You’re comparing people who have a business to run which means a ratio of effort to profit and people that are just here to play casually.
The first will always choose the stats since it’s the easiest, fastest and cheapest way to adjust some assets of the game while also having some kind of legitimacy.
The latter actually see the problems of that system because they see it everyday. A concrete example is the EBR family in the game. Because of very good players, the tanks have been nerfed to the ground with their BR setting off to space while they’re just pretty much average light tanks with nothing much to offer.
And there are multiple other examples in game.
I don’t really see the point of your argument here. If the market meant nothing to the company, then it wouldn’t be here in the first place.
You’re trying to convince people of something that they don’t have an impact on. Even if we all agreed with you, what’s the point ? If the market wasn’t profitable then it would have been closed years ago.
All things serve a purpose for a company.
My concern about this suggestion is that people won’t take interest in unusual/fair vehicles and will only do events to get the broken stuff. That then tells Gaijin “hey, if it isn’t OP, don’t bother!” and we’ll be seeing PT76-57’s at 6.7 again and again because if they don’t keep the power level cranked high, people will go for older vehicles they otherwise would have had to pay for.
Keep in mind that Gaijin doesn’t just get the $50 commission when they sell a $500 tank on the marketplace, they get all $500. Whoever got the 450 GJN for the sale doesn’t get any real money or even a physical product they can buy, just some 1’s and 0’s applied to their account when they buy stuff on the store or marketplace. So making the marketplace redundant with this option is not something they would want to implement unless they planned on doing it in a way where no one would use it to save money. If anything, they might consider doing it just once on an anniversary event, but never set it in stone going forward.
1 Like
This is a game, not real life casino stock market.
The original intent of the market is for people, who missed out on the events, buy past vehicles. What we have today, just like real life stock market, is a perverted version of its former self because of personal greed.
I myself started participating in this price gouging of course by hoarding event and skin coupons. I would be stupid if I wouldn’t. But I would also not be mad if Gaijin did something about it and gradually brought prices of all the items on the market to more reasonable levels like 60-100GJN range.
So yeah, I completely agree with OP even if it would crash my own stonks. Its for the benefit of the whole community.
I am sorry to say, but its not a 15 % out of 500GJN. Gaijin already has the FULL 500EUR.
Someone had to put 500EUR to buy the vehicle. You only recieved 425GJN to your marketplace account after sale. So if you changed your mind and wanted the vehicle back, you’d have to deposit another 75EUR of your money. So now Gaijin actually has 75EUR extra of your money. Gaijin is the one who owns the whole 500EUR and AFAIK there is no way to withdraw money from marketplace to your IRL bank account. This is why this idea will unfortunately never get implemented. Gaijin makes too much money from the overinflated coupon prices and there are whales willing to shell out even 2k for IS7 for example. Conspiracy theory says, Gaijin creates extra coupons outside what was created in the events and sends them on the market to get some extra cash.
Events are largely driven by FOMO. This suggestion kills FOMO. Tanks for 500$ feed FOMO.
…and? That’s GOOD. That’s the only possible way to balance it then, if it’s driven by amazing players. If you put it at the BR you want to put it at, then France would just have a permanently higher than 50% win rate at that BR range.
It is not fun to have a permanentyl higher or lower than 50% win rate before you even enter the battle, just because of the nation you choose.
Not fun for the French players, who didn’t get to earn their win and it feels hollow. Not fun for the other players who get a big penalty without even doing anything wrong. Not fun for anyone. Game loses players, Gaijin loses revenue, everyone has less fun, bad game.
I never said the market meant nothing at all, where’d you get that from? I just said it isn’t on its own AS profitable as my suggestion, for old event vehicles. Even with my suggestion, though, you’d still keep the market, and it would still add something, because some people will still want to not do any event grind/don’t have the time/etc, and would still want to buy vehicles. Even if they had the option to do a future event and swap it out, they might choose not to and want to buy instead.
As well, anyone who wanted to CATCH UP to collecting old vehicles would still have to use the market, since “foregoing the current vehicle and swapping it out” still only gets you +1 vehicle. So if you want the new one AND also an old one, you have to buy one or the other on the market still.
Basically, every vehicle would still have value on the market, it would just drift closer to what its value was immediately after its original event. Like $30-40 for high tier reward vehicles, etc.
I’m not even sure Gaijin would lose money on the market itself, even if you completely ignored the main money maker (the engagement/playtime boost during the event by more motivated people). If you have 200 of some rare vehicle now on the market instead of 10 of them, and they sell for $40 instead of $400, you actually make more money on commission… 40x200x0.15 > 400x2x0.15.
