Yeah. even 12.3 to be equal to other FnF helis, but yeah. Anything needing Hellfires above 11.0 is basically unplayable in the current compression. They are too slow. Vikhrs can travel 9-10km in half the time it takes a Hellfire to travel 7-8km
1 Like
Also AGM-114L was made specifically FOR Longbow Apache’s, so why doesnt the Longbow apaches get the AGM intended for them
Yeah, its kinda dumb, the moment that FnF AGMs were added to helis, we needed a placeholder solution for MMW. Like making them blocked by smoke and requiring LOBL. Which isnt really ahistorical. Unlike Brimstones, AGM-114L operate at a different frequency and can be defeated by the smoke with chaff. They also have a LOBL mode I believe.
This idea that MMW will be pure LOAL and can only be added as pure LOAL and be undefeatable and result in mass TKs, Is just nonsense made up by people who want nations to suffer.
1 Like
They could make the longbow apaches 12.3 (Japan’s 12.0 as its always been slightly behind the rest) but they can get MAX 8 AGM-114L’s if they are concerned about balance
Stop trying to make CAS OP again the moment it finally becomes balanced.
And no, LOAL is not left out for balance, it’s not finished yet nor are they prepared for the BRs it requires.
And doing so without line of sight means they won’t go to the target.
And both share the same IR seeker as AGM-65D as of current. IR seekers of course are entirely defeatable, a common knowledge fact; and IR seekers require manual decision making for where they will launch to in line-of-sight. IR AGMs cannot be launched outside LOS situations in War Thunder.
AIM-9B [a stand-in for Kh-38MT because it makes this point easier] locking a target again is not LOAL. LOAL is an active-scan system which only AIM-9X from the SPAA allegedly does.
Claiming any CAS is suffering currently is ragebait and I’m just going to ignore such claims.
AIM-120B is not nerfed at all, and AIM-120C is not nerfed either. Both have their correct ranges and correct single-plane agility.
@かがり
AH-64E would go to Japan [Indonesia], USA, UK/India, France [Benelux], China [China], and a potential Poland tech tree.
To re-iterate: Adding AH-64E is quite literally faster than waiting for the BRs needed for F&F radar weapons.
There are two things radar guided weapons that IR missiles can never do.
1- Lock on without looking at [identifying] the target.
[Higher teamkill potential than FAB-5000 which itself requires looking at the battlefield to know where you’re dropping.]
2- Undefeatable by current systems, and the only way to prove it’s defeatable is to prove all ten tech trees have countermeasure systems that can defeat it, AND only those tanks be able to face them.
This is why I say 13.3, because only Black Night and T-72B3A have the capability of defeating them currently due to Merkava Mk4M being bugged.
No other vehicle at 12.0 or even 11.7 can defeat radar missiles.
So your ok with just not giving a helicopter its missiles? That’s like refusing to let a tank have its guns
Except, it does and will…
AGM-65D is defeated by smoke. KH-38MT is not because it goes through smoke using IOG and will kill the target just the same.
KH-38MT is undefeatable without interception.
As do MMW missiles when used within LOBL modes, such as the Brimstones Mode 2 of operation.
Clearly has not tried to use an Apache in the past 3 years.
We have multiple bug reports for both misisles currently sat pending, Aim-120A/B have had ones since the test event prior to the addition.
Magic II is dual-plane currently, so if Aim-120B and C5 are being artifically limited to single plane, then that is a nerf.
Great, where is it?
Only been waiting 5 years.
Also, only adds FnF for the US with Spikes.
Need MMW for everyone else.
So add them with their IRL LOBL modes, though TKs is only an issue that people who dont want MMW added to the game make up. Not an issue IRL.
Again… So you mean like the KH-38MT?
Or Vikhrs?
Or Spikes?
or Pars?
Im not really sure why AGM-114L would change anything.
Multi spectral smoke exists, which helps against mmW guided missiles like Hellfire L
Pretty sure it’s also in service with most big armies
2 Likes
Yep. Doesnt work against Brimstones, but no one would care if that was ahistorically modeled for the sake of balance.
Not to mention the extreme speed the KH-38’s yield
Yep. I’ve been killed by a KH-38MT in the ADATS before the Su-34/Su-25SMT (was a little while ago) was even detected by my radar.
1 Like
Also dont KH-38’s have a effective range of 23km? which is much further than virtually every other AGM
combined with its rapid speed
You can GPS lock them at basically any range, which is about 60km max at the moment kinetmatically. They can be point locked at about 30km depending on weather and will lock onto a target if its close enough to the area selected.
was a clip from the dev server of someone killing people by having someone scouting and then taking off from the AF, firing them rapid fire at the target area and then RTBing instantly. All from behind a hill. It was insane.
Probably the reason for the fake GPS nerfs for every GPS guided weapon.
1 Like
AH-64D has been used without a radar attached hundreds of times.
2026 we can talk about AGM-114Ls again, and for now just appreciate that CAS-SPAA relationship is finally balanced for the first time since 2022.
@Morvran
IR AGMs require LOS to the ground or target to launch, the game will not launch the missile without said LOS lock.
Magic 2 is not dual-plane in War Thunder at this time, dual-plane does not exist in War Thunder.
If you have an issue with that fact, take it up with literally every expert of War Thunder.
Vikhrs and AGM-114s are defeated by obstructions [which includes smoke while mobile] and SPAA.
Spikes and Pars are defeated by obstructions [which includes smoke] and SPAA.
That was my statement, yes. My point was that proof needs to occur that all tech trees use it or at least manufacture it.
I saw that video it’s a bit crazy
The ones with the radar’s get it, the ones without dont. Simple
CAS-SPAA relationship
Just pray USSR and Germany isnt on the same team ig. given IRIS-T can quite literally spawn camp you on the airfield, and decide haha funny missile go brrr
Vikhr’s and AGM-114’s require you to stay stationary and maintain the lock
Spikes and pars fire and defend
It doesn’t matter since USA and Israel also have long-range SPAA systems.
The rest that got new SPAA have systems that are on-par to slightly better than Pantsir as well.
So while 3 SPAA keep high altitude clear, Pantsir SLS etc keep low altitude clear.
Unless they also have GNSS. Which the AASM and KH-38MT have.
Well, i’ve been told by many that Magic II is dual-plane or at least it has the turn performance it should have with it at the very least.
So are AGM-114L.
Unless you saying that shooting down an Apache is somehow different to shooting down an AH-60 or Tiger?
Which is really wierd.
Why? Its a video game. Besides im sure there are other examples of all nations getting soemthing even though IRL they didnt have it.
1 Like
Welp, time to remove a bunch of stuff cause they didnt use/manufacture it /shrug