Giving 3,7 cm Flaks the H-Pzgr L´Spur

[Do you want it?]
  • Yes
  • No
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I would like to suggest to give the 3,7 cm H-Pzgr L´Spur HVAP/APCR round to 3,7 cm Flak (36,37,43 and 44) guns such as found on the Sd.Kfz 6/2 (really not needed here at 1.7, its just an example) Ostwind, Ostwind II and Flakpanzer 341 and perhaps future vehicles like the s.W.S mit 3,7 cm Flak 43.

Such H-Pzgr or Pzgr 40 is allready found in the german tree on the 15, 20 and 30 mm Flak guns, but not yet on the 37mm Flaks. In the russian tree the ZSU 37 at Br 3.7 also got such an APCR round and other nations have strong guns in the first place such as the 40mm Bofors L/60 and L/70 in the american, british, french, swedish, japanese, chinese tree wether it beeing licence build or developed upon guns with penetration ranges of 72mm to 96mm at 10m with full bore ammo which is good at angles unlike APCR

Starting allready in mid war germany was in dire need for more AT guns, so all AA guns were dual purpose, to fight against planes and tanks. As such Ap ammo was given and the Bk 37 was only loaded up with H-Pzgr,

but ground crews also got their hand on such ammo, recongnisable by the White Aluminium, Magnesium cap. It is allready found on planes with the Bk 37 such as the Ju 87 G-1 and G-2, the Hs 129 B-2 and Bf 110 G-2. As well as Flakpanzers were to follow tank collums and had to protect semselfs as well as fight back if no enemy plane was in sight.

The H-Pzgr L´Spur:

37mm 0,410 kg 1150-1170m/s and a penetration of 110-113mm at 10m

It could be added in a mixed belt of HVAP-T Aphe HVAP-T Aphe like on the 20mm guns or similar configurations.

A picture of a Replica:(Click to show)


Characteristics and Drawing:(Click to show)


Ap and Aphe rounds are colored black while HVAP rounds have a white Aluminium Head

In this picture is a 3,7 cm Flak 36 or 37 in an Dug in position Loaded with the visible white H-Pzgr ready to engage targets.

Overall used against enemy armor:

Department of the Army Pamphlet No. 30-4-4 Forgeign Military Weapons and equipment (U) Volum I Artillery (U) also states the H-Pzgr for the Flak 43.

Screenshot 2024-04-18 191304
Screenshot 2024-04-18 191350


That’s the color code for Luftwaffe plane armament.
Every 3.7cm Explosive round has a white fuze as tip…

Or with visible explosive ammunition, which is a lot more likely.

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We will never know, either way the guns may very well recive the ammo in game.

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Why? So that they can run around killing more medium and light tanks than actual medium tanks?

You may very well take a look at the 40 mm Bofors or 61-K and ask for their Ap-T, or of the Apcr of the 61-K. This may not be your opinion, but you dont need to go after me with it, i dont share yours and i dont care for yours.


I would say yes, but reserve it to higher tier vehicles where many heavy tanks are already present.

Indeed. The Sd.Kfz. 6/2 certainly doenst need it, perhaps the naval Pzgr (can be allready found in game on ships) as an alternative.

And how exactly would that be different? Or even work?

Yeah, the 6/2 really doesnt need neither. Perhaps some future slightly higher Br AA (like 2.3 or 2.7 like the swedish)

and if the dear gaijin devs want source that it used it i have DECLASSIFIED source

german version of the Flak 43’s Wiki page. for some reason the translators for the english version didnt care about putting the ammo list in there.

Wiki is not a Source, anyway.


No please. We already have a serious problem with SPAAs continuing to go up in BR due to their effectiveness against tanks. We need SPAAs to be effective vs planes, and they get less effective the higher they go

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That’s right <3

Don’t turn SPAAs into TDs.

I understand your point, but the increase of certain AA didnt include a change of ammo. Also, not every vehicle is in need, of course ballancing is not left out, i also made another suggestion for the navy Ap ammo, the H-Pzgr would mostly help stuff like the Ostwind II and above, the Ostwind would allready be able to effectivly defend itself with the Navy Ap round.


How many countries use the 40MM Bofors guns? Sweden, France, Japan, USA, China. all of which have 70+mm penetration power. meanwhile the ostwind has 49mm. the Bofors can effectivly kill panthers/tigers from the side, meanwhile with the ostwind you will struggle with a T34’s (Rus) side, if hes not perfectly angeled. my proposition, nerf the APHE a little bit but give them HVAP too.

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How would you nerf the APHE? It’s IRL stats define its performance in the game so that would be hard to do that way.

i got a book with pen stats. in the book it sadly doesnt specify wich gun exactly it is talking about but there the pen stat is worse than what it is in game. so id say take some penetration of the APHE round but add HVAP/PzGr40

Sadly I don’t think that’s going to be possible. Gaijin now uses their own penetration calculator which takes into account such things as caliber, weight, muzzle velocity, explosive filler and if it is capped or not. This is used on almost all conventional projectiles so that each projectile is judged by the same criteria and projectiles that lack conventional penetration tables can still be implemented with a pretty decent authentic representation to what they may have had in reality. It’s not perfect though, which is why you see small discrepencies in penetration on some projectiles in the game compared to reality. But overall the penetration formula is fairly accurate, but it does fall a bit short on some of the smaller caliber projectiles.

i just meant it as a suggestion so that they have less to B*** about when it comes to balancing the tank.

big no-no for me. AAs should look at the sky, and everything encouraging them to ignore planes and focus on ground target is to be avoided. We see how broken afv turned aa can be (lol sweden) and how much players will avoid being useful and go kill themselves on enemy tanks and then leave if they don’t succeed. What should be done is removing or limiting heavily any aa anti-tank capability. You want to play an auto-canon against tank? The game doesn’t lack afvs, so go play them. If aas were balanced regarding their at capabilities, they would be 1, 2 or even 3 br higher than what they currently are.

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