The Pantsir SM-SV is Simply Too Strong, Russian Bias as Clear as Day

Incredible decisions from gaijin as always, because gaijin never makes mistakes, we all know that right, the glorious snail is never wrong. All hail the snail!
Anyway, as of the most recent major update, gaijin decided the BUK-M3 was underperforming (it was doing fine tbf, it wasn’t worse than the other SAMs by a considerable margin). Little history lesson for anyone that either doesn’t remember or wasn’t around:

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Back after update Apex Predators, gaijin decided the 2S6 was under preforming (it also wasn’t then, but funnily enough they nerfed it just so they could be right, I’m not kidding).
Gaijin’s solution to this non-issue? Adding the brand new Russian Pantsir-S1… and thus the problems began
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This thing was, and maybe still is for its BR, overpowered. It outranged every SPAA at the time by considerable margins, had the some of the most maneuverable missiles of the time if I’m not mistaken, uses a K-Band tracking radar which no fixed wing aircraft of the time could detect (meaning silent RWR launches and tracking), and had some potent guns for close range as well. This thing reigned as king with no true counterparts (still really aren’t any like it) from early 2023 all the way up until mid/late 2025, nearly 2 and a half years of uncontested Russian SPAA dominance.

Well anyway, flash forward to today with the brand new major update “Ninth Wave”, that released today as of writing this, and I’m feeling a little déjà vu. Today Russia receive a new top tier SPAA to replace the BUK-M3, everyone meet the new king of top tier SPAA, and it’s a… another Pantsir that’s absolutely busted, with the only singular downside being a lack of ARH missiles, which it doesn’t even need. This is the Pantsir SM-SV:

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Wake up babe, it’s 2023 and gaijin just added the Pantsir which is the new best SPAA cuz they overreacted to the current one not doing exceptionally well

To summarize, this thing gets new 95Ya6M 40km range missiles (range isn’t the issue) and up to 12 of them (24 with boxes) if you take the full loadout. It’s gets the classic K-Band tracking radar meaning silent launches unless you’re in one of the lucky aircraft with K-Band coverage (some top tier jets, not all). The most notable feature is the addition of these smaller missiles, called the TKB-1055, which this thing can carry up to BLOODY 48 OF THEM, things an iron dome, and then you gotta consider that with ammo boxes too. They’re incredible for munition interceptions, making this SPAA nearly unkillable, and very hard to overwhelm, it does have short range at least, according to the stat card
If you’re using any munitions that take time to deploy, such as IR guided missiles or bombs, you won’t have the time to deploy enough to overwhelm this vehicle.
Using GPS munitions? Oh no he moved because he’s one singular unit and he can do that… oh and they probably intercepted them all anyway
Oh you just spawned in? Guess what, on most maps you’re within his no escape range already just like most of the new top tier SAMs so start diving!

The hardest thing to deal with about this vehicle is how fast the new M missile accelerates. It’s capable of MACH JESUS, being nearly a hypersonic missile and surpassing speeds of some top tier APFSDS shells, * reincarnate as a SAM missile, is that you*? Long range standoff against SPAA is hardly a thing, as with most maps, you’re never even able to be outside the 40km range of this thing, forcing you to fight close in most of the time. The problem is that with that missile, this is where it shines and happens to be what makes it the best SPAA in the game. Oh and there’s no such thing as too close, since it gets guns too :). Oh, and it’s new M missile a 50G, compared to the originals 32Gs which was more manageable.

Simply put, unless they increase the map sizes and distance from spawns (but maybe give a closer option so the A-10 and friends aren’t rendered useless), this thing is a problem for the health of top tier as a whole. Unless you’re on the same team as Russia, you’re at a heavy disadvantage when it comes to CAs, where your team struggles to deal with one (let alone however many they spawn), and their CAS with the ever potent fictional Kh-38MT will reign hell upon you.

Im not usually a fan of suggestions like this but, perhaps the new 95Ya6M missile needs to be removed for the time being, refunding players who got the modification for it, and adding it someday later down the line when the game is ready for it. It’s far too potent, and ruins the balance of CAS/Air Defense between other nations. At the very least I don’t see how this isn’t easily placed as the first 13.0 SPAA. I can only imagine what the Russian win rates are going to look like now after this. I don’t even think there’s enough decompression possible to fix this.

Allow me to re-echo the exact sentiment form everyone the moment this vehicle was revealed: This vehicle wasn’t needed, its addition is unnecessary.

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Anyway skies are closed unless you’re playing with Russia on your team or are playing Russia, welcome back early 2023. Oh and if any are on your team, no point in spawning anti air cuz they’ll snag all the kills. Can’t wait to not play top tier ground for the next few months. What’s y’alls take on this, think it’s fair or hella busted?

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To be honest I’ve never truly believed in any form of Russian bias, with the exception of the original Pantsir-S1s addition. We’ve all joked about it here and there I’m sure. Heck, one of my top comments on the forums is making fun of how the Kh-38MT is an example of Russian bias.

I wholehearted believe however, the addition of this vehicle is blatantly done to benefit the Russian lineups with a bias behind its addition, either that or some form of incompetence from the devs.

