Unfai̇r si̇mulati̇on battle

Game Discussion Simulator Battle
55

Once again we are circling back to the fact that you have never played any of these planes. At least that is according to your profile.

One of the arguments that you have made is that the P-51 D-30 out-turns late mode Bf.109s. A duel would allow you to prove or disprove your point.

If you payed attention to the video you would see that it is a matter of experience and whether or not someone makes a mistake. The K-4 player is a good duelist but it was at a time when he was getting back into props. I was able to win in the D-30 because I was more familiar with how to dogfight in props. The D-30 has the ability to contest the dogfight against players of most skill levels but overall it is inferior in a dogfight.

The G-6 is the worst handling of all the late model

None of the videos I have shown are from amateur players. All of the players that I have shown have more time playing simulator battles than you do and they have better individual stats to back it up as well.

A 10-15 kph on top speed is not a huge advantage when you are inferior in every other category.

What bias? I have more games in Bf.109 variants than anything else that I play in sim. I’ve also played the Us Tech tree. I am not like you where I barely scrape by while going 1 : 1 in the only nation that I fly.

If you disagree with me than bring some proof. Show some performance chart. Show some dogfights. Show us something…anything at all.

The P-51 D-30 is no different than it’s WWII counterpart outside of some new avionics. It’s performance numbers sit directly between Bf.109 G-6 and Bf.109 K-4 and that is where it also sits in the battle rating system.

What you keep asking for is to have your pet nation be handheld because you cannot figure out how to properly utilize any of the advantages of your aircraft unless you have a massive and forgiving performance gap.

Of all the planes that you have cried about…the only one that is actually legitimate is the F4U-4B which is at 5.7 BR. Every other plane that you have cried about is inferior to it’s German counterparts in ways that are readily exploitable in-game.

56

Mach doch einfach deine gemixten Battles! Hält dich doch keiner von ab. Andere wollen es halt etwas authentischer. Lass doch einfach die Leute in Ruhe die was anderes wollen. Man lässt dich doch auch. Was du offensichtlich nicht in deine Birne bekommst.

57

Du hast ein Problem mit Leseverständnis. Das ist kein Problem, ich erkläre es einfach noch einmal genauer.

Also deine Behauptung war, dass der Modus mit gemischten Schlachten den Namen Simulator nicht verdient. Auf exakt diese Aussage habe ich geantwortet. Denn ein Simulator ist nicht(!!!) Durch Authentizität sondern Realismus definiert (und nein das ist nicht das gleiche).

Alles was ich gesagt habe, ist also, dass der Name simulator weiterhin korrekt wäre.

Das ist keine Aussage darüber ob ich gemischte Schlachten mag oder nicht.

Wenn du nicht fähig bist das zu differenzieren, dann liegt der Fehler bei dir.

58

> Die Simulation oder Simulierung bezeichnet die Nachbildung von realen Szenarien.
> Simulationen versuchen in der Regel, einen realen Sachverhalt möglichst originalgetreu in einem Computerspiel umzusetzen.

Autsch! Tja kleiner Tipp. solltest vlt. mal weniger BS in Foren schreiben.

59

I was probably playing this game while you were in your father’s orange.

You’re very crafty. You put a video of one or two amateurs and draw conclusions from the specific to the general. After all, I’m a bad pilot. I bought k4 and lost the fight you had with 109g6. So are we to conclude that k4 is bad?

IT IS EXTREMELY UNLOGICAL TO DRAW CONCLUSIONS FROM THE SPECIFIC TO THE GENERAL.

I haven’t seen you mention the Corsair series. Although, you can put a video or two of amateurs about it and draw a conclusion like “look, this plane is so bad”. Because you act with courage.

I think we will try harder as long as entertainer brats like you are not removed from this forum environment.

If it were up to you, you could even make a fool out of the fact that Yak3p has the same BR as 109g2 and conclude that “there is no difference between them”.

Even though I shamelessly state that I have played before, you continue to say “you have no experience”.

You’re deliberately making this issue personal. Those who have been involved in simulation know my gameplay more or less.

