The Exaltation of the USSR and the Exaltation of Europe and the USA

[Mekvran]

@Redly34033

But with the arrival of the R-27er, nothing has changed, do you know why? Because everyone has a fire warning system, and sometimes you need to look at this circle with an airplane in the center, there is really Vital Information there.

Unfortunately, even with this information, notching and chaffing, i’ve had plenty of R-27ERs go straight for me. and some aircraft like the Tornado IDS dont even have Chaff, so it makes it even harder to evade in uptiers.

In any kind of BVR fight, R-27ER just wins without fail. and having spent the better part of the last year in the Tornado F3. an aircraft that can only BVR, being DOA vs Mig-29s just sucked.

@Redly34033

About the T-80BVM, just shoot it in the turret and break the breech of the gun, and it’s even easier to shoot a little lower and decapitate the driver’s mechanic and hit the ammunition, or shoot at the front track of the tank, and what we call the “great front roller” and the shell will happen will pierce right through the tank and again explode the ammunition.

The Challenger 2 lacks of the AP to do much of this , you have to aim for a tiny little crack in the armour, if you miss, you are likely to do nothing. Ive had more than a few direct hits on the ammo wrack that resulted in basically no damage even if a shell manages to pen.

@Redly34033

but an anti-aircraft gun for 70 revival points nullifies all its weapons

Not all nations have an SPAA for 70 points, Britain currently has an 8.3 SPAA and then an 11.7 ATGM launcher with the full SP cost associated with it.

@Redly34033

and the A-6 Tram has been reduced in the distance of its GBU release, do you know why?

Because the game had limitations that meant they were hugely inaccurate, those have now been fixed and the distance has now been set to an accurate IRL level.

@Stona_WT

Laser guided bombs — reducing the laser target acquisition distance

This update will reduce the acquisition distance of the laser target designator for the homing heads of LGBs.

Many of you have a fair question — why was this done? The answer is in fact that previously, due to CCRP not working correctly, we artificially increased the laser target acquisition range in order to ensure acceptable accuracy of this weapon type. The problem was that the accuracy of the displayed impact point within the CCRP was too low, since it did not take into account the aerodynamics of the aircraft, and, accordingly, could not provide a sufficiently accurate calculation of the impact point. Now, after corrections to the autopilot of LGBs and the correct operation of CCRP, this compensation is no longer required. When reset by CCRP, there will be virtually no difference in the use of such LGBs, except for slightly less energy consumption of the bomb due to a later transition from free fall to controlled flight.

Therefore, the capture ranges of LGBs will be set in accordance with documents and internal passports for each specific weapon.

The A-6 trams performance had absolutely nothing to do with it

@Redly34033

but also NATO tanks received anti-fragmentation lining

yes, but many have struggled for the past 2+ years without them. Like the Challenger 2 which is still missing half of its armour. It could have done with Spall liners literally 2+ years ago.

@Redly34033

why introduce Japanese equipment if about 11% of all players play it?

Or perhaps more people play those nations because they get regular content updates and the other nations have long been nelgected with large gaps and underperforming vehicles that make them simply unfun to play. Its a self fulffilling cycle. The more time they invest into teh US/USSR tech trees, the better they are and thus the more that will play them.

[Mekvran]

@AlvisWisla

Cause USSR made more vehicles than all other countries in the world.
USA in 2nd.
Everything else needs to wait for the correct BRs to exist [12.3 in the case of Sweden] or Sub-tree vehicle [South Africa for UK].

Except that does not explain why so many vehicles have not been added that could have been. Every nation has dozens of aircraft that have not been added. Just because US and USSR produce a lot, doesnt mean that other nations produced none. Take Britain for example. Straight of the top of my head,:

No late Jaguar
No late Buc
No Gnat
No Late Hunters
No Hawk

and thats not even touching on commonwealth aircraft like the several highly unique and inetesting options Canada could offer.

