Buying Top Tier

Game Discussion Realistic Battle
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Open Discussion, is it a problem?

My stance on it:

No, and here’s why.

No skills you learn in low tier transfer to high tier.

Ground
-All of your turrets are stabilized.
-L A S E R Rangefinder does the work for you.
-Nearly every 10.0+ Tank has thermals.
-The vast majority of all high tier vehicles get penned by whatever dart round the other tank has from the front. No need to shoot the weak spots, speaking of which…
-Nearly zero weak spots need to be taken into account from nearly any angle. With some notable exceptions.
-High Tier has a large number of mechanics that low tier will not teach you in the least bit. Such as UAV Drones for Light Tanks, Guided Missiles and SPAA Functionality.
-CAS is a whole other beast. Pantsir SPAA, standoff distances, guided munitions, the list goes on. You learn absolutely NONE of that as CAS in lower tiers.
-Helekopter Helekopter… PAAARAKOPTER

Air
-Radar, et. all.
-SARH/ARH/IRCCM/Notching/Flare Patterns/Multipathing. You learn NONE of this, gain no useable experience at low tier.
-Roleplaying as a Vaccum Cleaner to even get close enough to fight unless you play a long range AMRAAM jouster. Low tier teaches you to climb. Boom and Zoom. This is deadly for most jets at top tier.

So, from a premium player and a top tier enjoyer, why the hate?

If your going to bring up one death leavers, there’s a topic for that. Whales are gonna whale. Add more premiums so whales can have a valid lineup. Currently only Russia and Sweden offer anything remotely competitive at the 10.0+ BR range.

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Yes, but only because of inexperienced players decreasing the average skill level. In air it’s also led to way more toxicity between players.

In ground that is completely false. You won’t learn anything about positioning, or anything about maps. It leads to players who don’t really know that much about tank combat.

It’s 50/50 for me. You won’t learn much about top tier functions by playing 8.7, but making your way up the tree is a good way to slowly expose you to new features and aircraft performance levels.

However, the current 16v16 environment helps inexperienced players more than experienced ones due to making personal skill less relevant. It has made high tier air infinitely worse.

Experienced players dislike noobs in their matches, and for a good reason. They lead to lower quality matches, and a less enjoyable experience for players who want to play a team game.

I don’t have that much of an issue with that, tbh. I’d rather someone leave after 1 death and 0 kills, then 3 deaths and 0 kills.

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Toxicity is a thing experienced at every tier of the game. As for decreased skill levels, I agree. New players seeing top tier for the first time in a shiny new tank can lead to some frequent losses. But I would argue that if said new player sticks with top tier it won’t take them long to learn.

Several ground maps aren’t shared across low/high tier. Map knowledge is also heavily influenced by your tank of choice. Your not going to brawl in a 2S38. I would argue playing as a team is more advantageous than knowing every cheeky sniping spot on the map.

High tier air is an absolute mess as it stands. I wont disagree with this statement, only say that we need Air RB EC even more.

Fairly biased opinion. I don’t dislike noobs, if someone says their new to the game or has a low level and asks for help (Rare, I know.) I tell them to stick with the team and fight with them. Easiest way to learn is to play with people who are competent.

While I agree with some of your points, the only thing you can really draw a point towards is map knowledge in your counter. Something that will take a new player a week or two to learn, honestly. And that isn’t too bad.

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General knowledge of the game, maps and crew skills themselves.

Hate is a strong word.

not the only reason sure but Premium spam and ODL are linked

the only nations competitive 10.0+?
nah other nations have insane kit between 10.3-11.3

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Not referring to the entire tech tree of a nation, but rather what’s on offer for premium’s at 10.0+

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that makes your opinion worse not better

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Disagree. Like I said, whales are gonna whale. ODL is an issue because said whales cant spend more on multiple vehicles.

You don’t have this issue with Russia or Sweden, why? They have 2+ tanks on offer that routinely go on sale twice a year. Russia has 4+.

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In Ground you go from tanks that can actually tank hits to tanks that fairly reliably one shot due to both their higher accuracy and better shells. So lower tiers are more forgiving for learning maps and proper strategies for how to move and such. But not going to comment overly because im bad at ground :D

Will comment on this more.

At lower tiers, like props and early jets, you learn how to fly and fight an aircraft, energy managent, situational awarness etc etc. Players become to reliant on the radar to find targets at top tier, and learning to use the Mk1 eyeball is a valuable skill.

As you progress down the tree, you learn new skills incrementally.

How to use IR missiles and how to defeat them without flares (8.0)

How to defeat IR missiles with flares (9.0)

At 10.0 they get more advanced with all-aspect seekers so you learn to pre-flare and also you get early SRC radars.

At 11.0 you get more advanced radars and early SARH missiles. Teaching you how to use these more basic radars and missiles.

Thne you learn how to defend against IRCCM missiles and more advanced radars. Skills like Notching and chaff become essential.

Then you learn how to defend against ARH missiles

then finally how to use ARH missiles.

