Why is Germany doing so bad - quick overview of WW2 BR range

Game Discussion Realistic Battle
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162

Roof shot BTW is the proof of the game being broken.
You essentialy hit the upper edge of 185mm plate and the front edge of angled 40mm plate.
IRL the shell would be deflected up and fly away. In WT it keeps going straight, ignoring the bottom keeps hitting the 185mm plate where there’s nothing above, it keeps going straight plowing through like 1m of 40mm plate till the game decides it penetrated then boom dead.

Such shot is 100% impossible IRL.

Meanwhile 75mm KwK 42 to T-34-57 with early turret, you hate edge of 2 45mm turret plates and shell magically disappears, because the game decides it keeps going straight through along relatively thin metal plate - but since it goes along, the plate counts as over 200mm of armor - IRL it would deflect slightly to the left or right and cave that 45mm turret front in either way.
Yet when a shell clearly penetrates a few hundred mm LOS KT roof without getting deflected - all is fine.
Volumetric improvement MY …s

163

Yeah, for sure.

Solid shot rounds are insanely gimped because WT works the opposite of real life. In real life killing the crew is less important than disabling the tank, so any penetration is enough. In WT every component can be repaired except for the crew. Fire hazard aside, vehicles are functionally immortal so long as the crew is alive.

APHE does a nonsensical sphere of death post pen effect.

Rounds that are supposed to be good against angles but bad against flat plates are just good against both.

Aside from HE-VT, we have no variable fuzes, so HE and HEAT-FS get constantly defeated by fences.

We could go on for hours. End of the day, it’s just a game. Yeah, it’s BS for an 85mm to kill me through the roof, but it’s also BS for my Pz.Gr APHE to nuke a Tortoise through the cupola or for my armour to have excellent quality steel, so all’s good.

If any of these things were revised, BRs would look quite different, which at least is an interesting thought exercise.

164

Ju288 C (I know, it’s premium, but still) is amazing.

And then there is Do335/Ar234, etc. But overall - one of the reasons we’re winning so many games as Germany is because the allies keep jumping in CAS. CAS don’t cap. Heck, I got a nuke the other night because allied CAS kept feeding my SPAA. The only thing Germany lacks CAS-wise is a lack of ground damage in the Me 262s guns (and they’re mostly 7.0 onwards). Not a single AP round in their belt.

1 Like
165

234 is very OK, but 0 armanent other than bombs, and if enemy has a plane higher up, you’re toast. Do-335 is an absolute brick and I hate it and is also a premium.
288 is a very expensive premium and not worth discussing.
262 with 50mm is effective, but it scores assist after assist because unlike 45mm, 50mm fires APHE and not tiny nukes. But it can 1-shot IS-2, so there’s that.
9UT is better in every way. US have this Zuni spammer that will slaughter entire team, AU-1 (premium) which can do the samewith extremely big bombload, and then this AD-4 which is also extremely effective.

166

They nerfed the KT105 to oblivion already and the Coelian and Panther at 7.0 is also pointless, a gun found at 5.3 and a chassis from 6.0.

167

It was just 50% off.

Lol. No. Zuni are great, but it’s not winning them games.

Issue with German teams is their unwillingness to use SPAA. They’ll keep spawning Tigers, etc, even when situation calls for SPAA.

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168

Skill issue. All 3 - KT 10.5, Panther 2, 341 are fantastic at 7.0. 341 is overpowered, still. Also, if all you think Panther 2 is a Panther G/F with just an 88, you’re mistaken.

2 Likes
169

Deleting 70% of it’s explosive filler is a massive nerf to a vehicle which only quality is the ability to one shot things.
341 is good but 7.0 is a bad BR, same for the Panther.

170

It’s a great BR. Especially since 341 can delete things like IS-4 frontally:

At 8.0, most MBT are easily killable. Here’s a nuke at 8.0 using the 7.0 lineup:

If you have 10.5, Panther 2, 341, 7.0 is a great lineup.

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171

Yeah, for like 2 seconds until all its energy is just gone.

Take any of these 4 planes depending on what balance of payload and flight performance you desire.

Fw 190 F-8

Do 335

Fw 190 D-9

Bf 109 G-2

Use Wirelwind or Ostwind, I prefer Ostwind. They’re both undertiered so bringing them to 5.0 works very well.

VK 3002 outruns almost everything, so you can just position yourself where reverse and rotation rate don’t matter. As I said before, the issue is that you’re playing German tanks like they American or Russian.

As for having only one tank, bring Hetzer or jagdpanther 4. They’re both undertiered and perform very well at 5.0 and at 5.7 with my Tiger H1.

Ives pulled some really silly stuff in the Fw 190 D-9 and F-8. They’re far from defenseless, especially if you keep an eye on the enemy air spawn point and go to them before they come to you.