Just because 2 nations produced a lot of vehicles IRL doesnt mean that the other 8 should be abdandoned for 6 month intervals

[Redly#1]

About the R-27er, I can only suggest watching streamers who often play in the top tier and learning from them. The Mig 29, especially the SMT version, is immediately considered dead after losing its missiles, because maneuverability is terrible and speed is lost as quickly as money in a candy store. There is no need to give an example of a tank that has a strong turret, poor speed and good reloading, everyone recognizes Challengers as the worst tanks in the game (if this is your favorite tank, I deeply sympathize and do not want to offend you) and the only thing that saves it is that when it gets to the battle the big Some of the opponents have already died. You don’t have to aim at the driver’s mechanic, you can shoot at the treasury or just show behind the hill only your turret, which the T-80bvm won’t penetrate from 700 meters, and considering that in the game a person is better than an automatic loader, you will have many chances to shoot, you can even the bottom plate of the tank, I drove it (t80bvm), getting there is a one-shot. I don’t know why they treat the British this way (I’m talking about the prices of anti-aircraft guns), but I can suggest just driving along the side streets for two minutes, which is approximately how long the Ka-52 is still alive before meeting the missile. As far as I know, after the introduction of the T-90M with anti-fragmentation lining, a couple of days later anti-fragmentation lining was added to NATO tanks, what two years are you talking about? I don’t understand what half-armor you are talking about, but the turret of Challenger 2 is strong and very difficult to penetrate from a long distance, and all top-tier tanks shoot from a very long distance. For example, on the map of Greater Tunisia, which was previously only in simulator mode, shooting takes place up to 3 kilometers. The Gaijins talk a lot about their historicity, and it is not their fault that only a few countries have the resources to constantly develop their technology.

[Redly#1]

Do they have data about the late Jaguar and others? Can they be found in the public domain? If so, take advantage of democracy and arrange a vote for the introduction of this technology and add these documents.

[Redly#1]

I can’t believe we’re sitting here trying to prove whose tank is worse

[Mekvran]

@Redly34033

everyone recognizes Challengers as the worst tanks in the game (if this is your favorite tank, I deeply sympathize and do not want to offend you

Yep and the worse bit about, there are litterally dozens of bug reports in and have been for more than a year. No action has been taken. We;ve finally had some basic bugs like the turning fixed, but only after a premium version was added.

There isnt a single componet on the CR2s that hasnt been nerfed (heck. the 7.62mm MGs on the roof could be 12.7mm HMGs with 0 effort)

@Redly34033

won’t penetrate from 700 meters,

I’ve been penned plenty of times in the past in the turret, no idea if spall liners have helped much.

@Redly34033

what two years are you talking about?

The Challenger 2 has been in the game for more than 2 years and has underperformed the entire time. Spall liners could have been added at any point in those 2 years. Instead they were added after the T-90M was added.

@Redly34033

I don’t understand what half-armor you are talking about, but the turret of Challenger 2

Have a read through the bug reports yourself:

Challenger 2 MBT - Technical data and Discussion

Legwolf’s detailed breakdown of issues: https://forum.warthunder.com/t/challenger-2-needs-to-be-brought-to-developers-attention/39168 Please check it out! Please let me know if there is any missed items / bug reports for this post Missing Features Missing Regenerative steering Bug List Challenger 2 Bugs: Mobility related Challenger 2 (All): Turning issue when at low speed (Fixed) Challenger 2 (All): Low speed Turning gearing issues (Fixed) Challenger 2 (All): Gears causing jerking and…

even basic things like roof armour is missing from the Challenger 2s,

@Redly34033

difficult to penetrate from a long distance,

Unfortunately they are systematically deleting all long range maps. All of my recent matches have been in CQB focused matches with no option for any form of long ranged combat. I reckon within 6 months, There will be no long ranged maps, only CQB.

@Redly34033

and it is not their fault that only a few countries have the resources to constantly develop their technology.

Again, I’d check out this thread:

Britain Air Tree - What's left to be added for all BRs

THIS IS A WIP LIST. If I have missed anything, then please do let me know and I’ll add it to this list There has been a recent and ongoing notion that Britain can’t get any more aircraft, because it simply doesn’t have any left to be added. This is untrue for every single BR in game, even top tier. For this list, I’m not going to list every single variant for every single aircraft, especially for those we already have, unless there is a notable exception. This list is mostly looking at new Bri…

Literally dozens of aircraft that could be added. and many could have been added at any point. The point is, just because US and USSR developed a lot of aircraft that were in the current 11.3-12.7 range. Doesnt mean that the other TTs couldnt get stuff in the BR1-11.3 range. So many iconic aircraft just… never added.

@Redly34033

Do they have data about the late Jaguar and others?

Yes, should have all they need.

