that is fair
You know things are busted when they start stealing tracks from chaff & the aircraft you were just locked onto.
They should at minimum have their RCS reduced by ~75% across the board.
The problem is exacerbated by the fact that specific filters that would prevent this are selectively not modeled
Brings me to another unrelated thought. With how easy it is to turn radars on and off, I actually don’t see HARMS being effective as players would think.
Even in DCS, it’s very simple as a entire SAM site shutting down it’s radar for a set time and the HARM will simply just miss, or go stupid, along with temporarily relocating (if feasible) from the position it was fired upon.
I can only see this being effective if one intends to do a follow up attack, or again–multiple aircraft are up to make for supressive multi-attacks.
Earliest HARM had IOG to continue flying towards last known radar bearing, mid life update ones have GPS to fly towards last known position and the latest ones have a terminal MMW seeker to allow it to continue attacking a target that may no longer even be radiating entirely.
DCS isn’t exactly the most accurate sim outside of pilot system management. Their missile models are hyper simplified.
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I’m starting to realize what the problem is with people’s expectations for Spikes and other FnF ATGMs and I am kind of disappointed by said expectations …
The expectation for these weapons to be guaranteed first hit kills is honestly ridiculous and I am aware of the fact that the LMUR basically does guarantee kills.
These are FnF weapons, they are entirely non-interactive (unless a Pantsir is around to intercept them) and you can use them without any skill or meaningful risk involved. I am genuinely worried about the future of high tier gameplay because of weapons like this possibly getting buffed to be more deadly.
Gaijin honestly should get rid of the top attack mechanic on the LMUR instead of adding it to other such FnF ATGMs as well, but I probably am part of the minority with that opinion.
I don’t play actual top tier, so my opinion likely doesn’t matter nearly as much, but Spikes getting proper top attack would affect the range of BRs that I do play, as Spikes are available at 10.7.
Spoiler
The other bias claims do matter to me, but I’m gonna try not to go off-topic any further lol
So, about the general problems with the Pantsir and CAS at top tier, the Kh-38 and LMUR platforms and the Pantsir definitely should go in BR, even if other systems get buffed
CAS in general needs further decompression, but even after such decompression the Mi-28NM and the Kh-38 platforms should go up by another step after the decompression
The AH-64Es and the Z-10ME should go up by at least one step and the Mi-28NM should go up by two steps, the PARS/Spike platforms can remain where they are
(L)DIRCM needs to be nerfed and heli IR/Radar signatures need to get fixed
The Pantsir should go up by at least one step, but two steps would be more appropriate
It would be better if either the 95Ya6M or the TKBs were removed, but that’s never going to happen, so instead we definitely need fixes for the other nations SAMs and important features need to get modelled properly
Nations that can get them should get CIWS-like systems and better SHORAD (Skyranger 30/35, DRACO, LD-2000, M-SHORAD, possibly HVSD/ADAMS and MLBPWS, not sure if I am missing any other systems)
ARMs should not be added until the playfield is more balanced, as without improving blufor anti air capabilities those ARMs would just punish blufor anti air while not bothering the Pantsir at all
Patriots would be pointless, unless existing blufor SAMs get their fixes and missing features implemented and even then, the USSR tree would likely get their equivalent S-300 as a response
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If my spike its going to do less damage than a TOW-2A/Ataka/Kornet missile because of the unrealistic attack angle, then it shouldnt be at 11.3, it should be way lower.
Also a correct flight path not always its a insta kill (it may leave 2 crew members alive).
(T-80U not loosing any crew lol)
If my spike its going to do less damage than a TOW-2A/Ataka/Kornet missile because of the unrealistic attack angle, then it shouldnt be at 11.3, it should be way lower.
Also a correct flight path not always its a insta kill (it may leave 2 crew members alive).
(T-80U not loosing any crew lol)
But instead we have this shtty probabilities that makes my missile worse than a malyutka
I don’t disagree with the sentiment that these light tanks are a bit over-BR’d currently or that their autocannons are underperforming compared to USSR ones
If they get proper top attack capabilities they absolutely need to go up to top BRs though
SACLOS missiles SHOULD be more deadly and reliable, you have to guide them yourself, not just launch them and watch them do their job
I don’t think getting free kills with little to no risk involved is a good thing at all
As always mate, expect their stuff to be top notch.
I do however stand by teh point of not believing this was entirely necessary to be added to the game.
So out of 11 launches more than 60 percent of them were critical damage, 4 of which were fatal.
That’s not bad at all to be fair lol.
especially considering BMPT is a nightmare of a damage model.
