This “advice” was afaik first published post war (late 50ties) without citing any primary sources (actual military documents/orders). All others are just referring to this book about WW2 fighters.
Without an “official” document from military archives it is just the typical hoax, like the claim a P-47 killed a Tiger with bouncing 0.50 cals from below, or that the Germans lost several hundred tanks at the battle of Prokorovka (12.7.43) whilst they lost based on more accurate and current research actually 5 and killed roughly 200…
Btw - i can’t imagine that any central or even local LW HQ would have published such an advise / order - an official acknowledgement of superior enemy weapon systems seems to be unthinkable with regards to the nazi ideology and looks like a perfect recipe to meet a firing squad.
Yak-3U:
Imho not relevant in the historical context as no service in WW2.
Sorry man - you came up with this “dogfight” myth/hoax and you can’t cite any primary source which would support your claim.
In addition you claimed:.
which is just a personal opinion. This is objectively seen not the case; i might agree with “outperformed” below 5.000 meters, but the terminus “outclassed” is reserved for the Me 262 - at least if you would accept Eric Brown as reliable primary source.
So i am not really sure why you are referring to missing primary sources in my response if you can’t support your own claims with reliable data…
Eric Brown might have been a great pilot but some of his claims are incredibly biased. In a british test of a 109 E, he made the following claim:
“at 400 mph with 40 pounds side force and only one fifth aileron displaced, it required 4 seconds to get into a 45 degree roll or bank. That immediately classifies the airplane as being unmaneuverable and unacceptable as a fighter.”
Meanwhile, under the same conditions, the Spitfire required 57lb of stick force. This test was done on a damaged airframe by the enemy. Finnish tests of a G-2 provide much lower numbers.
The german chief test pilot Heinrich Beauvais tried to get in touch with Eric Brown after the war to discuss that (since he had flown more 109s for far longer than Brown ever had or would have), but Brown refused. Make of that what you will.
As for the 262, there’s no contest. Its optimal climb speed is at ~500kph where no piston engined fighter can manage any substantial climb rate.
They either “simply outclass” or they don’t. If real life performance is not significant, why bring it up?
This is like claiming an A6M5 is a better 5.0 than a P-51D30 because the P-51 decided he wanted to turnfight and lost… something they also love doing.
I’m capitalizing on the enemy player being overconfident in their abilities. If they think they can turnfight me, they will turnfight.
i found this page where there is information about almost all yak.
I quote from the page: “On the basis of the Yak-3U, a machine for a different purpose was created - the Yak-U training aircraft”
I have yet to find away to engage yak 3u’s in a conventional way. I either have to attempt to reverse them, which normally fails or… wait thats it… Cannot out run it. Tho, I mostly play the p51d30 at 5.0, it makes sense it’s better. But it’s faster at altitudes which matter, it turns better, it climbs better, its easier to control (better shots). It’s just GGs, like okay? I loose? What could I have done better… used my allies as bait more? I don’t know how anyone can have fun by playing such a busted plane. I know it’s not an OP plane. I’m just coping, but I had to say it. It’s incredibly frustrating to play against.
I’m not a fan of low to mid tier planes but last time i go against it (like 2years ago) i find that Spitfire are very effective against them I don’t know did they change that now
havent played the higher BR Yak 3s, but the base Yak3 is honestly busted at 4.3. the ONLY downside is the wings rip at 660kph.
It has no problem reaching that speed, its ability to accelerate is unmatched even by pretty much everything below 6.0, it holds its speed incredibly well too. It climbs like a rocket (though only to about 4-5000m, though Air RB fights rarely stay at that altitude for long if they even get there these days) It turns well, and though it has kinda low ammo, it has perfectly acceptable armament.
Its definitely not a 4.3 plane IMO.
as for fighting it, best way I’ve found is honestly in the Vertical. It turns well in the horizontal, but not as well in the Vertical,
Otherwise your best bet is to just try and out dive it. (the Base Yak3 at least, I think the 3P and above have much stronger wings and can dive faster, but havent played them yet).
However I found both while fighting it and playing it, as the Yak Pilot watching someone dive away from you, you can just hold some extra altitude, follow him, sit doing a cozy 600+kph because its so absurdly fast, wait for them to run out of altitude to dive to and thus ability to hold their speed, and just re dive on them except now they can’t even run anymore.
If you aren’t in a spitfire or Zero that hard out turns it in every scenario, I find you just have to bank on the Yak pilot either not seeing you coming, or hope he makes a mistake in his engagement.
The LW did not engage yaks under 5km because the yak performed well and agile at low alts, it is NOT because the yaks outclassed the German fighters.
The Yaks ingame are simply overpowered as hell, always been this way since 2013/14.
Outrun you at low alt, outrun you at high alt, pulls energy out of ass.
122 days in a fighter ingame gives me all the experience i need to say the above AND from both sides of the coin, i play all nations air.
The Yaks are my most hated aircraft ingame, unless of course you fly it yourself then it is fine…
For any new players reading this: If you perform poorly in air battles - fly the Yak’s, suddenly you will be able to achieve what you was not able to previously.
