fixed recently because they are no longer affected by multipathing (ie. flying close to the ground).
Gun based AAs will just delete you
SACLOS guided AAs dont give a damn about counter measures
Against IR missiles, HIRSS and dazzlers are better countermeasures to have (the Mi-24P should have access to those). Stingers AFAIK have IRCCM type of countermeasure that makes FOV of the seeker much more narrow so it doesnt “see” flares. You would need to get the flare between you and the missile, and preferably dodge as well.
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So basically they are useless…noice.
I had instances when I turned around smashing flares and still took a 9M39 to back…
You need to take release pattern into account too. If i recall correctly (its been a while since i used hind) the pattern launches countermeasures to the left and right of the helicopter where they start falling down quickly.
Ergo to get them between the missile seeker and the heat source (your engines, if you have HIRSS then the heat signature is somewhere around your rotoros), i would turn that missile is coming at me at 90° angle and tilt the whole helicopter to the side while dodging.
That is assuming the missile is using IR signature and not photocontrast (against which flares are useless but can be defeated by hanging low to the ground).
Of course that does not guarantee you will defeat the missile, so its better to not get fired upon at all.
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Yeah pretty much.
Even Pre-flaring like irl doesn’t work, they always track me.
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Many ground based SAMs have pretty stong IRCCM. I know the Type 93s missile is super good at ignoring flares especially with its optical seeker mode. That is probably why
Flares only really help against aircraft, not SAMs.
in 2008, there was an exercise in Hungary called “Load Diffuser 2008 Fighter Wing Exercise”. 2x Mi-24 Hinds flying low close to terrain fought an F-15.
The F-15 being an early variant, could not radar lock the Hinds, never could get into a position to lock and send his AMRAAM AIM-120C thus had to get close to use his Aim-9X sidewinders… He got shot down by one of the Mi-24 pilots.
" A few times, Lt. Éva ‘Vivi’ Horváth, the female pilot of one of the Mi-24V’s was able to keep a firm “target lock” on an F-15 in the gunsight, while the pilot of the Eagle (as later confirmed in the debriefing sessions), was completely unaware of being directly aimed at.’"
(source)
The point here, is that radar and locking mechanisms in war thunder both on jets and ground spaa are complete and utter propaganda bullcrap.
The fact that I can fly amongst trees and get detected+locked+shot down by an Ozelot is just simply braindead
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Aim-9X is an IR missile aint it?much more modern than the stinger of an ozelott. And according to the Americans not even with the Aim-9X did they always have the conditions for a launch.
So you telling me that an F-15C struggled to lock and lunch aim-9X missiles on Mi-24 helicopters close to he ground, but an ozelot firing from ground to basically ground is realistic… sure bud
And the Stinger is looking against ground or against sky? ;)
in my case mostly ground. almost rolling. so it not “looking at the sky”
Iberian castle and Kursk where I had these “ground-to-ground” locks
not to mention and correct me if iam wrong but jets don’t have any problem locking and launching IR missiles at helicopters flying close and slow to the ground…independent of the background…
altho I never paid too much attention to this previously so I might be wrong on this one.
While IRs dont care whenever target is or is not against sky or ground, the heat from engines will present “easier” target against sky as air is generally speaking more cold than ground.
Also if this is the helicopter in question notice it doesnt have HIRSS nor the IR dazzler installed.
So it makes even less sense the AIM-9X was unable to “track”.
yes thats the one. “shot down” 2 F-15’s, thus receiving two yellow marks
that’s according to the Americans. So I have no reason to doubt it.
Juat sayin it doesnt have its counter ir missiles gizmos installed.
i know. Reality often differs from brochures
Moreover remember Bennyvee (streamer, former aviation weapon specialist, US airforce) speaking about how unrealistic spaa radars are vs low-flying helicopters. So, my guess is radar was never correctly implemented to begin with.
So its not a far-fetched notion, especially with this exercise in mind, that a lot more in this game is completely unrealistic than just spaa radar
No. I can pre-flare igla/stinger/strela. You are just not doing it correctly. You are going to have a seriously hard time flaring a missile thats already tracking you however as these are advanced missiles with IRCCM.