Imo, having autocannons is way better than having an extra bomb or two, just for the volume of kills you can get. Smthn like a P-47 can only get 2-3 kills with bombs unless you get really lucky with grouped up players, and maybe another 3-4 is you’re REALLY good with the HVARs. Compare that so say, C.202 EC where I got 5 ground kills just off of open tops and SPAAs alone yesterday, and I didn’t needa deal with the P-47’s flight performance.

3 Likes
172

I’m an above average player according to Thunderskill, and out of 16 tanks I have played in the 5.3 to 6.7 BR range (Swedish, Japanese, Chinese, British) on this new account, only 6 of them have a positive win rate, and all but one of them has well over a 1.0 K/D ratio. I usually face Germany.

German players are typically inexperienced, but late war german tanks are cracked, and they get to spawn so many of them, where as other nations might have 2-3 good tanks at that BR if they’re lucky. You can spawn 4 Tiger 1s, and 4 panthers, and that’s without getting into the excellent TDs, SPAA, and decent CAS options. You kill a player two or three times and he just spawns the same tank again.

173

Did they nerf Coelian pen back to old values?

174

Also. CAS used to take out the most dangerous players on the enemy team can swing a match, but often people (understandably) just bomb what they can find. Meanwhile, someone who knows what they’re doing can use the relatively emptier ground map to really claw back ground.

While it no longer gets guaranteed overpressure, it’s still APHE, and now it has better pen. Plus the rangefinder, plus the great mobility, plus the reload buff it got last year… it’s still the best King Tiger in the game.

The platform is incredibly important too. Sure the Nashorn has the long 88, but it will never be more combat effective than a Tiger II in this game. The Panther 2 gives you a long 88 that you can bring into a meta position much faster, and you can’t get that with any other vehicle in the game – the Jagdpanther to a degree but it’s turretless and has no reverse.

As for the Coelian, it’s straight up busted.

Agreed. It is ridiculously good. You can basically keep up with M18s over rough terrain.

My advice for the ground side of a 5.0 lineup is to buy the KWI-C (a true downtier monster). PaK Puma if available, regular Puma also works otherwise. One AA as you said. And depending how many crews are left, while JPz IV is a solid choice, I would recommend Dicker/Sturer for occasions where you need a fuck-off gun and you get a hilly map, and the M55 for something that literally doesn’t care about uptiers.

Btw Loofah, one more thing that came to my mind only just now. So on Statshark, they use this system:

immagine

I have no idea how this is weighed, or how reliable it is, but it’s really the only tool available to know how well you’re doing in a singular vehicle vs the rest of the active playerbase – with the in game tools I can’t go look up who’s doing the best in a Tiger II or a Jagdtiger and know how I compare to them. (I wish that was the case, learning would be so much easier).

This SR1 is categorised as follows:

immagine

Now if we go back to my stats with KTs and JT between 6th October and yesterday, this is my SR1 rating in them over that period:

immagine

(Respectively Tiger II Sla, Jagdtiger, Tiger II).

So it looks like I’m nowhere near the ceiling of what can be done with them, and there must be players out there who are doing far better with these vehicles than I am. And it can’t just be a very tiny number of people, because this is a comparative rating.

175

Don’t think so, it just got uptiered to a bad BR and it’s 0.3 away from an M163 or Shilka.

176

Only thing I’ll note is that you can have an amazing SR1 in a vehicle while having only played 1 or 2 battles. For example, I have a 5000+ rating in the Q-5L because I spawned it once and killed one person and that was it… So you don’t how many people are sitting there with super high ratings based off f’all games. Your rating after all those games is very good is something you can be proud of.

341 is 7.0 based off it’s ground killing abilities. M163 and Shukla are better at killing air, but they ain’t out there nuking heavy tanks and MBTs.

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177

If only I wasn’t busy when this thing was still a part of a tech tree…
Man, the whole SA server would be in shambles.

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178

While it no longer gets guaranteed overpressure, it’s still APHE, and now it has better pen.

Losing 70% of the filler to drop below overpressure range and getting 20mm is the worst trade deal in history, name even a single vehicle you can pen now that you could not pen before.

The platform is incredibly important too. Sure the Nashorn has the long 88, but it will never be more combat effective than a Tiger II in this game. The Panther 2 gives you a long 88 that you can bring into a meta position much faster, and you can’t get that with any other vehicle in the game – the Jagdpanther to a degree but it’s turretless and has no reverse.

It’s a less armored Tiger ll with increased mobility, worse turret handling and NVGs that obstruct the barrel, that’s a sidegrade that should be at 6.7.

The KT 105 has a 50% reload penalty to get a better, but now heavily nerfed shell, also a sidegrade and not an upgrade, big cannons are still ass in WT.

Coelian is good, but no need for it to be 7.0 either.

179

You haven’t even used it since it received APHE.

3 Likes
180

*Laughs in sturmtiger*

181

I use AA for AA and it’s just annoying to get shit uptiered for it’s AT abilities.

1 Like