Arcade Battle should be changed to pure tank battles

Game Discussion Arcade Battle
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59

To make it more clear.

It has been explained countless times why CAS is such an oppressive mechanic.
I have lost countless of games, just because some player with negative K/D and zero game knowledge just hopped into a bomber and annihilated half of our team. And from that, there is just no recovery.
And this is just a single issue from the many.

I don’t care if a player kills me in a horribly OP tank while i am in a stock (and let’s say awful tank even spaded) tank in a full uptier. The guy used skill and game knowledge to destroy my tank. I still have some way of fighting back. I have killed a tryhard sealclubber B1 ter in a Chi-Ha (the 57mm gun version with 55mm HEAT pen). It was 1 in a 10000 chance, yet i could do that.

On the other hand, i have no realistic chance to fight off a plane in a tank, even in an SPAA.

Recently, i made a full SPAA lineup at 5.0 UK, to test it off how effective they are.

Just watch this:

shot 2023.12.20 17.55.13
shot 2023.12.20 17.55.131920×1080 321 KB

What do we see?
The smaller issue is, that despite me having 9 air kills, a teammate with 10 tank kills and 2 assists gets 50% more score than i do.
With the 9 kill skill bonus, i recieved 1800 RP. Then, in another defeat, with a tank lineup, 6 kills got me 2100 RP…

Now, the bigger issue is, that the only real chance of me shooting down a plane is either when they kamikaze attack me, or, when they fly in a straight line, both only works, when they are within 1200m.
Let’s look at the closer:

1, the kamikaze:
If i am in an open top, they have a very high chance of just killing me before i can kill them. And i am only talking about planes with guns. If they have rockets, or bombs, i literally can’t do anything. They can just quickly aim at me with said weapon, withing a second, and disengege, and they don’t even have to hit me.

2, flying in straight line:
this is when they attack a teammate. The issue is, that by the time i can shoot them down, they already dropped all their bombs/rockets. I literally can not prevent them killing my teammate. This means, i am literally useless for my team.
The ratio of prevented teammate destruction when playing SPAA is bellow 10%, but i’d bet it is bellow 5%.

And all this is when only a single plane is up!

Do you want to know what happens when multiple of them is up? This:

shot 2023.12.20 17.55.08
shot 2023.12.20 17.55.081920×1080 342 KB

And i am a page in, and didn’t even talk about this single issue in detail.

3 Likes
60

I don’t think CAS is that broken, and I play Britain, all we need is to be a block of some sorts to heli spawning at the start.

61

How is it that unfair? Please can you elaborate? It’s not as point and click as some people paint it. Specially at higher tiers where high level SPAA can dunk on planes before they are able to reach the battlefield. Problem is most SPAA players just stay at their spawns waiting for planes, it makes really easy for planes to engage them. However if an SPAA player is able to conceal himself, he can shut down entire sectors of the airspace, One notable example is the Strela 10.

62

just to name a few:

1, The have a 3d space instead of 2d
2, They are much faster than tanks
3, they can safely rearm at a base to their 100% effectiveness, while tanks can’t (and they have to get to a 4, friendly base to get back a single crew member while they cant move)
5, They cant effectively defend against planes, while planes are exactly that. point and click. If you say otherwise, you are either blatantly lying, or don’t understand the game. i used CAS in the recent times for research, and while i am one of the worst pilots, getting kills with CAS is much easier than playing a B1 ter in a full downtier. Like orders of magnitude easier.
6, CAS can decide matches easily, whereas a team that would have won the game now has literally no chance of winning.
7, CAS can get multiple (even 10+) kills at once, or is just a few seconds. Please name me any tank, that can do it consistently, and without the fear of risking their own vehicle!
8, SAPP is in fact, NOT a counter. Good luck hitting a bomber from 4km, when your shells self destruct at ~2km… Good luck against a plane, when they many times don’t die even if a 155mm HE proxy shell explode a few meters away, yet an SPAA dies to a much smaller warhead from that distancee.
At higher BR, CAS also just outranges SPAA, especially, when they just can’t lock onto anything beyond 2-3 km.

And this is just a few.

2 Likes
63

That is factually incorrect, the Pantsir and ADATS far outrange the laser guided munitions that can be carried by planes in it’s tier

That is a half truth, if you reach the stage of CAS curbstomping you, it’s because your team most likely collapsed in the first place, there’s more underlying issues such as map design and vehicle damage models, it isn’t just CAS OP pls nerf.