Reminder that at the same time:

  • We have the new Mi-28 with LMURs that are the only fire and forget ATGM that has top down attacks properly modeled for some unknown reason.oh and LDIRCM ofc so if you can’t fight against that, perish.
  • The Pantsir-S1 before this, which was the best counter against the new LDIRCM helis.
  • We have the Kh-38MT, self explanatory, if you know the lore.
  • We have the BMPT, self explanatory again.
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Oh so nothing new

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Yea pretty much. I always check back in every once in awhile, but it’s never really playable in a lot of aspects… hasn’t really been for awhile

Max br ive touched in nearly a year in ground is 11.7, but even then i prefer to stay under 11.0

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We need some BR decompression to 13.3 already

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I’m going to start this with my biases…

CAS should be countered in general. I have no sympathy for CAS players, as I’ve lost many matches from teams spamming.
So any and all SPAA that deters CAS spawning is a bonus to me.

This new SPAA does not impact me, I don’t touch CAS at top end due to CAS over-saturation and CAS spawn cost inflation making it mathematically bad to spawn CAS.

With that said… let’s talk about SPAA.

It’s not even the strongest SPAA at 12.7 against FCAS, no where close.
It’s good at intercepting ordnance… and helicopters. But against planes? At least 10 better options.
And this isn’t a factor if people just… don’t spawn CAS to begin with.

Something I support more than anything; if you don’t like enemy having SPAA you think is unfair, just protest by not spawning CAS. Then the SPAA is a wasted spawn.

Also 2S6 was corrected alongside all other SACLOS missiles.
It had NOTHING to do with proving Gaijin right or wrong, it had everything to do with over-performing SACLOS guidance.

I’ve also seen zero evidence LMURs are modeled correctly to this day, so if you have evidence of LMURs performance in War Thunder is accurate to real life, I’d like to see that.

Unfortunately this is most likely continue as even shown in this thread, you have Gaijin sympathisers who defend everything to do with Gaijins decisions even though theyre blatantly wrong and show favouritism.

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Another incredible take from Alvis… thanks for the input as always. Gonna be honest I totally expected you to come say this as I was making this thread not even joking lmao

It is indeed, in the War Thunder meta that is. Most CAS engagements won’t occur outside this vehicle’s range, and it will outperform all other anti airs in ranges closer than at least 20-30km.

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Be ready to be thoroughly biasplained.

I agree with you, they don’t even try to hide it anymore. In fact, I bet two to one they’re storing the AESA F-15E/Is for next update… and guess what may come in summer as well? You’re correct, the Su-35! And Russia gets the shiny toy again to outmatch everyone along the SM2 just in case!

This has become something inexcusable. They just have to make up turret armor on the T-80s/90s to complete the bingo card.

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Sadly not real yet, nor has it progressed to a point where it can be added ingame. Well likely get a Hellenic subtree in the mean time

You mean 6km for its IR missiles.
And within 20km, most SPAA is better because of the limited maneuverability Pantsir missiles have.
There are dozens of YouTube videos of people showing how to defeat Pantsir missiles, in part because they’re the easiest missile to learn how to defeat at 12.0 and up.

There’s a reason the new Pantsir isn’t balanced on its ability to frag CAS, but instead balanced on its ability to destroy munitions and helicopters.

@PyroAddict
USSR already has Su-35 equivalent: Su-30SM and SM2. Su-35 is a sidegrade to those.

Truly the Greek vehicles will be a massive increase to the performance of the Israeli tree. Who could forget the Greek. Um… Uh… Hold on let me do some googling.

Ah it seems Greece has some M48’s and M47’s which is something the Israeli tree is severely lacking at the moment.
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Ngl, I think this game has doomed itself since the release of BMPT. I wouldn’t be surprised if number of players are plummeting right now.

I think top tier is now unplayable if you’re not Russia. Don’t even bother playing +9.7 GRB, you’re just gonna loose constantly and make your winrate go under.

Careful, you’re making sense. XD

I’m sure there also will be videos guide to defend 16 FnF BRIMSTONES if they add FnF BRIMSTONES to the game right? right?

Against non maneuvering munitions it’s more effective than that in willing to bet, stat card lists them at 7 but those love to lie so who knows. They’re also SACLOS guided.

The new M missile variant is the problem, as this missile is 50Gs (and nearly hypersonic btw). I’ve dealt with the regular Pantsir before, killed plenty, this things that but on crack, and some other stuff too…

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For the record :

What is that, 75% average russian winrate over hundreds of game ?

There is a serious bias issue

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Oh I’m sure TEC will love even more of them :)

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If we get chaff smoke grenades on all nations [which would be inauthentic, but realistic], probably.
The biggest issue with MMW when we get methods to defeat it becomes teamkilling rather than them being OP.

@BasherBenDawg8
A direct-hit missile doesn’t worry me, personally.
I just wish people would stop spamming CAS cause I’m so often on the team that spams CAS, and then it’s a loss cause they used up their spawn points on CAS instead of tanks.