SEPECAT Jaguar GR3A: Sharpening the claws

poll Hello everyone! Today i’m bringing on the suggestion of the SEPECAT Jaguar GR.3A Ground Attack Aircraft, operated by the Royal Air Force. [raf-jaguar-gr1] Operated until 2007 by No. 6 Squadron out of Lossiemouth, the Jaguar GR.3A provides a wealth of improvements to an already capable ground attack jet in the form of avionics, armament and engines overhauls to bring Jaguar up to modern battlefield standards. In the early 2000’s, Pre-existing Jaguar GR1A/B’s in the Royal Air Forces’ fleet…

Buccaneer S.2B

Etc etc.
(List of Previously Suggested Ideas - British Aircraft (Please Check Before Creating A New Suggestion!) - Great Britain - War Thunder - Official Forum)

Can all be added with relative ease, especially as they are modified versions of aircraft we already have, so not even fresh models

@Redly34033

I can’t believe we’re sitting here trying to prove whose tank is worse

Its just this:

As a Brit, I complain about the current state of the Challenger 2, even with plenty of bug reports proving stuff is wrong and the response is always the same: “Aim better”

But the same apparently doesnt hold true for those in T-80s/T-90s when fighting Leopards or Challenger 2s.

We are hopefully getting a dev-post for the Challenger 2 in the future, but this:

Spoiler

could be the reality of the situation

[AlvisWisla]

We have late Buc, Hunter, & Jag. The l
Hawk, Gnat, & other trainers weren’t focused on before last year so give that time.
Of course trainers aren’t gonna be any higher than 10.3 most of the time.

Challenger 2 also may underperform mechanically, but performance in-matches has been about the same as other tanks I’ve played.

[Mekvran]

@AlvisWisla

We have late Buc, Hunter, & Jag

We have the Buccanneer S2B with Aim-9Ls and Martels?

We have the Jaguar GR3A with upgraded engine, HMD and Aim-9Ls/ASRAAM?

We have a Hunter with better loadouts like the Hunter T8? or one with CMs like the Hunter FGA74BS?

@AlvisWisla

Hawk, Gnat, & other trainers weren’t focused on before last year so give that time.

The point is, the response i’ve always seen for why Britain hasnt gotten anything is: “they dont have anything to add”. But that isnt true. Hawk, Gnat, etc, could all have been added. Its irrelevant that they are only now going back and adding some trainers (maybe) with a BR range from 9.3-11.0. They could have come a while ago without much issue

[AlvisWisla]

Let’s be honest here, you don’t want a 10.0+ Buccaneer.
And Jag GR3 is indeed the other late Jag, GR1A is also one of the late Jags.
Britain’s been focused for top air and ground.
Now that Britain’s top air is secured they can focus on more nuanced things.

[Mekvran]

@AlvisWisla

Let’s be honest here, you don’t want a 10.0+ Buccaneer.

I would, at about 10.3 that would still be fun, especially in gamemodes like SB. Would have comparible performance to something like the A-10s, A6E, Su-25, etc

@AlvisWisla

Jag GR3 is indeed the other late Jag, GR1A is also one of the late Jags.

Jaguar Gr1 is literally the first Jaguar in service with the RAF. Gr1A (and technically the GR1B) we have is just an upgraded version of it. But I would not describe either as “late” versions of the Jaguar.

@AlvisWisla

Now that Britain’s top air is secured they can focus on more nuanced things.

And that has taken well over a year. Whilst yes, options have been limited on what they could have added. Not denying that fact. (though Gripen C could have come in September instead of 3 months after 12.3s were added) But the Tornados could have at least been finished.

[AlvisWisla]

Yes, and both are late Jags. Britain didn’t adopt Jags until the later ones.

[Mekvran]

Either way could have and would have made an interseting addition at any point in the past 18 months. Though I have a suspicion it will be our next Premium. Something to match aircraft like the Su-39/Torando WTD61 for a premium CAS

[AUSChalkWarrior]

“L27A1 lolpen’s BVM’s turret”
just lmao

[AlvisWisla]

Last I checked 3BM60/L27A1/DM43 is superior to DM23.

[ARK_BOI]

Go look at ariete that what lol pen looklike

[AlvisWisla]

I am aware.

[AUSChalkWarrior]

just ignore that the majority of the turret is visibly impenetrable in your own image, far from “lolpen” maybe you should learn what words mean before you use them
the Fv4005 is a better example of something being “lolpen”

[AlvisWisla]

The majority of the turrret is penned.
Yellow = L26 or higher pen needed.

[SatsuJ]

@Redly34033

say that NATO tanks are glorified because residents of Western countries in Europe and the USA will donate more to the game

They’re better in game because they’re better in real life.

Those are just facts.

[AUSChalkWarrior]

I like how you crop out most of the turret so that your point isn’t such an L but even your own post demonstrates that it isn’t “lolpen” like you claim