There’s a reason grocery stores don’t sell candy bars for $800 either, it’s not the most efficient anyway.
Events are largely driven by FOMO.
-
Major citation needed. I think people far more so just want cool fun tanks to play. I can tell in 2 minutes whether an event vehicle will be crap or not. Where is the “fear”? if it’s crap, I don’t have any fear, I know it’s crap from its stats and features. These aren’t black box mystery grab bags.
-
There is if anything MORE FOMO though in a different sense, you now have calendar time pressure to catch up to your goals, since you only get one vehicle per grind, and ALL events now can help you get there, so skipping NONE of them is a simple matter for you anymore. Even if this one has a crap prize, you want to do it anyway to catch up on your list of old stuff you want. If you slack off, you miss opportunities to catch up on those old ones on your list… it would still take YEARS if you slack off.
So we’ve actually switched form a situation where anytime there’s a bad prize I DON’T have fomo, to a situation where every single time, I always have a little bit of fomo about not rounding out my dream list sooner.
And 485 GJN then gets recycled to some other purchase(s) later on. By your logic, you’d be double (and triple and quadruple…) counting those GJN over and over for each subsequent purchase they get recycled into, even though they were only bought once.
That is just plain bad accounting. Double dipping = mathematical error, simple as that. They only gain the amount on one specific sale that was permanently sunk on that sale. Which is 15% of the list price.
If this is still confusing, think about a toy version of the market.
- There’s only one buyer, who buys 500 GJN initially
- One seller is selling a boarhound for 500 GJN, that guy buys it.
- The guy who sold the boarhound then buys a Object 279 for 485 GJN
- The guy who bought the Object then buys a BA-11 for 412 GJN
- The guy who bought the B!-11 then buys a KV 220 for 350 GJN
That one single 500 GJN bankroll at the beginning drove all 5 of those sales, nobody has bought any fresh GJN the whole time. So tell me, where did Gaijin make any more than $500? Even though the sum of all the list prices = 1747 GJN so far
Same, but why would they ? Also I don’t mind if some happy fews manage to sell their IS-7 a thousand bucks if they can. I know I’ll never have one but that’s also how life’s going.
That’s terrible ! It means that because of a few good players players, all the others get to suffer from being average.
Plus what’s you logic ? vehicles aren’t “run by amazing players” it’s amazing players that decide to play a specific tank for a specific period of time and when it gets nerfed they just change, leaving all people wanting to play that ttank suffering.
There’s no “putting it where I want” you just have to put it somewhere where its pros and cons match the ones of the opponents it faces …
Lol that’s quite apocalyptic. And I don’t see that happening with all the OP undertiered soviets btw.
Yes, I intended that. Because it WOULD be apocalyptic. To be clear, I’m not talking about ONE random vehicle, not literally just the EBR causing that. If it wasn’t obvious, I am referring to “This is what would happen if they consistently applied your method to the entire game, as their way of balancing every other vehicle too”
It would indeed legitimately go out of business, it would be a massively imbalanced, curbstomp blowout every game, unfun shitshow.
-
It’s not “a few” – if the stats were dragged way up, it means MOST or a large portion of the players are good players. Otherwise they wouldn’t be significantly affecting the stats by multiple BR steps, obviously.
-
Even if it was (somehow? un-mathematically?) just a tiny few number of them, the other players aren’t “suffering” because those superhuman guys are all on THEIR team, helping them have a reasonable, tense, fun, sporting, 50% chance to win. So they are doing just fine, actually.
-
If their vehicles did not have a handicap, those average french players would be carried along by those “very good players” (who are again, still on their team…) to ROFLstomp effortless victories all the time. Both the sealclubbers and the average guys not having much fun, since the win was easy effortless steamroll every time.
And clearly the roflstomped nations also have less fun.
Then use the BR system and make them not broken anymore. There is no such thing as an (inherently) “broken vehicle”, only a “broken vehicle at a specific BR”
will only do events to get the broken stuff. That then tells Gaijin “hey, if it isn’t OP, don’t bother!”
The point is people will do events for the old stuff even if the new events have complete unfun copy/paste junk in them. Because you can swap that out for a thing you do find fun. It actually accomplishes the opposite: they DON’T have pressure to make every event exciting in this setup, unlike they DO now.
Then use the BR system and make them not broken anymore. There is no such thing as an (inherently) “broken vehicle”, only a “broken vehicle at a specific BR”
My original comment clearly highlighted issues with Gaijin using the power curve to sell participation in events. It’s not that Gaijin can’t make it balanced, it’s that they won’t due to vehicles higher up on the power curve sell better.
