Please stop using efficiency to measure the BR. At least consider their real performance?
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but we looked at the statistics without any degree of context or nuance!
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The Zeroes have to be among the worst treated aircraft that gets punished for having a positive KD ratio due to players not knowing to stop dog-fighting them, When a player use their brain against a zero and keep their speed up you are automatically F****D
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And that’s how the sad french AMX-30 S DCA is 8.7 while the Gepard is 8.3
Only the stats are considered. Good players are doomed to play overBRed vehicles. Their only crime is to perform with bad vehicles relatively to their BR :c
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Each of time when I realized that F8F is at 4.7 to against zero, which is already 5.7, i really suspect this time the BR change is from the US pilots
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I feel its the same about the Spitfire F Mk 24 and Spitfire F Mk 22 that went to 6.7, abit of a extreme for a prop fighter to fight jets, once again i feel like people over estimate these aircraft and just put them at a br at a point where unless you know exactly the limits of your enemies and yourself it remains at a negative K/D ratio
Whilst i share your general view on things your examples are imho misleading:
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The A7M2 at 5.3 allowed way too easy kills - an uptier to 5.7 is justified
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The A6M5s at 5.7 are just a result of gaijin’s FM - the well reported high speed compression is not implemented. They got clapped irl by BR 3.3 Hellcats exploiting this weakness - and in wt the same A6Ms are able to pull 12G maneuvers to dodge BnZ attacks without this weakness…
The same situation also suits those high-tier Japanese props, N1K2 and J6K, and also German and Italian, like Ta152c and Re2005, Gaijin never realized why they are efficient, no one wants to play it except those ACEs
This is misleading:
- The F 24 Spit was doing fine at 7.0 - they went down to 6.7 when the MiG-15 / F-86 reached 8.0
- The top speed difference of a 6.7 Mk 24 vs a 7.0 Me 262 is actually lower than of a 3.7 A6M2 vs a 3.7 P-47
- Knowing your shit like strengths and weaknesses of all involved aircraft was always the key to success.
A7M2 is the only one that makes any degree of sense, but its still not an equivalent to pretty much any 5.7 plane that’s any good. Yak-3U is just strictly a better plane for example and that plane didn’t go anywhere.
Please. A6Ms are useless in WT the moment the other person understands how energy works. They only do well because players hold S in every plane they play and the A6M is one of the planes that punish that.
No it wasn’t. It’s not an equivalent to any 7.0 jet.
The Me-262 can hold 860kph+ and never go below it. The Spitfire can’t break ~650-675kph in a straight line. The Me-262 is also one of the weakest 7.0s.
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When this is the average player deployment in the current game, I started understanding why only the turnfighters are being uptiered. Because the majority seem to just fly their energy fighters directly into the turnfighters strengths, not just the Zeros but the Zeros are the best turnfighters and so benefit the most from full teams of US and german energy fighters humping the ground instead of climbing.
I really dont think its fair to put so much balancing weight on players skill, Or rather lack of skill in these cases.
This isnt nearly enough of an advantage to make what is realistically a 4.7 airframe the same BR as, among other things, the blimmen Yak 3U!
Not to mention Spitfires are almost as good at the same thing, with the F Mk IX being both faster than the A6M5 ko in a climb and a dive, while still out turning everything except a Zero, and does all that at 4.3.
And for the record, I dont think the F Mk IX is at a particularly unfairly low BR.
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A7m is still too slow, and easy kills is due to there are lots of normal players like dogfight. If those US players are smart, even P47D28 is pretty easy to against it.
The FM doesn’t matter; without this FM buff I can’t imagine how bad the A6M is. It should be close to spitfire MKV with better mobility and worse speed, and also for more mobility, KI43 is the other case to prove these Zeros are not worth
- Your comment is as usual not dealing with what i wrote - the performance of other 5.7 was not my point. I stated that A7M2 at 5.3 allowed way too easy kills. Full stop.
- Same story here - i stated that gaijin’s FM is the result of the BR. It doesn’t matter if they are at 4.7 or 5.7 - if faster and better climbing enemies can be dodged the whole day as gaijin allows way too high g-limits and does not implement compression / rudder lock above 300 mph your comment is misleading at best. Moronic players trying to turnfight them has nothing to do with a fantasy flight model.