As a result, there is a general discomfort in the game. However, the conclusion we reached from your videos is that the p51 can tour sideways with the BF series very well. The G6 plane may have problems because it is slow or because you or your friend has a turning defect (such as not opening full flaps).

In other words, as everyone knows, each country has certain aircraft characteristics. Spitfire turns better, German planes are good at climbing, Japanese can maneuver better than the British, Russians turn fast and save their energy while turning, Americans have high speed.

Share as many specific results as you want here. When we look at it in general, the injustice is clearly evident.

I have to write it in capital letters for emphasis.

AXIS PLANES HAVE TO FIGHT WITH MODELS PRODUCED DURING THE KOREAN WAR, WHICH ARE MUCH BETTER THAN THEM IN ALMOST EVERY SENSE! JUST LIKE YAK3P HAD THE SAME BATTLE RATE WITH 109G2!

You can only deceive brats like yourself using such graphics. It is obvious that the situation is completely different when it comes to the field.

Now go and share your Corsair series videos from your video archive. Or call me in the game, approach me from behind and share the video you destroyed (finding me on the simulation map might be a different mystery, esp cheat?) Personalize the issue even more and continue to confirm the obvious injustice.

60

Quelle:wikipedia… sehr gut.

Wikipedia ist keine Quelle. Nimm lieber ein Wörterbuch.

“modellhafte, wirklichkeitsgetreue Nachbildung oder Nachahmung von komplexen Modellen, Prozessen oder Sachverhalten mit technischen Mitteln, meist mit Hilfe von Computerprogrammen”

Das ist die greifende Definition. Die Fahrzeuge werden korrekt dargestellt. Kontext ist nicht nötig. Nach deiner Logik wäre eine Simulation eines crashtests für ein auto welches noch nicht gebaut wurde keine Simulation, was ein lächerlicher gedanke ist.

Simulation für dinge die nie gebaut wurden gibt es ständig, man braucht keinen historischen Präzedenzfall… mach dich nicht lächerlich.

Oder sind die Simulationsfahrten der Formel 1 boliden vor dem ersten echten testlauf etwa keine simulationen, immerhin sind die autos doch noch nie gefahren?

Ist dcs eine Simulation? Man kann dort wie gesagt eine amerikanische p51 gegen nen deutschen ka50 fliegen. Was ist es? Gilt deine regel nur für war Thunder?

Für den undifferenzierten Mist hast du dich nicht entschuldigt, tztztz

61

das heißt wenn die Luftschlacht um England in einer Sim dargestellt wird. dann wird nicht nur die Bf 109 und Spitfire modelliert sondern auch der Kanal du Knalltüte.
glaubst du in einem echten Simulator für Piloten wird kein Flughafen, Funkverkehr usw. simuliert. glaubst du die fliegen auf dem Mond. ps. anscheinend kennst du die Funktionen im DCS Editor auch überhaupt nicht

62

in germany, we also have a saying. the wiser gives way.
you are welcome to take over the DerGrafvon Zahl. I’ll give it to you. have fun. bye

63

Digga ich kann in dcs in georgien ne p51 gegen nen ka50 stellen, nach deiner Definition ist das dann keine Simulation.

War Thunder simuluert flug und die Fahrzeuge, und somit ist der Name gerechtfertigt. Wie bereits gesagt ist der historische kontext nicht erforderlich.

Dein Argument setzt voraus, das WT eine explizite Simulation einer schlacht ist, was natürlich unsinn ist, denn dann müsste man auch den hergang 1 zu 1 nachstellen… das geht mit menschlichen spielern nicht da diese freien willen haben.

Du widersprichst dich selbst.

Und die ad hominems kannste dir sparen. Argumentuer lieber vernünftig. Dafür muss man aber erst wissen wie man differenziert.