No I am fully with that man, if we add top attack to spike, MMS and ofc buff jags it’ll completely tip the scales in the direction of leaving MBTs in the dust and making IFVs, and Lights OP as hell. Ofc helis even more so.
they don’t do much different damage to be fair, the spikes I’ve used as I’ve said have done me fairly well.
they’re alright at 11.3 area, they ain’t that great at the highest BRs
See we could ask for the Auto cannons to get buffed, and that would allow them to be good for their BRs rather than make decent weapons OP
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I’ve seen it, it’s also why I won’t bother with the Infantry when ti drops.
They are around 9.7 BR, while spikes are 11.3. Thats a 1.6 br difference, pretty big.
Also spikes are way slower than TOWs or Kornets, you have way plenty of time to pop smoke or even hide into cover, thats what actually people do right now when spike launched at them. (when played my first 3 matches, almost half of my spikes missed bc of cover)
If you can evel consider breech destroyed “critical”, if I were a fast IFV like vilkas or eitan that would be fine, I have time to flank and finnish with the bushmaster, but what about the namer?
Actually none of the spikes launched to a bmpt did any damage, they all went to the UFP ERA.
Again, SACLOS missiles require you to actually guide them yourself, Spikes (and other FnF ATGMs) just require you to point them at someone and they’ll do their job on their own.
If someone disappears behind cover or pops a smoke, you most likely aren’t going to hit them with SACLOS missiles either, that’s not a disadvantage that only FnF ATGMs have.
Kornet having speed of 550 m/s while spike 180 m/s… Kornet gonna reach the target before the smoke completely covers the target or has the time to hide.
Also what would be the point of having a FnF munition that would do no damage to little damage most of the times and sits at a higher br? and also cant use it at close combats.
Ok, the spike has the advantage of being automatic guidance, and so sits at a higher BR… and thats all, thats the only advantage, because the rest its just a list of disadvantages. So theres no reason to sit at a higher BR at all.
It quite literally is critical ? , it completely leaves the player with next to no offensive capabilities which means it’s effectively useelss for the situation it is in.
So that is nothing to do with spikes then is it, it’s to do with teh vehicle that the spikes are mounted on not being mobile enough.
If it were a freccia for example you’d have ended them easily.
I mean the BMPT is a menace mate that isn’t even up for question.
Don’t some systems already do this regardless?
First of all, the Kornet is 320m/s, you are thinking of the Ataka. Both of them still give you time to respond when used at medium to long range.
At a shorter range, what exactly is the difference between getting killed by a Kornet and getting killed by a regular cannon or getting crippled by an autocannon before you can react?
Them being FnF is more than enough reason to put them at a higher BR. Compared to the Kornet Ataka (mixing those up myself now lol) they sit at a lower BR.
Compared to TOWs, HOTs, HJ-9s, etc you get the advantage of not having to sit still with an exposed launcher (or even entire turret).
Are there fire-on-the-move ATGMs at lower BRs? Sure, have you used them on the move though? You would be better off with a regular gun usually, as you most likely are fully exposed to your enemy in scenarios where the fire-on-the-move capability would actually come in handy.
FnF ATGMs are low to no risk, they should not be high reward weapons and the LMUR should be a perfect indication of why these ATGMs should not get top attack capabilities and/or be reliable one-shot kills.
Do you honestly think the game would be better, if all FnF ATGMs behaved like the LMUR? Don’t you think low risk weapons should be low reward?
It’s the LMUR that should be nerfed, the other FnF ATGMs shouldn’t get buffed (except for maybe giving the ground vehicles with Spikes a bigger supply, if the vehicle has room for additional missiles).
I’m not an expert on the Spikes’ control systems, but if they do have a SACLOS mode, give them that as well, but don’t turn them into low risk - high reward weapons.
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Against targets that sit still or move in a straight line, yeah
Highly doubt they would remove the TKBs as that what makes this variant special and it’d be pretty much back to square 1 on why they said the Pantsir S-1 was underwhelming in the current meta in the first place. And pretty much any other upgraded Pantsir variant uses the 6M variant, so it’s somewhat problematic if they were to recieve any evolution upgrades to the game. and if they were to remove any of these, I’d personally say they need to downgrade CAS in turn as well, because it’ll just reverse the dynamic.
I mean, it’s not like the base missile doesn’t make a difference, the only 2 huge factors is the acceleration, and ability to not be roll gimped as easy because of the speed, which doesn’t effectively make it a better SAM than most SAMS.
players should realize that a 40km SACLOS shot is more easy to avoid than a 40km normal SAM sight shot, since one has to keep LOS and the other doesn’t, that’s the maindrawback with taking long ranged shots with this missle. These missles with their speed and range are better suited for intercepting hypersonic missles where they will always maintain a LOS.
IRIST has a range of up to 40kms as well.
Yes the missle is slower but you don’t have to maintain LOS.
Forced meta on close range maps = the better SHORAD being the best SPAA
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