Go from being utterly useless and just dying everytime to slaughtering anyone in your vicinity with ease.
If you dont climb at start of match you wont have much chance of doing anything. They are a jack of all. So you need an energy advantage and play to you’re strengths and hope they make a mistake and you dont.
If you’re in a turn fighter they can turn but not as good they need speed to do so, if you’re in a boom and zoomer they can do that but not as good as they cant dive well and they can energy fight not as good, not enough weight due to some wood. They aiso dont have good bottom end acceleration but can hold speed once they got it.
So basicly they have 4 stars in everything but no 5’s
I don’t understand why people are surprised or mad that the yak3s perform well in game. Most engagements happen in altitudes where yak3s engine power doesn’t start deteriorating or just about starting to. I think their power to weight ratio is among the best during the war as it has a very powerful engine yet being very light, it had a small and nimble air frame too just like in game. I don’t think this isn’t realistic nor do I think the lower BR yak 3 is OP. You can readily run away from them in the competitive American props like the p51C10, p51d30 and even the p47d28. I am referring to a top speed chart for props as well as personal experience. It’s the yak3u particularly that’s op, because unlike the yak3 it actually is faster than American props at lower altitudes. You really shouldn’t be expecting your p51d30 to out accelerate a yak 3 at lower speeds of course, but you are generally significantly faster than him. Even in the p51c10. With the lower yak 3 you can actually effectively reverse the plane because it cannot generate power out of thin air as quickly as the yak3u. If you try to reverse a yak3u, and fail to follow up with a killing blow he will just loop over and catch you too fast. Against a yak3 you can normally dive away and separate because like I said you are faster than it.
I performance jump from the yak3 to the yak3u is a massive one, it basically has no weakness other than it’s rip speed. The yak 3 when compared to American props has a lower top speed and of course lower top speed acceleration while not massively out climbing competitive American props (making it so you can shallow climb against them to win an engagement). It’s climb rate is just slight worse than the bf109s, so in that regards its okay too. I really don’t think the yak3 and the yak3u are comparable planes (That being said… against a p51h it’s not really fair for the yak3u… I guess that’s just the nature of an uptier).
You are going to have to expand that I think - looks a lot like “The LW did not engage yaks below 5km because the Yak performed well and agile at low alts, it is NOT because the Yaks performed well and agile.”
Ie it appears you are saying it is because A, and NOT because A…???
Fully agree to your overall assessment regarding the 4.3 version.
I’d like to add that i have zero problems to kill them with a B7A2 - all you have to do is to dodge the headon at any cost. The only countermeasure a Yak-3 has, is it’s way better roll as the B7A2 is quite stiff above 300 kmph. But better roll and acceleration can be countered quite easy - like vs every 190…
Another plane which has small chance to win is a SM 92 - either by dragging them way above 6 km and make use of your better handling (mainly due to larger wing area and infinite WEP without MEC >6km) - the amazing zoom climb ability of the Yaks is useless high up as soon you force them to make 1 or 2 turns - the decrease of turn ability combined with way less engine power is amazing and kills their main advantages.
Another strategy which worked (sometimes) is a high speed (above 500 kmph) flat turn fight at ground level - the speed is too high for them to use flaps and SM 92 flaps rip around 550. Works only in 1 vs 1 and if the Yak-3 sticks to the fight - it takes a while, but you get as his six.
Imho you and some other posters nailed it: It was a plane optimized for low altitudes and had (like P-39s and P-63s) speed and handling advantages vs the LW fighters which were optimized for combat a higher altitudes. For example the VVS P-39s were used until the final days of WW2 as they were still a very capable and competitive fighter at lower alt.
I cleaned my basement the last days and found a lot of time for “reading breaks” of WW2 biographies and memoirs stored there.The main combat approach of the LW vs the VVS was BnZ - and not turn fighting - they learned that whilst fighting I-16s and I-153s in 1941. Actually comprehensible as they fought more or less always outnumbered 1:10 (early) or 1:20 (late war).
According to Krupinski’s memoirs/biography the local LW HQ’s even refused to acknowledge (at the beginning) the existence of an aircraft called “Yak-3A” - even as he described their ability to turn extremely tight to avoid BnZ attacks. He described a BnZ attack in which he bounced 2 Yak-3s. Going for their leader his desired victim was able to dodge his attack when he was in gun range -in a turn he could not follow. Peppered by the wingman he had to run and evade their fire until he crossed the front line - as VVS fighters in general refused to follow above enemy territory… Mid 1944…
The D-30 is faster at all altitudes, but it has lower acceleration due to its weight. The 4B Corsair and Bearcat are also faster, but none can match it in climb rate - aside from the Bearcat, and only really at low alt.
Btw - the loot boxes brought a Yak-3T (BR 5.0) event plane. Despite i have no access to the market place and won’t use it anyway: Is this plane worth any time to invest (based on yt vids an “upgunned” 4.3 with a 37mm and 2 x 20mm with the same weight according to data sheets in the old forum) and what is the current market value of it? Thx in advance!