64

tja Digga und zuletzt sei gesagt,- man kann in DCS den Server komplett als ww2 oder als cold war laufen lassen. weils ne Sim is :) informier dich halt mal besser bevor du in sozialen Netzwerken und Foren Leute mit deinem Unwissen und Troll Kommentaren terrorisierst :)

65

it’s called simulation. of course, we can’t drive a real plane, we experience the “one that looks like it”. there were historical wars in his time, it was very enjoyable. absurdly, the American 109 f4 was not coming out of the Dec. That’s what people might want. other games are not as playable as this game. of course, he wants people to be on this platform. and you’re trying to complicate the job. it’s not difficult, for example, an event that will be formed with the addition of aircraft that took part in the Battle of Britain. note the “simulation” on the name “imagination”.

you are deliberately diverting the subject. but this proves the correctness of our arguments. keep going

1 Like
66

If both of those players are amateurs…then what does that make you?

You keep trying to insist that we are all amateurs without any evidence. If it’s a simple issue of skill then someone who is implying that they are better than one of the top 25 active duelists in the game should be able to step up and put the issue to rest through a demonstration.

The results I have shown are easily repeatable. The Bf.109 G-6 and late model Bf.109s are more maneuverable than the P-51 D-30.

I haven’t mentioned the Corsair series because the match up largely plays out the same way until you get to the 5.7 F4U-4B.

Pointless insult #2.

Another basic factual error on your part.

The Yak-3P is 5.7 BR and the Bf.109 G-2 is 4.3 BR. They do not fight each other at all.

The P-51 D-30 and the F4U-4 are not on your stat card at all. If you had played them then people would be able to see that.

The fact that you were missing out so much basic information at the beginning of the thread lends to believe that you have never even touched them except
maybe by borrowing a friend’s account.

You are projecting. You call me an amateur because I disagree with you and bring facts to the conversation. You call me a brat because you assume you are older than I am.

I have been gracious enough to offer you multiple chances to prove my points wrong and you cannot.

Yes. The video shows that the turning characteristics of the Bf.109 and P-51 D-30 are relatively close with the Bf.109 having a large enough of an advantage to consistently win if flown correctly.

Ok? What is your point?

The charts that I have posted shows this general trend, but this is actually nothing except a gross simplification. For instance the Ki-84 is faster than most 5.0 planes, climbs better, and turns better.

The only difference between all of the P-51 airframes in-game is the manifold pressure that they use. The manifold pressure setting that the D-30 uses is the same one that was used during World War II.

By your logic the P-51 D-30 should be tiered above the P-51H because it was technically produced/retrofitted at a later date. Or that the S-199, a post war Bf.109 that is handicapped with a bomber engine should only fight post war aircraft.

Plane performance are fixed values. They do not change in games versus random players.

“Field” experience much more highly prizes situational awareness and ability to understand what needs to be done to put players in uncomfortable situations, as well as understanding the strengths and weaknesses of your airplane.

You can call me a brat all you want but the fact of the matter is that when it comes to fighting “in the field” I produce consistently better results than you do. Take any plane your stat card and compare your success rate to mine and you will see that I am more successful than you are.

So you are accusing me of cheating now? Is that it?

2 Likes
67

Yes, I knew he was manipulative, but I couldn’t guess that he had a comprehension disability.

My friend, I am talking about the issue from 10 years ago. I played this game on console 10 years ago and bf109g2 and yak3p had the same BR rate. Maybe you weren’t playing at that time, it might not be enough for you. The fact that you go and reply as if you found something shows how interested you are in the subject.

Anyway. It is important not to feed the YouTube clowns. I was going to do 1v1 and get information from there, but whether I am a good player or not does not eliminate the injustice. So, when a good person plays it, the plane will be good, and when a bad person plays it, the plane will be bad? Or will you satisfy your ego? You see in your dreams.

I’m not going to reply to you again because you’re making it personal and diverting from the topic. See what you’re up to. I guess other friends can also make an inference based on the comments.

Friends, it is very important for those who have an opinion on the subject to comment. Don’t give credit to those who try to make things personal like this friend.

You are still saying that the p51 d30 is similar to other planes. So why are the numbers of p51h, d30 and d5 different? Are you kidding or what?

