IDK if you’ve been getting Rocky Pillars, but it does extremely well 16v16. Almost as if it was designed around being a PVP all-aspects map.
why i am mentioned?
The problem is that the current 16 vs 16 isn’t a knife fight at all. Its just a mob. You get very few chances to have the knife fight. The crowded nature of each fight just caters to 3rd party kills. Id love a knife fight but rarely ever get one.
Reducing it down to 10 vs 10 on the Non-EC maps certainly would help with achieving that knife fight more often.
I do think reducing it down too much would be a problem too since squads could just take over the lobby but right now its too crowded for the current map designs.
@AlvisWisla Even rocky pillars which i will say is better but still shouldn’t be a 16 vs 16 map. The match still suffers from the same issues i describe above. The match rarely ever ends in a balanced nature.
Especially with fox 3’s coming, we’re probably arguing for nothing here. I think a player reduction is inevitable. I argue in favor of an EC mode to try to maintain something for those people that like the larger matches.
And i also think that Gaijin could use a lot of match mechanics from Ground RB to create a really good Air RB EC mode.
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When 3 or more people meet that is the style of fight one has to fight. Its not really 16v16 specific and its something you have to deal with.
I call it a knifefight, but i guess furbal match would be more appropriate
You also have to remember that Fox 3s won’t be increasing the range of BVR until like BR ~14.3.
Yea but the whole point of this thread is to change what we currently have to deal with…
The furball is inevitable, with current map design. A 16 vs 16 furball is aweful. Let’s at least reduce the size of the furball.
@AlvisWisla id be shocked if we ever got to 14.3 with Gaijin but who knows. As far as BVR range, R-77’s and PL-12’s might actually increase the range. Nobody truly knows the range of these missiles.
Early amraams probably wont increase range but just the nature of them being BVR and highly maneuvering and fox 3’s will change the entire dynamic of the match. Id actually be surprised if Gaijin’s servers could even handle it.
I would say that even my 10 vs 10 proposal might fall apart if everyone has 2-4 advanced fox 3’s.
There are some DCS servers ive been on that have had this dynamic and they are aweful. They tend to get altered pretty fast because its just a death sentence getting anywhere near that many advanced fox 3’s - even if its just Aim120A’s and B’s.
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That’s a misrepresentation of how chaff works. Chaff works the same at sea level as it does at 20km alt.
On a per map basis i can see it as a temporary solution to aliviate a bit. I do however not see it as something that should be applied to the entirety of air RB. It would make properly made maps less enjoyable
What maps in game are “properly made”? I can think of exactly 0.
Technically all maps are properly made, as they’re either based on physical locations or made with gameplay in mind.
However, the newest air map Rocky Pillars is among the best maps for air at all BRs.
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Basically every EC map has a good basis, and possibly some others. I dont know map names outside of City and Sinai
Edit: technically im commenting more on objective layout and diversity, but that is in Warthunder tied to the maps
Please refrain from responding to me in this manner.
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These quips arent typically suited for forum posting. Works in-person or VC tho. Here it just makes it look like you want to start a fire again.
Haven’t actually had the opportunity to play the new map. Have been too occupied with the ground grind.
Im really talking more so for tiers 6 to 8 for this reduction in Air RB team size. The lower tiers its not as much of a problem although i mostly play the upper tiers so maybe im not the best source for the lower tiers. All i know is that the Ju288 ruined 6.0.
While my comment applies to the whole match maker for the most part i was there reffering to top tier.
Id be on board with map specific player limits, but not the whole matchmaker (at top tier).
Removing maps from the matchmaker could probably also work, but i think basically everyone would dislike that.
Crazy idea here to fix top tier ARB:
Reduce playercount to 10v10
Create 2 additional airfield spawns on the map
Spread the objectives out horizontally so it doesn’t force everyone into a giant furball
Done.
That’s it lmao
Just use EC maps, make 3 spawns per side, 10 people per team, objectives, bases and such are spread out so it doesn’t cause a giant furball
Bam. Tornado GR.1 suddenly is a very viable aircraft.
Bam. BVR is actually fun and not some Ace Combat missile barrage.
Furballs become 2-3vs2-3 aircraft instead of team vs team and thus are actually fun.
Bamo, the gamemode is fixed.
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It is not a simulator, it is a game that has sim elements.
Armies don’t have to respect battle ratings to decide which aircraft to send into an operation, pilots don’t have to pay repair costs, it doesn’t take 15 seconds to repair and reload an aircraft on an airstrip,so on and so on.
It’s a videogame. Like I said we could make the craziest matchups of all time because they are “realistic” according to the way you use the word, is that something anybody wants including Gaijin themselves ? Absolutely not, so I fail to see why you bring this up to justify 16v16. If you want to find reasons why WT is not what you think it is, there are plenty like those I cited before.
You can have your “wargame simulator”’ in custom battles or specific events, Air RB is not that
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According to your claim there are no simulators.
History isn’t realism, and realism isn’t history. The sooner people realize that the sooner they’ll understand War Thunder.
Yeah propper objective oriented maps would fix everything. However with that you can do 16v16 just fine. Or even 24v24 or 32v32 on the right map objectives, size and so on. Idk if any maps currently layed out in Warthunder could do 24v24/32v32 justice, but that would have to be tested.
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I wonder how much of the objective overhaul is tied to the AI overhaul they’re doing…