What happened to the APHE rework it feels exactly the same?

Game Discussion General Discussion
,
41

Not true.

In real life APHE has a lower ballistic limit.

There’s a limit to AP penetration via increasing velocity, where an increase in velocity won’t increase the penetration anymore to the same degree as it does at lower velocity.

APHE shells reach that limit earlier, as they are more prone to shatter due to their cavity, which reduces the shells integrity.

But if that limit isn’t reached, both AP and APHE will behave the same way.

In WT APHE shells are just straight up worse than solid shot under and condition, when it comes to armor penetration.

But APHE also always fuze in the game, under any conditions. While in RL fuzes would often simply not function, when the shell was undergoing immense acceleration forces during penetrating of sloped armor. Where the shell is being pushed away from the impact, only to normalize again when it breaks through the armor. So that already balances out the reduced penetration.

There’s simply no need for APHE, which inherently will do more damage then solid shot, to have unrealistic performance as well.

2 Likes
42

Then why did you trash talk about me complaining about realShatter damage?

realShatter should create realistic fragment cones and damage, yet it’s far from realistic in terms of fragments distribution and damage.

realShatter or Ahead fragments will break off wings, tails, flaps and control surfaces of aircraft instead of causing damage to parts that are actually vulnerable to kinetic damage.

Just how APHE shouldn’t wipe out a tank crew while solid shot „only“ wounded everyone.

In WT a 14.5mm API round with 45mm pen can knock out a crewmen after going through 22mm of armor to hit the crewmen behind him to only turn him light yellow.

And injury from spalling fragments are merely a mild inconvenience for WT crews.

Like imagine getting hit by bird shot in arms or legs and then you’re supposed to drive a tank or load ammunition.

There are three factors to consider for penetrating a tank:

  1. Your tank has now an AP caliber sized hole in the armor and the armor is compromised
  2. Part of the crew are now dead, fatally wounded
    or injured
  3. Tank controls are out of order, leaving the tank defenseless

In WT nothing really matters as long as there is one guy left who can drive and one guy who can fire the gun, since being wounded won’t stop them from continue fighting or magically repairing broken component.

I don’t see why I would need to shoot a T-34 in the turret three times with solid shot, including the time it takes for one guy in the hull to take position in the turret, when one shot should have been enough.

So in general, it’s not about APHE needing to perform realistically, it’s tanks and crews which should be realistically affects by damage.

Of course it doesn’t need to be super hardcore, where every shot kills or damage can’t be repaired anymore.
But there must be some balance between gameplay and realism.

If kill times are brought down for ground vehicles, it wound make sense to give better respawn options, where you can spawn closer to the front line instead of spending time just driving back and hanging at least two spawns per vehicle.

2 Likes
43

@KillaKiwi
Sir, this is an APHE topic, not a realShatter topic.
realShatter is not overperforming, aircraft damage models underperform cause they’re from 2012, and irrelevant to this topic.

1 Like
44

APHE change was tested during one of the dev servers btw even though community voted for it not to be tested.

After the dev server was closed, the idea was thankfully scrapped

45

there is the char-25T too though. it also has a apcbc shell

46

A light tank that’s larger than an IS-3 with a mediocre 90mm? I’d say the only reason to touch the bat chat is that they changed the reload rate, but it’s honestly decent now.

1 Like
47

Personally I did prefer it at its original br but it does pretty good where it is now. Also pretty tough for a light tank

1 Like
48

This issue can be easily solved, making all bullets do the same damage sphere. APDS? Damage sphere, HEAT-FS? Damage sphere, Full AP? Damage sphere. If Gaijin is going to continue with completely unrealistic mechanics, then let’s do it for everyone, right?

2 Likes
49

Or better yet, set the damage by hit points like in WOT, which is just as unrealistic as the APHE damage, but at least it is fairer and easier to balance.

2 Likes
50

Is the aphe rework implemented? Weren’t they supposed to make APHE explode more realistically than in sphere shape?

1 Like
51

No.
People didn’t want to lose the biggest crutch in the game that they all been loving for years.
Imagine aiming, penetration should be enough.

6 Likes
52

Oh, so people doesn’t like to implement realistic feature into the game

Pretty sad, maybe in future the community will grow up enough for good changes

4 Likes
53

Haha, that’s too late, the community right now only thinks about what new premium tanks they can buy, leave everything as is because they’ve gotten used to garbage, and quit the game after losing a tank right after making a lemming train to point B.
Gaijin seems like a garbage company to me because when they should listen to the community, they don’t and when they shouldn’t listen to the community, they do.

3 Likes
54

Who are you to decide when they should or shouldn’t listen to the community?

55

Ah, I don’t decide anything, I give my opinion from my point of view on what gaijin does wrong, but it’s just my opinion.
If for example there is a bugged tank and it responds much more than it should, there would surely be people defending that the tank is fine as it is, for my part and defending realism, it benefits me or harms me.

1 Like
56

A bunch of players hugging arcade and anti-intellectualism. bruh.

The idea of super APHE is so incorrect such that voting is not needed to confirm this

3 Likes
57

However nerfing the one consistent shell doesn’t make the others any better to use.

You’ll still have solid shot doing terrible damage, and APHE will still be better.

58

It’s about making a 1 shot by APHE to 2 shot or at bad angles, and corresponds to a 2 shot of solid shot. And another thing is the cupola, where only all-angle-frag APHE can pen and rain fragment. The change eliminates the possibility and this is the most important and controversy thing about balance on this issue. I’m always for realism tho, balance should be established by BR.

2 Likes
59

True, but APHE getting nerfed would remove some of that sour taste solid shot users have.
It’d also help with some of the ludicrous cupola shots that nukes your entire turret crew.

1 Like
60

Not all balance can be estabilished by BR. There are a lot of examples of vehicles that simply cannot be balanced by BR (Maus, IS-4M, M4A3E2, KV-1E, etc.), because they will be either overpowered or absolutely useless depending on the BR, nothing in between.

This change would only worsen this situation. Some tanks due to their characteristics simply can’t be balanced without an exploitable frontal weakspot like cupola. Such weakspots are what gives a fighting chance to lower tier vehicles and at the same time allows the vehicle itself to be at the BR it is at without being extremely obnoxious to face.