The point is people will do events for the old stuff even if the new events have complete unfun copy/paste junk in them. Because you can swap that out for a thing you do find fun. It actually accomplishes the opposite: they DON’T have pressure to make every event exciting in this setup, unlike they DO now.
The point I wanted to make is that allowing players to obtain old event vehicles is so completely against Gaijin’s interests that the only way they would implement it is if
A: They choose to do it just once for a special event to pull in more players.
B: They feel the community pressure is too great and they will begrudgingly do it, but only in a way that will get as many people as possible to not use it.
Gaijin want the exclusivity of these vehicles because it gets players to burn SL/GE/GJN on loot boxes and FOMO events. Sure they could sell more vehicles by lowering the price, but that’s not the point. The idea of getting a FOMO tank from loot boxes is how they sell all those $3 camo boxes. Gaijin takes a huge hit to their income doing this suggestion.
1 Like
Troll?!?
I mean this is like such a stupid idea. You can’t really mean this, right?
Thank you for helping to confirm it’s a pretty good idea, since you can’t manage to think of any arguments against it. Appreciated!
1 Like
My original comment clearly highlighted issues with Gaijin using the power curve to sell participation in events. It’s not that Gaijin can’t make it balanced, it’s that they won’t due to vehicles higher up on the power curve sell better.
Okay, so what though? if they want to keep the things overpowered for that reason, then this idea works even BETTER at driving revenue… what’s the objection? if they balanced them correctly, it would make less of a difference, but still increase revenue a little bit (because even if stuff isn’t OP, choosing whichever normal-strength vehicle most interests you out of a choice of 17 of them will always necessarily be more motivating than only being given 1 normal-strength option)
The point I wanted to make is that allowing players to obtain old event vehicles is so completely against Gaijin’s interests
I don’t see where you explained any such thing at all. It’s very strongly in their interests. Motivation to do events goes WAY up, AND they can run events with less insane vehicles if they want (or not, up to them), and still have people motivated in them anyway. More flexible events as they wish, more participation regardless, clearly better for Gaijin.
Gaijin want the exclusivity of these vehicles because it gets players to burn SL/GE/GJN on loot boxes and FOMO events.
This idea does not in any way reduce FOMO though, so I don’t know why you’re still going on about FOMO. If you skip the limited time events, you still don’t get your dream tanks. You still miss out by not participating. So there’s still FOMO…
The idea of getting a FOMO tank from loot boxes
Loot boxes also do not increase FOMO. I’m kind of suspicious you might not know what FOMO means? You keep using it in weird ways that don’t make much sense. Loot boxes actually reduce FOMO, because buying 500 SL crates all at once in one SL crate event years form now, is just as good as buying 100 SL crates in 5 different events. So there’s almost no time pressure in SL crates, so no FOMO. You can just catch up later whenever you want. (not true of my suggestion, in mine you do permanently lose out by not participating, so there IS FOMO in mine, and there is NOT FOMO in SL crates.)
Consider the concrete example of a player who only wants 50% of the new vehicles on average, because he only considers about half of them “OP”:
-
In the current system, he’s only motivated to bother grinding half the events that Gaijin hosts. The ones that have what he thinks are OP vehicles. The other events, he doesn’t bother and doesn’t engage.
-
In my system, he is now going to be motivated to do ALL the events, for years: half of them where the new vehicle is “OP”, he will do them straight, and get the new vehicle, but now, all the new ones that have lackluster vehicles in his opinion, he will ALSO be motivated to grind those, in order to swap out one of the old vehicles from events he missed before he joined the game.
So this example player went from grinding 50% of the events, to grinding 100% of the events. Gaijin makes way more money out of him.
Eventually, he might catch up with his entire wishlist, but at worst, that just puts him back to grinding 50% of the events again. Gaijin still made more money out of him int he meantime.
I feel like I am not getting the point across that everything the player base wishes for is only granted through the Gaijin monkey’s paw and it is extremely unlikely that the players in question are correctly predicting what they will get if the snail put it in motion. Look at the BR changes to “help” WW2 vehicles separate from cold war ones. It took 1 update before they were moving atgm launchers and the bloody VIDAR of all things into br range with the Tiger 2 and Super Pershing. Now Gemany’s vaunted 5.7 lineup is getting shaken up too.
Anyway, I should review that my original position is that I am concerned (the exact word I used) that this type of event change will be used to hurt players more than accommodate them. My argument naturally has holes in it as it is all a “what if” and not an “it is”. I understand that any time old vics get made available again players lose their minds and grind for them (just look at the waste of time SL boxes people burn millions on during events), but I think, it is my opinion, that if they do this, we will be made to regret it somehow.
2 Likes