As someone with a fair bit of experience of 6.0-7.0 tanks, some with and without HEAT-FS, I agree. HEAT-FS is unreliable and not as good as APHE.
The Tiger IIs are excellent tanks for their BR, and the most deadly vehicle that they can face are later IS series tank. Those can pen the turret and easily overpressure them, while everything else only kills 2-3 crew.
Missiles and HEAT shells, even while having the same warhead type, do not behave the same in-game. Why? I do not know.
They just don’t.
I have a lot of games in Rank 4 vehicles using all kinds of vehicles. I’d still take APHE over most shells up to 8.0 lol
ATGM, even with the same Warhead, seems to behave better than HEAT: deals more damage, it’s satisfying to see it penetrating and most of the time doest struggle with Tracks or additional objects in the vehicle.
Heavy dies to >200mm APHE, solid shot, or big HE shell: I sleep
Heavy tank player dies to >200mm HEATFS: REMOVE THEM FROM THE GAME, MAKE THEM ALL 11.7!!!
Do you know the IKV-72, a 1.7 tank put into service in 1952, in your logic the tank would therefore move to the same Br as the T-54 ? In fact most of the Swedish tech tree would be unplayable with a historical battle rating
Just imagine Grumpy’s shock when T-34s get moved up to 11.7 (there are T-34s still in service with the North Korean military), the Po-2 gets moved up to 8.0 (was used in the Korean war against F-86As), the MiG-17 gets moved up to 13.7 (it’s still in service in Uganda, Madagascar, and North Korea), etc.
That would be incredible
(the Strikemaster was introduce the same year as the F-15, just imagine the duel)
Pvkv IV fighting Object 279 would be tons of fun!
I love the ratels even if they are shitbusses. Another example is the Chinese pt 76 that had heatfs and new players can’t even get anymore because it was too bad and replaced with a conventional aphe firing but marginaly bigger gunned obj 211. Heatfs is overated.
Indeed. It’s odd how some things which seem identical work differently depending on what ordinance they’re on.
I have this idea as to why certain players perform poorly in War Thunder. You sir have provided an excellent example.
You expect your vehicle to do all the work and you have no respect for the people beating you, and worse you assume the only reason you are losing is because people are being underhanded. You have unreasonable expectations as to how your tank should perform. Worse you seem to think it’s the developers responsibility to change the game to suit your poor playstyle.
The fact that the Tiger II has a 150mm upper frontal plate is inconsequential. As a result of balance, basically every tank is bracketed by the vehicle it made obsolete at the lower end, and the vehicle that made it obsolete at the top end.
I suspect HEAT-FS isn’t even the real problem, if they heat slingers didn’t get to you first it would be hellcats ammo racking your turret bustle that you’d be here complaining about, maybe even
T-34-57s.
If you want armour meta play the KV-1 L11 at 3.7 where you mentality and playstyle has a slight chance of being successful.
It’s not my logic, that’s simply what my grandma would have called reality:
It’s funny, when I started playing the game in 2018, I had the impression that the time frame for the vehicles was right and the players accepted the challenge. If I had known then that the crybabies were working in the background, I could have saved a lot of money and time.
Gaijin tried historical mm a couple times and it doesnt work. No one wants to fight tigers with 75mm shermans.
As I’m said before, it worked because the players because the players got information on the internet about how the tigers were actually fought by the shermans…
Putting them in battles against their contemporary counterparts just wouldn’t be fair.
Such’s life!
Ned Kelly
Assuming we’re talking about the same profile here.
Your top two vehicles are both the King Tiger. Counting King Tiger matches alone, you have a total of over 3000 matches in that ONE vehicle. That’s insanely boring and I will never have any vehicles played that much simply because I diversify my gameplay across every tech tree and rank.
I would also like to point out that you’ve got a reasonable win rate in the Tiger IIs and are approaching a 2:1 k/d but in most other vehicles your performance is about 1:1 in the k/d. If anything I’d say that the performance of the Tiger II is doing a lot of the heavy lifting.
Also, I’m not bringing up the stats to make you self conscious, feel free to look up mine and make fun of me because they’re nothing special. I do still think your approach to the game is holding you back. The Tiger II was my first premium heavy and and I was learning to play the game back in 2015 when I first started playing it. The player I was 9 years ago can relate to a lot of your sentiments but they’re just not facts and the sooner you let them go the better your experience is going to be.
@Константинович7 re:
Same Warhead, almost same BR,
What I mean is Ratel 20 is only usable* with the MILAN missile in its BR where, in my perspective, is mostly populated by heavily armored vehicles, which means the 20mm GI-2 turns to be mostly a secondary weapon,
I’m comparing the D1508 L/51 with the MILAN only on the penetration power, even though MILAN has around +100mm penetration values.
Ratel 20 is the Ratel 90 with a secondary 20mm cannon and a 103mm HEAT launcher.
It seems strange this comparison, that’s why I just accepted that “there’s no comparison”.
Probably getting side-tracked here but let’s do a quick comparison.
I don’t know anything about either of the shells composition in real life, I’ve only seen a handful of cutaway heat shells and atgms for training. However, the MILAN has double the payload of the OCC 105 F1. As far as the game mechanics go, that instantly tells me that when firing against the same thickness armour plate, the MILAN will have more destructive energy post pentration, additionally I would expect the 1.83kg explosive charge to have a HE destructive performance equivalent to about 23mm of armour penetration.
To me the difference in performance seems pretty obvious when you compare the two like this.
Which is meaningless when it comes to post-penetration HEAT jet damage in game.
Damage on HEAT rounds (and ATGMs with HEAT warheads) depends on a few things like the residual penetration and how much the HEAT round overmatches the plate of armor.
Explosive filler is not it. The only thing explosive filler does for HEAT is related to overpressure.
I meant the extra penetration, you are correct
Attempting to gaslight others isn’t reasonable just cause they state a reality you disagree with…
Realism and balance matters more than wonder-weapon fanatics’ desire to destroy inferior equipment.
Excuse me? I may be a bit older, but I grew up with electric light.
After reading all the posts, I think the game should instead balance vehicles based on the particular player’s playstyle lol