68

Kann man muss man aber nicht. Wenn man es nicht tut ist es immernoch eine Simulation. Ich mein du kannst quch in WT eine eigene schlacht nach deinen Wünschen machen. Meine Aussage ist ja dass das für die Einteilung simulation ja/nein keine rolle spielt. Du kannst ja auch in i racing einen formel wagen über Indianapolis jagen. Gibt keine rennserie die das tut, bleibt aber eine Simulation.

Aber du bist ja auch das genie, das glaubt ein grindsystem und ein simulator schließen sich aus… von daher erwarte ich nicht viel Verständnis

Du bist ja bekannt dafür dem Spiel abzusprechen dass es ne Simulation ist, nur weil die ein feature nicht passt. Ohne Rücksicht darauf ob das sinn macht. Die Fahrzeuge und deren Bedienung werden simuliert es ist ein simulation. IL2 hat auch server mit historisch inkorrekten setups… bleibt ne simulation.

Du bist derjenige der nicht mal unterscheiden kann zwischen einer Klarstellung über eine Definition und den Wünschen des posters. Das ist eine sehr einfache unterscheidung die nicht all zu schwer seien sollte.

69

Bomberschützen werden also perfekt simuliert

70

So he’s an ‘amateur’ because he doesn’t use landing flap in a dogfight….
If I’ve understood you correctly - and that’s the second time you’ve said something like that.

@FeetPics you may rest your case. Case dismissed.

71

You are alluding to the state of the game 10 years ago. It has absolutely nothing to do with the state of the game today.

You are the one that claims that the people I practice against are amateurs. I think it’s pretty obvious that you are not capable of doing any better than they are. Actually my assumption based on just the way that you speak is that you would do far worse.

I have not made this personal at all. I have posted facts. I have posted examples. You have done nothing but make false claim and resort to name calling. You are the one that attacks people and calls them amateurs while proving nothing of yourself.

For instance, you claim to have been playing the game for 10 years. If that is the case how are you only at level 88? How is it that in 10 years of gameplay experience that you have not been able to improve your gameplay beyond going roughly 1 to 1 against other players?

Are you that hopelessly lost in your search for self improvement that you lack the sense of self awareness that maybe you are struggling with other players because you are not that good yourself?

Of course not. The only way that you lose is because the opponent has an unfair advantage. It can’t be anything other than that.

Please explain to me what the functional differences between the D-5, D-10, D-20, and D-30 is. I don’t think you actually know.

72

He doesn’t even realize that one of the guys I am testing against in the videos are actually incredibly experienced players and are very good at the game.

I think if he tried to 1v1 any of them he would probably lose so badly that he would accuse them of cheating.

73

Nein, keine Simulation simuluert alles perfekt. Das ist ein selten dämlicher gedanke. Das geht schon gar nicht weil unser Verständnis über die welt gar nicht dafür ausreicht. Wissenschaft ist ein induktiver Prozess.

Abgesehen davon, müssen bomber keine simulation sein damit WT eine ist. Wie bereits gesagt müssen systeme und prozesse emuliert werden, nirgends steht dass das für alle Systeme und Prozesse gilt, wäre auch lächerlich weil Dan gäbe es gar keine simulationen.

Du schweifst aber mittlerweile sehr ab. Deine Argument war, dass WT aufgrund der unhistirischen matchuos kein Simulator ist.
Anstatt Strohmänner zu bauen bleib bei exakt dieser aussage, da ich exakt diese Aussage kritisiert habe.

Und meine gegenbeispiele bleiben bestehen, DCS iRacing und co verlieren ja auch nicht ihren simulator status weil sie historisch nicht korrekt sind.

Hör auf mit fadenscheinigen Argumenten und wenn dich jemand auf ein spezifisches Argument direkt anspricht, bleib bei exakt diesem Argument und komm nicht mut was anderen um die ecke was nicht kritisiert wurde. Das ist unehrlich und feige.

74

It is a pity that the men I witnessed seeing the KOREAN VETERANS in the game and leaving the game are not here.

Or, because they are masochists, they enjoy falling prey to much more useful aircraft that entered service 3 or 4 years later than they did. interesting