SEPv2 and SEP are literally the exact same thing as the 1992 baseline M1A2, except better thermals and, in SEPv2’s case, being heavier and slower.
Because Gaijin did not bother to model a single armor upgrade the tank went through on that 14 year timeframe.
I’m not even going to talk about the controversial hull- both SEP and SEPv2 should have better turret armor on the sides and front, officially confirmed and verified, but Gaijin refuses to model it still.
So… no, we don’t have any vehicle past 1992, actually.
In fact, if anything, they are all even worse than what the 1992 one should be, given the Mía modelled and underperforming fuel tank bulkheads and turret ring (leaving aside all of the composite armor matters).
AIM is also missing its historical KE-W A2 shell (slightly worse than M829A2), and SEPv3 is missing its historical M829A3 shell (slightly better than DM53) which at least would make it feel like an upgrade in one way compared to SEP, A2, HC, etc.
That is really the problem with top tier tanks, there comes a point where they are mostly fantasy, since their real armor, the real penetration of bullets, etc is unknown. We can only more or less know the armor of certain older Western tanks and partly that of all Soviet tanks, since they use the same chassis and armor as tanks from the 80s and that were used quite a bit, being captured and investigated decades ago. The only doubt would be the real protection of the Relikt armor, which in the game has been given a value to balance and cover the deficiencies of the top tier Soviet tanks.
The problem isn’t that we should have to guesstimate; the problem is that Gaijin actively refuses to guesstimate in some tanks…
In some tanks, they find it perfectly fine and reasonable to make well educated guesstimations;
But when it comes to the Abrams, they actively refuse to do anything because “we don’t know the exact values”, so they prefer to leave them all with 1992-level armor just not to make a reasonable guess.
It has always seemed curious to me that a 1987 Abrams had the same hull armor as a 2010 Abrams. Also curious, for example, is that the Challengers had so little hull armor, although in the latest versions, extra armor was added with Romor and later with composite armor to correct the lack of armor.
Then Soviets don’t have any tank modeled after 1989 since the T-90M’s composite is from 1989. - Your post’s rationale, not my argument.
AIM already has a historical round and doesn’t need to be made 12.0.
T-90M does not have the same armor as T-72B because Gaijin actually bothered to model the upgrades.
Relikt has more KE than K-5, and so does the new welded turret…
…unlike M1A2 SEPv2’s new generation Depleted Uranium armor, which has the same values as the previous older iteration, making it wrongfully have the same values ingame as the base M1A2.
Can you imagine if Relikt and K-5 had the same KE effectiveness as K-1? That’s what Gaijin has done to the late Abrams tanks.
No, AIM does not have a historical round. Each and every single source mentions KE-W A2, not a single one mentions KE-W.
T-90M has the same hull armor as T-72B, correction it’s 1983; both having a 60 5 3 18 3 5 60 10 50 armor sandwich.
T-90M’s turret is a guestimate just like M1A2. With the composite array of the T-72B and T-90M turrets being of similar composites in-game.
Somehow dodging the ERA to get a composite armor reading:
If AIM can fire KE-W A2, it can fire KE-W; if it can’t fire KE-W it can’t fire KE-W A2.
KE-W is a historical round, and claiming it’s not is claiming A2 is not.
SEPv2’s new gen DU armor is not the same as baseline A2’s in real life, but it has the same values ingame. I don’t understand what you’re trying to prove. It’s as if Relikt had the same KE as K-5.
T-90M’s turret is a guesstimate, while SEPv2 is NOT.
SEPv2 having the same armor as A2 would be the same as T-90M having the same armor as T-72B.
Yet T-90M has better armor than T-72B, but SEPv2 does not have better armor than baseline A2.
They can guesstimate T-90M’s armor, but suddenly there’s a problem guesstimating SEPv2’s, so they must give it the same values as a 13 year older tank.
KE-W never even set foot on Australia.
I don’t get it; M1A1 HC and M1A2 can have M829A2 at 11.7… but somehow M1A1 AIM getting a worse M829A2 at the same BR is a problem…?
There is zero indication of what the improvement over M1A2’s armor is.
No percentage, no hard number, no round comparisons, nothing.
With absolutely zero information, the assessment must be that keep armor the same until information is found.
The M1A1 AIM is not Australia, it’s not the Australian Armed Forces, and Australia is not General Dynamics.
Australia doesn’t dictate what Abrams can or can’t fire, General Dynamics does.
M1A1 HC and M1A2 should be 12.0, and your intent to destroy one of the last balanced 11.7s in the American tech tree… ending the 11.7 permanently in the future. Wild take.
There are values; +250% CE for SEP and SEPv2’s turret sides, for example. Yet here we are.
And regarding the rest (KE)? Well, that’s where GUESSTIMATIONS come in play. Those which are fine with most modern tanks ingame except for the Abrams, apparently. Suddenly, we need hard numbers, when no other tank does…
…what?
The ingame M1A1 AIM is the Australian variant, with Australian armor and Australian livery, under the Australian flag and with Australian voices. It is clear and obvious that it’s a depiction of the Australian tank- which, spoiler, uses KE-W A2. Not KE-W, not M829A2- KE-W A2.
I’ll take a historical 40mm KE difference over a marginal 0.3 BR difference that makes no actual difference because every single match is a 12.0 uptier anyway.
Idk bro , it is japan. It doesn’t matter unless that nation name started with U and end with an A or start with R and end with A. Minor nation are not counted
Well yeah but clearly not strong enough to please the mass. Especially US player themself. Out of all the top tier Premium ground right now US arguably have the best line up for any Br above rank 6. Also they are the only nation with a good amount of premium Aircraft top tier as well and they are all decent to good. That just premium side , not counting normal Tech Tree or event
I know there is no clear evidence that the M1 chassis had DU, but it’s the same as the supposed protection of the Relikt being twice that of the Kontakt-5. It could be, but it could also be a fantasy. Personally, I find it incredible that the Relikt offers twice as much protection as the Kontakt-5, especially regarding the KE.
Yes, the Romor is modeled as it is. The usual thing is that it should provide more protection against CE ammunition. It’s been reported and accepted. Now we just have to wait for the devs to get tired of leaving the report aside and implement it.
Interestingly, this happens with many Western armors. The Brenus armor in reality is something similar to Kontakt 5, but in the game it’s like Kontakt 1. Also, many added composite armors have the ability to stop 30mm APDS (around 80 to 90mm penetration), but they provide 30mm protection.
