All the time you call people in favor of AF AAA low IQ players, yet here you are flying into an area were enemy fighters are not supposed to go. Sure sometimes an airfield is bombed but normally by non-fighters, maybe after a SEAD mission fighters come in for straffling. But under normal circumstances sane fighter bois do not get near eny airbases. They are too well protected both in real life as in War Thunder.
How can we feel sorry for you dying when you admit flying into the area you have no role to play? Gaijin does not tell you to get near the AF, we did not tell you to go their, and though we do not agree at all, you sound way smarter then flying into the AF AA. Go and hunt some ground units or if your team are well on their way with the other objectives patrol the access to the battlefield to secure the victory.
Remember, it is called War Thunder, not Dogfight Simulator for a reason, get the objectives done by protecting your bombers and attackers and they will win you the match.
Even in '44 the Germans were not fully locked on their airfields, no Airforce is strong enough to patrol an enemy airbase, even if they managed to suppress all AA. It makes much more sense to defend your attackers and bombers, fly CAS, or go on general air patrols to find enemy bombers, attackers or fighters. Sure it is a game, but for the game about a battle, but for the battle no enemy needs to be near your AF.
Yep. I remember a few months back when AF AA was broken and teams weren’t getting slaughtered at their airfield. It was always a few guys that would run to AF whenever they got chased and faced the hard reality that AF AA isn’t going to be their crutch for the 1031385th time in a match. It was also hilarious (still happens now to be fair) when AF campers would run back to base while their teammates were repairing and they would just let their teammates get killed. Some guy in a match recently did that and got his teammate F-104 killed because he’s so used to just running back to AF AA.
A better option instead of removing, nerfing, or buffing AAA is to allow players to switch or choose planes in Air RB rather than be stuck with one aircraft. This gives players options that if there were enemies camping the airfield they can go back and land and switch to a strike aircraft or bomber and try to win on tickets instead. This should be complimented by having more objective based tasks such as destroying entire convoys for a substantial loss of enemy tickets instead of just having each individual AI kill reduce a small amount of tickets. I still believe in strong Airfield AA is needed, but that shouldn’t stop anyone from finding other ways to end the game.
Back in the days AF AA did nothing, there wasn’t much if any strafing going on by some special person who flew around the map with the sole purpose to strafe people on the runway. Yes it did happen, sure, but not by any large amount. What did happen though is when your team basically died and lost map control and most were on the runway repairing/reloading, you will get slaughtered. But imo this is deserved, you lost.
In its current state people can just get hit, crit, and dive to the runway… if you aren’t in a faster plane, they get a free +1 life they do not deserve. Or, they use the AF AA to reverse the situation of them being chased to being the chaser. Great fun bro! Really deserved that “reversal” and guess what, if you reverse them again they just do the exact same thing again, joy.
From the moment AF AA got buffed to its current state it has been detrimental to the gameplay, and especially any form of team play, to cover each other when in a vulnerable position (landed). Now you can just enter your bubble of death and be 99.5% safe from anything.
Modern airfield attacks almost always start with SEAD, which we do not do in WT because the AA is clustered too much and we do not have anti-radiation missiles.
If a team takes out AF AA I have no problem with airfield camping and strafing. But if that would happen every game the AA would just be too weak.
That M163 is a part of convoy slightly to the enemy side of the map. Do you even play the mode?
Do you ever leave your side of the map?
So you’re claiming I can’t even cross the map middle? Well, that’s how airfield csmpers play - always stay close enough to be able to use AF AAA to bait their enemies. Very fair.
And if you think I’m not supposed to go anywhere near AF - OK, I’m not going there anyway because of insta-death zone. Then I’m getting “reversed” and I have to defend vs a guy I was chasing down, who can do that again and again.
And remember - in Fw 190 F8 vs Spitfire Mk IX LF, I have no advantages. If I’m on his tail, that’s my only real chance - I land my shots, or I die.
Then the guy uses AF and I have to run. He’s now behind me and quickly gaining or climbing. Now I can’t touch him and can’t do anything about his advantage. If I try to turn around again, he can easily dodge or as dot mentioned - just do the same trick again.
WHat gameplay purpose does giving bad players such crutch plays?
How does it IMPROVE on anything?
It promotes trolling, malicious gameplay and 0 skill, because to “reverse” via AF you just need to point your nose towards AF.
I have tried AF camping once, in Fw 190 D9. 4 Spitfires died while trying to get me and we won a game we were badly losing 2 vs 5.
How is that fair?
What skill allowed me to win?
Seriously.
they could have just stayed out. are you some sort of magnet or what?
i see what problems you are talking about but there are just solutions so much better.
can you tell me what is wrong with the timer solution i proposed earlier?
and if you really dont like it we could try implementing RB EC, im sure both players who “AF camp” and those who dont will enjoy that game mode more than a cramped deathmatch mess.
Sorry for this, I miss understood and thought you were still talking about AF AAA. I share your hatred for OP AI AA units on the battlefield. Some might be realistic, but Gaijin did buff it too strong through the past years. Gaijin loves us too die to AI AA in general since it gives both the repair penalty and takes away the reward for a real player. Honestly I guess you hate it more then AF AA.
I sure do, we remain divided over the AF AA which you hate and I at least don’t mind and probably even like being part of this game.
Take care, as a ground pounder I will do my best to take out as much enemy AA positions as possible so you can safely dogfight!
What do you like about AF AAA?
If it’s the fact it often saves you, I have seriously bad news.
I’m almost never saved by AF AAA. But I have a simple rule - if I have a reasonable chance to win and then make it back to base - I will just stay and fight. I often engage well into enemy territory (I like to climb at higher speed than most), so I rarely even have a chance to return. And it’s not like I really want.