I do agree with that, and I don’t believe there’s a place for giant bombs in Ground RB.

duh

It literally IS a counter, sure, lower tier SPAA requires more skill, but at higher tiers it’s more balanced. The 155mm proxy shell is another underlying issue, bad modelling has artificially made CAS “strong” we need gaijin to properly model shells and reduce the reliance in RNG to get a kill, this happens a lot in CAS aswell. With tanks eating entire bombs because of the buggy damage model.

64

oh yeah, 2 can maybe do. They are still worthless against any CAS player who knows what they are doing…

Sure. When your team holds a cap, and then someone with 0.5 tank K/D just pushes a button and kills all your team, and the enemy just moves into the cap, and you have no chance taking it back…
Just 2 that i made a video about.

Multiple small ones can do that too…
Or even a single smaller one, onto a cap. Or at 2 tanks repairing. I wounder why nobody tends to help with repairing. Maybe, just maybe because it is a big “hey bomber, please bomb us” sign over them…

Sure buddy. That’s why you have 2 (yes, two) SPAA with positive K/D against planes… And with a big chunk of other SPAA, you have more tank kills than air.
So maybe stop lying.

1 Like
65

I do not play low tier, that’s why,

Removing or limiting bombers would be a start, but it would be dumb removing CAS altogether, this is supposed to be combined arms

A good AAA player will dunk on any CAS anyday, but people like to stay in the spawn. I myself like to first spawn a Tunguska or Pantsir and shoot down heli rushers and planes. If people put thought into their gameplay, perhaps the issue would be smaller.

66

Yet Air is a standalone mode. I personally don’t ask for the entire removal of planes. I just want a second mode without them.

Because they literally can’t move on most maps. Yes, some SPAA are good against tanks, but not frontally. They are just ducks for both tanks and CAS.

And a good SPAA maybe. the issue is that even a braindead CAS player can annihilate an enemy team.
I have 100s, if not 1000s of screenshots of player’s first page of their stats, that either tried to kill me with CAS, or killed me with it.
I almost finished a Java program that can grab their kill and death numbers to average them.
My bet is that their average K/D is somewhere around 0.5 and 0.75.

And it would not go away.

67

Like is fair play that big of an ask? Honestly!

1 Like
68

I believe there’s fairness towards the current system, it needs to be tweaked and spawn costs greatly increased so no more BT5 rush Pe8 Atomic nuke eletric boogaloo back to the hangar gameplay

69

You literally can’t balance it. It will always be unfair towards tankers.

1 Like
70

Such is life

71

@SovietBear4 @O_HOgameplay are you sure you are discussing the same game mode?

72

This is one of the biggest BS you can come up with.

A game != real life.

I do talk about both, but more in detail about arcade.

73

Yes, you do talk about Arcade but not SovietBear4.

Since they closed the old forum this new forum is a complete mess where many of the replies on the Arcade section are meant to Realistic Battles by RB players. They are all over the AB threads talking about stuff that doesn’t apply to Arcade like the importance of thermals or laser ragefinders.

74

Yes.
But the thing i am talking about applies to both mode.

75

There is nothing wrong with what you are posting, you are talking about CAS in AB in the Arcade section, even if it applies to RB, but not the other guy who’s replying about BT5s rushing caps to spawn Pe-8s…

1 Like
76

People ask for tank only Realistic Battles already.

This is a compromise that retains GRB’s playerbase but provides a game mode for people that are die hard about wanting tank only.

This is truly a win win situation. The only people that would be upset are those who play Arcade Ground Battles to grind their CAS which is zero players because Arcade Ground Battles doesn’t use your own planes. If Gaijin want’s to implement a system to allow your own planes as the air “reward” in the game mode then there could be an argument made.

As it stands the air component of Ground Arcade Battles is pointless and arbitrary, as such it can easily be removed.

1 Like
77

Can’t agree. If AB really have changed,what about those SPAAs? The SPAAs will become useless.
And one day you will see 4 M4A3E2 or T95 even KV-220 (or sth other Op tanks like them)keep smashing your team until the match ends.We can’t let this happen.

78

I play Arcade Ground Battles and I don’t want Gaijin to remove CAS from this mode, I want them to improve the mechanic and bring some balance against tanks(yes, I’m a very optimistic person). I’m sure I’m not the only one thinking this way.

Arbitrary, yes, and that is part of what is wrong with it but it is not pointless. SPAAs need targets to kill and the whole CAS mechanic also brings something different to the tank mode, the problem is as in many things in this game Gaijin simply doesn’t know how to balance things.

Start by removing tank type from markers while using aircraft, always spawn enemy aircraft facing each other and no spawning from behind enemy spawn, smaller payloads and no heavy bombers like B-29, etc…