The F4 S needs to run at least 11.7 in simulation

Game Discussion Simulator Battle
1

The F4 S needs to run at least 11.7 in simulation. at 12.0 - 13.0 it is too obsolete and is not able to compete against mig 29,F-14, F-15, F-16, and anything that has a radar capable of decent lock, given that with its poor missiles and the radar which is not exactly the best is not capable of doing much, furthermore the IR missiles only hit from the rear so it is penalized even more. I don’t understand why they haven’t lowered it yet, anyone would understand that in SIM there is no reason to be there

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2

i dont have f4s but i agree, played with f4j on realistic and got absolutely railed by the planes he mentioned, cant imagine on SIM.

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I don’t entirely agree. I do think there are many redfor aircraft that are woefully under BRed in comparison, but I don’t think the F4S is necessarily over BRed.

But one thing that is critically missing is a 11.3-12.3 bracket. With it’s absence 12.0 aircraft like the F4S or Tornado F3 have major uptiers most of the time with only 1 actually playable bracket which is the 12.0 bracket

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the f4s is unable to counter anything it has head-on in the br where it is placed in sim battle, it has no ir missiles to hit head-on and the 7F AIMs are practically useless at low altitudes. therefore any aircraft that has better radar-guided missiles or IR missiles with the ability to hit head-on is already at an advantage. just look at it, even the Mirage F1 is already able to hit more efficiently. the f4s on maps without mountains or cover is an easy target for anyone. as I said at 11.7 perhaps it would have a better chance, but even there there are clearly better planes that don’t know why they are lower in size.

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With the limited-to-early-era weapons WT assigned to this model and the pathetic underrated radar, the F-4S has a way overrated Battel rating. But the Russians do that to pump up their inferior Migs.

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I think the F-4S at 11.7 will cause more disruption to the other planes in that bracket. F104, Tornados, Mig23s, Currently, it’s a haven for 'relaxed gameplay without missile spamming.

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More compression is never the answer. The problem is the presence of Fox3 planes at 13.0 that are too strong for the F4S and other 12.0 planes. The only that’s good enough at this BR IMO is the Tornado F3 thanks to the excellent radar and RWR.

The Viggen Di, as bad as it is, still carries Fox 3. The Harrier FA2 and the AV8B+ are also way too dangerous, and the KWS should have never gone down from 13.3 (especially since the F3 late is still 13.3).

Move the BR up again, we need to completely separate planes with bad RWR and Fox 1 only from ANY Fox3 carrier. The technological gap is way too strong. F14 IRIAF can also get yeeted to 13.7 for all I care, the Fakours are ridiculous.

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That being said, it would be nice if Bluefor had a decent counter for the Mig-23MLD which is somehow at 11.3.

Playing something like the Tornado Gr1 at 11.7 is a bit of a slog because there is no air cover from your team, its easier to play it in the 11.0-12.0 brackets or even the 11.7-12.7 brackets than the 10.7-11.7 brackets most of the time I find. Whether the F-4S is too strong for 11.7 is possible, but I do think Bluefor could do with some buffs for their existing aircraft in the 11.3-11.7 bracket or aircraft like the Mig-23MLD to move up.

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there was - A-10C, but it got up

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This is about SB not RB. If you are playing the F-4S in a bracket where you are fighting a fox-3 slinger like the Viggen DI, then that is your choice but shouldnt be considered for the purposes of balance. RB you need to consider +/- 1 but in SB, you only really need to consider +/- 0.3 because there is no random uptiers

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I know this is a sim thread. The poster is complaining about the 12.0-13.0 matches in Sim, not the downtier matches.

In 11.0-12.0 matches, the F3 is by far the most dominant plane anyway. In 11.7 matches it’s the MLD, it’s just the nature of sim with fixed brackets.

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But its not really a fighter. Its the slowest aircraft in the bracket and really only has 1 trick, force the target into a slow turn fight and then Aim-9M. Anyone paying attention can simply avoid them.

What is needed is for things like the Phantom F4E or FGR2 to be a bit better. Even something relatively simple like wing fuel tanks would be a lovely QoL buff for the FGR2.

But im still mad that the Sea Harrier FRS1 is the same BR as the Mig-23MLD

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Fair enough, but the issue there is the lack of a 11.3-12.3 bracket for the minor uptier bracket

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a lot of ppl just was going into 1 circle, using MLD
thats was just funny

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Isn’t the IRIAF still 12.3 in Sim ? That would be absolutely horrible for the non US side. The only plane that can compete in that bracket is the Mirage 2000-S5 and it’s not always against the US.

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Yeah, thankfully the average soviet player doesnt actually realise how to best use their aircraft, which is why they have a lower than average BR, if they did, they would be truly dangerous

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It is, but likely because there is no 12.3 bracket at the moment, so its always at 12.7 anyway, but they’ve not really done a decent set of Sim BR changes since the decompress either, hopefully that will come in the next one, so I suspect it will change.

But the F-14As are tricky to balance, especially in Sim, their radars arent that great, they have weak RWRs, only rear-aspect IRs and limited CM counts. What makes them really deadly in RB is that everyoen takes off from the same location and flies in a very predictable manner, doesnt really happen as much in Sim. (not a BR i play a huge amount of, but most of the time I see the F-14s with SARH not the ARH missiles) Id personally be far more afraid of a well played Tornado F3, far better radar and far better RWR and you can easily outrun the M2Ks.

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also, radar is worser in compare with F-4EJ kai for example
(gaijin when aspect switch)

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M2000 are much faster on deck than the F3 in my experience. The F3 can barely stay supersonic while burning all of its fuel at a fast rate. M2000 are really fast mofos with excellent fuel efficiency.

I do use the F3 myself though, it’s definitely very dangerous in Sim. The entire avionic combined with the Supertemp is a deadly combo. In some sim 13.0 matches I use it over the Harrier FA2 whenever I’m tired of the FA2 lack of HUD (which I’m pretty sure is inaccurate) and it’s doing pretty well.

I don’t think the F14A deserves to go up, or at most by 0.3 BR. The Aim54A is not that dangerous, and very easy to outpull in sim. I’ve got moderate success using the B in Sim by using the 54C like Aim120-lite, but they’re also not that great and tends to only kill zombers.
The IRIAF tho… yeah no. Unless Gaijin decides to nerf Fakour to reasonable level, it’s simply way too fast and burn for too long. Even with all the shortcoming of the 14A, the missile is completely ridiculous and make the plane way too potent.

1 Like
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Yeah, thats fair, but it is still tricky when you consider everything else, but ahistorical nerfs should be avoided (especially as I think they are current underperforming)

The key I think is that you just burn past themi in the F3, the M2K has to turn and bleeds a lot of speed but you just keep going in the F3 and they’ll never catch you, or at least not before you’ve gotten far enough away to not be worth chasing. But if I get an M2K ping, I either joust it or just turn and burn, usually I survive.

Yeah, I was excited for the FA2, but like the FRS1 still has the Gr3 HUD, Yes, its 100% wrong and like you, I just cant bring myself to play it with that placeholder. I just dont like dealing with the Mig-29Gs in the F3, those are annoying to fight. (and now also ICEs)

1 Like