yu
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Last i checked the T90 isnt significantly different to an export T90.
Optics, thermals, ammo layout, armour, engine snd transmission are all the same.
What are you saying here ? The vickers ml1 is based.off the vijayanta? Cause the way your sentence is worded thats what it means.
Or do you mean that the indian army supplied a requirement field for vickers to produce the vijayanta?
Because it is based entirely off of a vickers mk1 tank, with some slight modifications.
Again, optics, armour, ammo layout , ammo choice, engine, transmissions etc are all the same as a vickers mk1.
on top of all this I’ve stated before and will again, slight variations of minor things does not suddenly make a vehicle unique.
The T90 Bhishmah is still functionally the same as T90A with no ircm and mango instead of 3bm60.
The gameplays the same.
The same goes for the vijayanta its gameplay is identical to tbe vickers mk1 in game.
The Vijayanta is just the Indian name of the vickers MBT, which the Indians heavily influenced the design development for (IE it was a completely new tank from what was originally proposed by vickers when sniping the contract off the Germans).
edit: as i posted just earlier…
Also the T90, the initial “offering” of a tank vs what the Indians got - completely different turret, completely different engine, modifications to internal systems to help with the climates it was expected to fight in. The T90A is based off the T90 development that was made with Indian involvement IIRC, so technically the Russians copied the Indians there one could say ha (IIRC similar happened with the SU 30mki development timeframe).
Basically, these tanks existed in their form BECAUSE India was involved, they didnt exist first THEN India got involved.
M2k, Su-30 and Mig-29K are all 4th gens
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The Vijayanta is just a vickers mk1 built locally by india, the modifications and thus the specifications came later in its life.
E.G the first series went from Vijayanta to Vijayanta Mk1 with the addition of a marconis FCS.
then as we move to the MK1A, B and I believe C was planned but scrapped.
Also link me some sources, not a youtube video where a guy says stuff like
“Metal box full of smoke and stale farts”
This itself is false, the prototype was built in the UK for global export then a prototype sent to india, in which as far as im aware they changed next to nothing.
Reading the actual sources, the base Vijiyanta is essentially a vickers mk1
the vickers did.
The T90A though was news to me, However its still in game a copy and paste from the T90A in the russian tree regardless if the tank IRL influenced the T90A.
You seem to be glossing over the massive fact of so far all the “indian” stuff isn’t actually unique to India, the vickermk1 was already in game, and the T90A was too.
Once again, India shouldn’t be in Britain because they don’t share common ties.
Israel and India are military partners and share technology. India should be a combined tree with Israel, not Britain.
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put down the cope, it never happen
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Not with that attitude.
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I won’t bother if Indian players want to have an independent tech tree.
But being a subtree of Israel over the British?
Naaaahh… not over my dead body pal.
I really am unsure about that idea.
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Man literally insulting Armoured Archives, likely 1 of more knowledgable historians on British armour both niche and well known out there. (the guy who helped push to remove multiple myths around AVRE, TOG and other tanks)
The guys got his sources linked
Sources: Bovington, Kew, Personel photos, P.Breakspear collection.
Also, maybe watch the video. The Vijayanta, aka Vickers Mk1 were modified FROM BLUEPRINT. The initial design concept offered didnt have the L7 gun, didnt use the L60, had 1 less road wheel per side, less armour and used vigilant missiles. Its a completely different tank built to Indian requirements on cost, weight, mobility and firepower demands.
The initial export design was Vickers 45569T which developed into
46200T, this was “being finalised” after the agreement with India was agreed upon, it would then develop again into
51025T which would become the vickers MBT/Vijayanta, after the agreement was made, with India being the primary target audience of the tank (AKA it isnt a copy-paste, its an Indian joint development/requirements tank lul)
Key points were specifically designed for India, the fact they didnt have the ability to make cast turrets and hulls for example which is why its welded (similar was for the T90 series).
I do wonder, what is your source that the tanks existed before any agreement with India? Given that India was after a tank in the 50s, agreed to work with Vickers in the 50s, and the first tanks were made in the 60s? Given the first vehicle was inspected in the UK with its name on a plaque on the front?
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They’re military partners, and both trees could perfectly fit together. It could simply be a combined tree since Israel and India are great partners and depend on one another.
It is also significantly healthier for the game to combine India into Israel, one of its greatest partners, than to make an 11th independent tech tree.
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Nowadays (and since quite a while) India has much more to do with Israel than Britain. India uses Israeli military tech really a lot, they are close partners in military, diplomatic and political fields, and overall India has much more in common with Israel than Britain. On top of that, Israel has one line in ground and two lines in air to offer to India (which India can very easily fill) while Britain doesn’t have holes to fill but rather lacks some of its own tech.
Ah, and Israel also needs a big subtree more than anyone else, and one with unique stuff and not just copypaste
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Would love to see that TBH it would give Isreal some damn variaty as well as opening up britian to recieve more of its own kit, plus it already has south africa
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For air it would definitely be awesome, tho for ground India would only get one line
How so ?
and still variation for isreal rather than india being jammed into britian totally changing dynamics of lines, E.G the SPAA line randomly has 2 russian spaas, our top tier air prems a mig 21? our squadron vehicles a T90 which plays completely different to the TT stuff?
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Of course
Well the Israeli ground tree has 4 lines, so India would get only one full line (plus some vehicles in the gaps of the others lines)
But how? india has quite a lot of ground vehicles IRl ?
I know, but devs want to keep the 5 lines limit sadly
For air this is just perfect in our case, but not for ground
That’s the downside of a subtree
Unless devs change their mind which they hopefully will
5 line limit? you do realise that theres enough tanks in most trees to create about 6 lines? they just folder sht together.
Hihgly unlikely. I feel like gaijins devs really do not care about feedback they get anymore.
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I know but India would be harder to folder
Tbh ground might be what makes me prefer an independent nation
Would make India a nation similar to Israel, with a balanced mix of copypaste and indigenous stuff, a medium/small air tree and a solid ground tree