.50's deserve a buff

[SpeclistMain1]

@Reisel999

It only takes one well-placed burst on any fighter to render it useless.

This is sarcasm, right?

[Reisel999]

It’s not a joke. A good burst at any part of the enemy plane with the .50 will surely set it on fire.

[Reisel999]

It will also depend on the ammunition you use, as another player said earlier in this same debate, do not expect to split a plane in two with an anti-armor tracer.

[Loofah]

Shouldn’t be worse. Gunners should be more realistic. So no stabilization, and no iron-armed gunners who can shoot.upside down no problem.
But since they aren’t, bombers shouldn’t be any tougher than they currently are.
Bombers are useless in Air RB. So are some fighters. Such is life.
How do you even imagine a mode where bombers are useful and not completely broken?

[SpeclistMain1]

@Loofah

How do you even imagine a mode where bombers are useful and not completely broken?

Spoilered since it's long

@SpeclistMain1

To add to this, here are my suggestions:

1. Make AI gunners useful - On an Aced crew they should be firing at 1.0-1.2km, with Expert 0.8-1.0km, then 0.7-0.8km without Expert. They should also be fairly accurate, due to the general firepower disadvantage bombers have (most bombers can only point at most half of their MGs towards any target, of which the total amount of MGs are usually at most half of the firepower of a fighter).
2. Decrease bomber BRs across the board - Imo, there should be no prop bomber above 6.3 - maybe 6.7. Put the Tu-4 at 6.3, B-29 at 6.0, and move downwards. This will of course require adjustments to the base HP. The jet bombers should also be moved down, especially the ones with little to no countermeasures; the main things that will have to be worked around are the prop-to-jet transition BRs, or putting certain types of missiles too low.
3. Make bombers tankier, they shouldn’t be paper - This applies to every bomber, especially the bigger and slower ones. Short of a 40mm+ cannon, one shots should not happen under any circumstances - and for most types of MGs/cannons multiple passes should be required to take them down.
4. Increase bomber spawn altitude - The current spawn altitude is just far too low, virtually every nation in the game at all BRs have fighters or interceptors that can outclimb bombers. Imo, 5-6km should be the minimum spawn altitude for most BRs.
5. Fix MG bullet spread/ammo and targeting inconsistencies - Generally the bullet spread for bombers is massively larger than for fighters, and this just shouldn’t be the case. Additionally, some bombers don’t have access to their historical ammo belts (iirc), which also makes their defensive/offensive capabilities worse than necessary. Additionally, add the MG targeting system to the B-29.
6. Increase the rewards for attack aircraft/fighters hitting ground targets, but massively decrease rewards for them hitting bases - This will generally just stop attack aircraft/fighters from taking bases at all BRs.
7. Move the jet bomber/attack aircraft spawn be much closer to bases and ground targets than the fighter spawn - No fighter should be getting to a base before a bomber, even a supersonic fighter against a subsonic bomber.

Responses to other people within the thread:

@BleedingUranium

One of the main things we need is a gunner rework. Not just for aircraft, but a rework and unification of the aircraft, ship, and tank gunner systems.

• Gunners should not open fire without prompting from the player (unlike current air/ships)
• Gunners should fire on targets assigned by the player (system already in place with ships)
• Gunners should open fire at far enough range to be a deterrent, but with poor-ish accuracy at range (like vs-ship ship gunners, thus a notable buff to air gunners, but a nerf to vs-air ship gunners)
• Tank secondary AA guns (roof .50s, etc) should be included in the same system

The AI gunners should most definitely fire on their own, and the accuracy of the plane gunners should be made to be as accurate as the AA guns in Naval, tbh. Their accuracy should also be good, to the point where fighters would be 100% shot down without dodging.

PS respond in the linked thread if it’s about the bombers

[Reisel999]

I haven’t read the whole thread, but just lowering the TU-4 to 6.3 is a nonsense. And also raising the spawn altitude of the bombers? Do you want the games to be only Russian TU-4s against the Chinese TU-4? Bombers need a change, but this is too extreme. If you are such a fan of realism, you shouldn’t complain about a B-29 fighting a Mig-15, since it happened in Korea.

[PercussionCap]

Put the Tu-4 at 6.3

LOL

[Loofah]

So in essence, make attacking bombers a goddamn suicide. Only planes armed with MK103 and 50mm have any chance vs Tu-4 and that’s only happening after several minutes of climbing. Everything else Germany and Italy have will be swatted out of the sky from beyond their gun range.
Attacking G8 f.e. is already borderline impossible with most popular German and Soviet guns, as that bomber is flying high and fast, and you can’t tailchase, and remember - bomber hunting is late game activity, so the bomber is already at 7000m, and to have a reasonable chance, you have to attack from above. GL HF.
Bombers even right now are extremely dangerous. Luckily most bomber users have no idea how to use their 3-plane stabilised gunner robots.

Bombers are far from paper. Meanwhile a single Type 99 Mk2 or soviet 23mm shell will rip F2Gs wing clean off.

Attacking bombers is already more dangerous than attacking fighters and requires extreme ammo and time expenditure to not get clobbered. Bomber can almost always return fire. Fighters have to point their nose at you.
And if bomber wants to, you’ll never get close to it, unless you invest entire round trying to get in position to attack…

…only to get 1-shot by AI gunner from outside your own gun range.

Sounds fun!

[NestleKitkat]

When I still has PTSD for 2016 Tu-4 💀

[PercussionCap]

@Loofah

And if bomber wants to, you’ll never get close to it, unless you invest entire round trying to get in position to attack…

…only to get 1-shot by AI gunner from outside your own gun range.

2016 all over again baby

[BACKRAGE44428]

i like these guns just like most weapons in this game they will have funny moments 30 mm cannon shots from 262s if they managed to hit devastated allied bombers leaveing human sized holes in aircraft you can look up photos 50cals do not need a buff they are very accurate at long range and set fire often. German 151s are very inconsistent damage wise on stock belts but are very good other whys

[SinisterIsRandom]

Unless your using Universal belts or tracer, its not good for other such that and due to Gaijin awhile back nerfing them a bit

[DocProfit]

Here’s a Spitfire hit by three 20mm rounds.

[WildWeasel]

No bullet drop? You sure? They’ve been given the MG 151 treatment where they slow down to a snail’s pace past 500m.

[Zyranovos]

Yall really still yapping about this, They do not need a buff

[Zyranovos]

Funny how the tail isn’t missing…

[KillaKiwi]

I’m not sure which cannons or MGs have better trajctory and lower drag than .50cals.

It’s easy to hit with them even at 1km, as they have a very flat ballistic curve.

I once set a He 111 on fire, firing with from 1.5km while being below the bomber.
Outright impossible with some 20mm cannons.

[ZendikarHaven]

@KillaKiwi

I’m not sure which cannons or MGs have better trajctory and lower drag than .50cals.

Maybe the swede 13.2mm? They are just better then .50s in general, I think. Vulcans too, probably.

[Reisel999]

USA CAS main lol

[WildWeasel]

I don’t play GRB