- Based on what? Your opinion? I played enough matches in 262s to see that they performed well.
- Last one: The few Spit F 24 kills i scored were in He-162s - and i watched a lot of my 162 & 262 replays. A spaded F 24 goes easy above 750 TAS at high alt and goes at least 870 in a shallow dive.
I kindly ask you to read what i wrote and stop quoting me. Thx in advance!
Edit: Ignore list…
You want me to “deal with” what you wrote, and what you wrote is “A7M2 get kill too easy”… That’s not an argument. The plane’s capabilities are just not as good as most 5.7s. It’s not going to be useless at 5.7 but its going to be on the much lower end of that bracket.
The FM isn’t overperforming for the BR. You are making the argument it’s better than irl, which is true, its still not anywhere near capable enough to actually be at the BRs gaijin is trying to shove them into. What is your point?
They can’t? This only works on bad pilots. As I and thousand of other skilled players have said, the A6M platform only works because the playerbase is terrible and doesn’t learn how to do anything other than hold S and turnfight and the A6M punishes this. Any even halfway decent skilled player can and will curb stomp these planes. Easily. It is not a matter of the plane actually being good.
Based on what? Real K Soze’s opinion? This goes both ways.
and I have played enough matches to know the plane is incredibly easy to defeat if you simply do not turn with it.
I do read. Don’t imply I don’t.
No thanks. Drop the attitude. Nobody is attacking you.
And lack of any common sense…
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But even if it can dodge, this doesnt mean it can DO anything about it. It was already slower than pretty much everything at 4.7, at 5.3 let alone 5.7 that problem is massively exaggerated. Yes the Zero can dodge an attack but it cant fight back, it cant keep up, it cant run away, it gets stuck and slowly gets bled of any energy it has until you cant dodge any more and die. Its a situation Ive been stuck in many times before and you are quite literally helpless and relying on a faster friendly to chase them away for you.
The only reason this isnt happening is because no one flies their energy fighters properly anymore.
And even then, the ability to dodge faster aircraft like that alone doesnt make it 5.7 material. Heck, even with an incorrect FM, realistically it should be resulting in raising the plane from 4.0-4.3 to 4.7-5.0, not 5.3-5.7.
Examples: 4.3 Spitfire F Mk IX, 4.3 (now going 4.7 at least) Yak3. 5.0 Yak3P. Heck, 4.0 Ki-43-III. The A6M5 Otsu/Ko are not 1.0+ BRs stronger in flight performance than any of these planes even with the buffed FM
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It looks like you did not get my point - i am not defending the 5.7 BR of a Zero.
I just stated that gaijin itself has his fair share of the way too high BR - simply because they implemented a fantasy flight model. With a proper flight model we might see a BR of 4.3 or 4.7 BR as realistic BR.
I got your point, but you missed this:
It shouldnt be any higher than 5.0 WITH its current flight model
I don’t think they even looked at the stats the A6M6c only had a 1.17 K/D average last month and for those that are saying it’s due to reward generation, the USA P-51D-10 has both a higher K/D and rewards.
I would suggest to Gaijin that if the reward are indeed the problem, rather than make these planes even more unbearable to play they reduce the reward multipliers and leave them at a functional BR, the A6M5c already has more ground kills than air due to it’s horridly low speed.
yeah, over preforming or inaccurate or what ever (and I am in favor of realistic fixes to FMs), the Zeros still lack the ability to force a fight with pretty much any aircraft that hasn’t already screwed up by the numbers. Hell most USA planes above 2.7 can out run the 5.7 zeros and only engage on their terms, it’s just boring doing that so they just head on or turn fight.
Zeros and turn fighters in general shouldn’t be punished due to other players impatience and bad decision making.
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The 2.7 F4U-1A is literally faster than every A6M that now go all the way up to 5.7, and is even about as fast overall if not a little faster iirc than the A7M1/M2, yet people will argue that the A6M and A7Ms are overpowered because they turn in a circle real good
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