Tornado GR.4: Tenacious Tonka

[Morvran]

Those looked insane, as did the glide bombs on the F-15E. Both weapon systems massively out perform Brimstone even with a basic FnF mechanic

[AlvisWisla]

GROM doesn’t add that, it’s not even the 4th glide bomb/missile to be added with that type of range.

@Morvran
GPS guided bombs go to a static location.

[Fluffy_Bucketles]

I’m of the mind, put Brimstone in properly, let the yanks and ruskis cry until they inevitably get something that can either defeat them or compete.

[MommyDommyEnjyr]

@Fluffy_Bucketles

If 38 exists, Brimstone should too in a less screwed up form.

Your problem here is assuming Kh38s should exist… I said day 1 those AGMs never should have been added, they are simply to good vs what we have available.

Brimstones and Kh38s should not be present in the game for balance reasons. I will always advocate for realism where possible but brimstone in full functionality would be completely uncounterable beyond a SAM hitting the missile directly.

Kh38s are still to a degree not visible post launch thanks to radar dead zones and smokeless trailer once the booster runs out. and have posed a threat from day 1 when Su25s just yeet them before every getting launched on by a SAM.

Neither should be in the game personally

[Morvran]

Problem is, they would.

[Fluffy_Bucketles]

We’ve already opened the box. Yanks and Ruskis won’t let us close it.

[Fluffy_Bucketles]

Yeah, unfortunately.

[MommyDommyEnjyr]

@Fluffy_Bucketles

We’ve already opened the box. Yanks and Ruskis won’t let us close it.

That door can be closed as proof by brimstone being added in a half baked mechanic… I see utterly no reason why they can subjectively butcher an AGM by not giving a feature (which i agree with not being given) but somehow are fine with kh38s being un touchable by some SAMs entirely

[Smin1080p_WT]

@Fluffy_Bucketles

Except it is. It directly demonstrates the double standard.

There is a massive difference between the two. The news post details this, but to break it down more, I’ll share Gunjobs breakdown again:

@Gunjob

KH-38

1. it needs line of sight to the target for each target
2. manually queued for each target
3. clear day as clouds block the seeker
4. hope no one deploys smoke during flight

Brimstone ARH

1. does not need line of sight
2. doesn’t need to manually queue
3. is all weather
4. doesn’t care about smoke

The two are not the same at all.

[MommyDommyEnjyr]

@Smin1080p_WT

There is a massive difference between the two.

why are you comparing them on a mechanic/feature level… compare them on a balance perspective, your entire claim is then thrown out the door

[Smin1080p_WT]

@Fluffy_Bucketles

I’m of the mind, put Brimstone in properly, let the yanks and ruskis cry until they inevitably get something that can either defeat them or compete.

This is part of the issue if your entire understanding is that just two nations will be impacted. Everyone within the battle, regardless of nation, including your own teammates, will be impacted with Brimstone in it’s other modes.

[AgentZombie_6021]

@Smin1080p_WT

KH-38

1. it needs line of sight to the target for each target
2. manually queued for each target
3. clear day as clouds block the seeker
4. hope no one deploys smoke during flight

1. This is true (so just model Brimstones like basic IR FNF weapons)
2. This is true (model it like basic IR FNF weapons)
3. This is a blatant lie, the missiles work like a charm in cloudy weather
4. This is also a blatant lie, because smoke doesn’t stop the KH38, it will still guide through it and has a blast radius so massive it’ll kill the tank in the smoke unless it fully relocates. (did I mention this missile moves ridiculously fast and there’s a TV guided version that gives no warning what so ever?)

[Smin1080p_WT]

@MommyDommyEnjyr

why are you comparing them on a mechanic/feature level… compare them on a balance perspective, your entire claim is then thrown out the door

The two are entirely interlinked. Brimstone is massively different and it’s fesures and the implications of those are directly related to balance.

[Smin1080p_WT]

@TheSoloWing_Pixy

So what do you think is a good comparison

There is no comparison to Brimstone in game with it’s F&F modes. That’s exactly the point and what is explained within the dev blog.

[Rebound_Pyro]

Make the brimstone laser fire and forget and were happy

[Smin1080p_WT]

For the reasons explained within the blog, it will not have F&F modes.

[Fluffy_Bucketles]

They effectively propose the same threat. Gunjob is a good fellow and all, but on this I disagree with their assessment. Brimstone can be toned down to bring it in line with the balance shown by other ordnance, and would be Britain’s only half effective strike option.

We could have F&F brimstone with a toned down seeker for now, and we would be okay with that. We could have smoke impact it too, even though it shouldn’t and the ordnace for other nations really doesn’t give a shit about smoke. We could even force it to be manually queued.

This is of course taking your claims about kh 38 (which are wrong) on face value. You’ve gimped things before, like Magic 2. Magic 2 is still gimped. MICA also.

[Anastasiatop7]

A rifle is much better than a pistol,and the 1000bls is significantly better than both,so the 1000bls is not recommended,but it means the gap between the rifle and pistol can be ignored?You never give a direct answer sir.

[AgentZombie_6021]

the dev blog explained why no mmW mode. But if you’re already going to be ahistorical, just make them IR guided at this point to retain its identity.

Or just dont add the plane at all-

[TheSoloWing_Pixy]

Then the development team can make appropriate trade-offs, such as using an IR-guided head to achieve similar capabilities to the KH38, rather than cutting this feature outright. We strongly request to discuss this with the development team directly instead of wasting time here. God knows whether the development team will see these comments or if they don’t care at all.