Jumping straight from a Spitfire Mk2 into something like a Tornado F3 or Typhoon would be overwhelming for most and from someone who plays Sim, so not wholely relevant for an discussion about RB, but not irrelevant either. TKs are a menace, quite often by premium players that dont think missile shots through. They just fire and assume. I’ve been TKed too many times in both gamemodes from people who had no idea how to use their radars or just assume the IR missile would track one target and not he other.

The learning curve between 8.0 and 14.0 is fairly steep, and skipping it just causes chaos.

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The higher accuracy and better shells makes my point. High tier is nothing like low tier, you don’t angle, you don’t learn weak points. Lower tier learning maps is a valid point, as was made above by another user, however - learning maps doesn’t take a horribly long time. That’s my only counter here.

Several of which you don’t need to learn when you swipe a credit card, buy a 23ML, and watch a youtube tutorial. The rest is exposure, which takes less time than one would think. I have a friend that joined 2 months ago, grabbed a SU25 premium, and now fly’s out his SU27 and gets reasonable matches in it. He’s level 96 now.

People joining war thunder and buying a top tier premium jet typically know what they are signing up for, is my experience. I see a bunch of people joining customs at low levels and building skill with their premium of choice before flying out in Air RB.

Sure, but we aren’t talking about the Typhoon, we are talking about the F4S, or the Mirage F1C. Slowly building up your skill makes you die less, sure, but top tier Air RB is a chaotic mess even for the most skilled of pilots.

This I can sympathize with. I play SIM frequently as well. However, I have also seen a vast number of newer players actually ASK about IFF and how it works, and the chat’s usually quite helpful. Our experiences differ on this I can tell.

I agree it’s a steep curve, however, the best way to learn is to get thrown into the arena, not babied one step at a time. Gaijin needs to make money to survive, we need to erase the stigma of newer players in the top tier environment.

You get more flies with honey than vinegar, helping newer players rather than shutting them down as I so often see in RB chat would go a long way towards building our community in the right direction.

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Absolute top tier stuff, shoudlnt be added imo, anything with ARH is a recipe for disaster, but at a bare minimum. Mandatory tutorials should be required before you can play a public match. How many TKs could be prevented if everyone had to complete a tutorial on how IFF worked before entering a Sim match at higher tiers

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SIM in general is a forgotten game mode, and it’s sad. It’s genuinely my favorite mode out of them all. But I agree, some mandatory SIM tutorials would go a long way towards reducing the amount of teamkills.

That being said, My AMRAAMS have claimed the soul of many of victims in blue, teamkills still happen. Especially if you launch and an ally you didn’t notice or wasn’t on your TWS merges with the enemy.

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Yes, accidents happen. They can never be totally avoided. But the amount of Tks from something like an F-4S is rather insane. Im not saying its always premium aircraft, but certainly makes up the majority.

I think there is real value in learning as you go down a tree for fairly basic things and incremental learning. and whilst im not totally opposed to higher tier Premiums, its pretty clear the issues it can create.

Another point not mentioned for ground, its not a single vehicle gamemode. If you’ve just bought a premium tank and have nothing on the TT to go with it. What do you use when you die? There are certainly solutions to this, like giving premiums an unlimited back-up. But short of buying multiple premiums, you are most likely going to be 1DL most of the time, which creates its own issues.

Suffice to say. Premium vehicles have flaws, that need to be addressed, whether that is via changes to how things like back-ups work for them, adding mutli-vehicle packs like we’ve just seen in the last update or add far more detailed tutorials which have a degree of requirement to be completed before public play is allowed but also some improvements/clarity on tooltips and stat cards as they are often full of half truths which cause much confusion. Much of the game still feels like it was designed for Spitfires fighting Bf109s and not Typhoons fighting F-15s

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My Counter: Unlimited backups. A great idea there. Ground works great for this, if you have the points you can spawn.

Air however, needs Air RB EC. Straight up.

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Oh god yes, forget about premiums. Most TT aircraft would benefit from it.

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Are you arguing that premiums with ARHs shouldn’t be added ?
If that’s the case, I think one mandatory tutorial on how those thing work would massively help with TK issue.

Regarding skill, I believe top tiers jets are much easier to get into than props or early jets and I’m saying this as a fairly inexperienced pilot.
Getting something out of a MiG-15 seems much more difficult than from a 13.0+ jet with ARHs.

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Only get frustrated when it’s my team suffering from the low level noobs, otherwise I enjoy free kills.

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A little late for that

So is arguing against top tier prems in general since the XM-1 in 2018, and soon as top tier bundle packs arrive: it’s over

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Looks over at the 4 man squad of lvl 3-8 players with 1 premium jet and 3 reserve props. (Then watch as their premium jet crashes on takeoff)

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Allow players to buy premiums one, or maybe two, ranks above the highest ranked vehicle they own.
Allow players to buy top tier premiums as test drives for a day or two if they are not eligible to buy them yet.

Healthy for gameplay, profit for Gaijin.

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I just hope Gajin will start selling top tire ground with like 3 vehicles so that people can learn to play and even grind efficiently. More people in top rank, more fun games will be…

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