And guess what, basically in most battles either some guy runs to AF as soon, as I have an advantage, or the battle lasts way longer than it should because someone is circling the AF/using it to bait people/reset the fight.
In some situations several people on my team die to AF AAA because they want to end the match.
I see absolutely no benefit to AF AAA for my gameplay.
And there are also some really fun players who:
sideclimb to space in P-47 D28
dive on my Fw 190 F8
get reversed
since we’re both going 680km/h, they just bolt towards AF and I have no chance of hitting them at that speed with 750m separation and I won’t get close enough before I get pelted by AAA/
Once I turn, they reclimb to space over their AF, since they are generally faster/better climbing and being a above them and choosing a less steep diving pattern was my only chance of catching them anyway (because P-47 is faster at every alt).
SOmetimes it’s a whole squad. 1 guy baits people into chasing them towards AF, the other is hanging over the AF at high alt and dives at people who make 180 degree turn and are below him.
Super fun.
Also Wyverns can basically bomb and RTB before you catch them if they climb over their AF.
And in some maps you can do nothing to prevent enemy ticket advantaghe - Do-335 will be slamming tanks before you climb to 3000m, and if you don’t in a plane that doesn’t turn well - DED.
Same for Wyvern.
And in some maps your friendlies are just outside enemy AF, while you have to fly over half of the map to get to enemy ground targets. Even if you don’t lose on tickets, you can do nothing when enemy ticket advantage is f.e. over 2000 and ticket bleed is making it worse every 30s-1m (yeah I once had ticket disadvantage of 1100 which turned into 1900 very quickly, of course I lost).
Agreed, though I was recently reading the book on the Tornado Gr1 deployment to Iraq, and more often than not, those SEAD missions did very little due to the massive concentration of AAA. It helped, but many JP233s were still deployed despite heavy AAA fire.
Though HARMs would be great. That being said however, AGM-65Ds can easily out range SPAA, seen it done many times in SB, and you can always just loft bombs at an AF to destroy it in SB without even getting close to the AFs, which, with their current buggy health values, does a lot of damage.
(before anyone says this being off-topic, AF defences in both ARB and SB are the same. Changes to one, would definetly affect the other, and I personally want to see a combo of stronger SPAA around an AF, but also smarter SPAA that could be penetrated with the right tactics)
friend your idea does not take into account many cases, such as for example aircraft designed for bombing like Phantom 2, or other bombers designed, which once the bombs have been dropped have to return to the base to refuel, because they have no defense weapons and the The only protection they have is the defense of the airport, therefore YES, the anti-aircraft weapons of the base must be lasers, which will kill you if you get close, and obviously the player who lands cannot stay there forever and must be forced once refueled to fly back and not be able to move around the airfield to not be killed by other players, and vice versa players can not hang around the enemy airfield to prevent people from landing, knowing that the anti-aircraft is not able to shoot them down. because as you can see there is also the other side of the coin, in weakening the enemy’s anti-aircraft guns, which you can then take advantage of to kill easy targets that cannot defend themselves, and your speech is completely one-sided, and doesn’t balance the game. Already now they have weakened them and people take advantage of this and prevent people from being able to land, as happened to me in 8 of the 10 games I played on the spain map, where I with my phantom 2, after dropping the bombs, I’m forced to go back to the base, because I don’t have any defensive armaments and because I don’t have enough fuel to stay in the air, and 3 players were having fun hanging around our base without the AA being able to shoot them down because it seemed like they were being used by blind people, so don’t come and write that you need to nerf them further, because they’re already worth it, and if you want I’ll bring you multiple videos to confirm this.
You can just learn to play it as a fighter, It will be much more rewarding at the end of the day.
In the 150 battles I played the F-4J as a fighter I did not get killed in the airfield a single time.
Also, not running to the airfield every single time you are in a disadvantage creates way more interesting gameplay and situations from where you might learn something.
Always better to die fighting than to run back to the hangar :)
man i played it to unlock the f14 as a fighter but honestly i find the bomber game more smooth and rewarding but the problem is not whether i choose to play it as a striker or a bomber the problem right now is people do that that wants above the airports, and in the airports, it is necessary to balance the thing in both cases, both for those who attack and for those who must use it BUT IN AN APPROPRIATE WAY
Why?
Your team lost all map control, your team has no air presence, what do you think should happen next?
Because IMO you should be losing the game and not get a chance to bore enemy team to death.
because you win the battle in the air, not by knocking down a person who cannot defend himself on the ground, if you don’t understand this simple but significant detail, then you like to win easy, and then why could it be you or someone from your team in that situation, and just justifying yourself by saying (if your team is losing it’s their fault) is too simplistic. the game cannot be unilaterally unbalanced, but must allow everyone to create temporary safe zones that allow the basic mechanisms, in this case landing, refueling and take-off, without abusing this mechanic. if you don’t want to wait and respect this mechanism then the problem is not the AA, but your patience and your unwillingness to approach the game in the correct way, because attacking a person at the airport in my opinion is anti-sporting and cowardly. having said that I think the discourse is taking a vicious circle and we are repeating the same things over and over. until gaijin considers bringing improvements, to avoid abuse on both sides I just think we need to be patient, and accept that there are unfair players.
If someone is on the ground and cannot defend himself - he lost. End of story.
You want what? Magical protection and the more protection the worse someone plays?
I want to fly around with 1000kg bomb on my Fw 190 F8, why am I getting killed mid map?
How is that fair? I want AAA protection mid map too, cause my bomb is just SO BIG!
AF AAA provides absolutely 0 benefit to people who play it fair and honest and are willing to improve. The only thing it’s good at is granting an unfair advantage.
I swapped to ASB because i prefer mud moving and whilst i dont entirely agree with the F4s. Your point is 100% true for Tornado IDS, Jaguars and other Strike-bombers
