It very clearly isn’t, and the main reason is once again, long reload for very little damage.
also wowww, look at this
an IS-4M with 140mms of armor at 60 degrees and it can’t pen it, meaning it’s 60 degree pen isn’t 278
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Leopard 1 being hit on the side corner by different 7.7 heavies:
Conquer
IS-4M
T-32
M-103(AP)
MAUS
AM-50 surbase
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Thanks for proving it’s a skill issue.
You’d have to intentionally miss the ammo at that point.
Those screenshots prove my other partially-irrelevant point: APHE makes bad-penning shots easier to deal with.
Of course a bad shot on APHE is more likely to bounce than a bad shot from APDS.
Also your IS-4 screenshot is wrong.
140/cos 62 = 298.2mm of thickness.
No it’s not, you’re just zoomed in far enough it’s effecting the angle of the IS-4Ms armor and it’s still “low change of pen” meaning don’t shoot there if you actually want to kill it.
It really isn’t because if a leopard 1 is starting at you, you have to shoot it first regardless of what angle they’re at plus dispersion and so while something else will one shot them regardless of where you hit if you pen them in one shot the, while conquer might not which is the real problem.
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People love to Argue “sKilL issUE” when someone complains about British vehicles, and there is truth to that because they’re often just simply worse than what other nations provide thus needing more skill to use them well.
But saying “Skill issue” every chance you get still doesn’t change the fact that the vehicle truly is worse.
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There’s a reason every very experienced player groans every time someone mentions the conquer, and it’s very obviously not because it’s good
@PT1GodHunter
Your posts are the primary ones arguing that it’s a skill issue, whether you intend for them to argue that or not.
On top of that, read the stats “ANGLE OF ATTACK: 60 degrees”
But yeah, keep claiming facts are wrong…
when you zoom out it gives a more realistic representation of what combat angles would look like, the angle was actually 62 degrees in the original post and you arguing that I’m wrong and have a skill issue actually only proves my point further as ONLY 2 DEGREES took a 120mm 6kg tungsten SABOT from barely getting through to having no chance of getting through AT ALL.
Which btw is one of the main problems people have been arguing this entire time.
At .3 higher of a BR you get a tank that can fire 6 shots that are more powerful in the same time it takes the conquer to fire 2 and that’s the issue I’m trying to fix here
Zooming out is irrelevant to this topic as the statement was “at 60 degrees” so you just angle to 60 degrees.
Also the fact IS-4M also can’t pen the front of Conq, but your posts didn’t mention that.
Just cause a vehicle isn’t your playstyle doesn’t mean it’s bad, if that was the case Begleitpanzer and 2S38 would be trash according to my stats cause they don’t fit my playstyle like medium/main BTs and heavy tanks do.
Ammo is a playstyle, I was bad with APDS until I trained APCR with M26 that helped me learn weakspots for one-shots irrelevant of secondary fragmentation and explosions.
it can and quite easily actually
I didn’t say that either, I love the conquer and it’s exactly my play style, there’s just tanks right next to it that are nothing but better.
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I love shooting the Conqueror at the front of an IS3, as you hit the tracks on the front, the bullet does not pierce it. It is clear that tungsten carbide bullets tend to fragment with spaced armor, but not to the point where having a track attached to the hull makes the bullet disappear.
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I hate to admit this (because i do not agree with how you guys are handling this) , but i do agree with their point here, i am a british main and as part of the life of a british main, you must learn where ammo is located in tanks. I love to play the conqueror, and regularly get one shots with it. this is ONLY because i aim right for the ammo though, gaijin has even added extra multipliers to apds to make it do more damage to ammo, knowing that it does less spall damage. This however has NOT stopped me from having the occasional “solid shot moment” where even the slug doesn’t do anything. My point here is, that sometimes it IS A SKILL ISSUE. Some people may be more accustomed to playing other nations with better ammo types, and can get frustrated when using something as inconsistent, or precision based as apds. However sometimes it can also just come down to rng and getting screwed by the game.
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You really just need to avoid the tracks. The way the this whole “shell shattering” mechanic works is not entirely accurate, as first gen apds does lose significant penetration when facing spaced armour, this is sometimes implemented incorrectly in the game though when you have tanks such as the ferdinand or elephant which both have essentially one 200mm thick upper plate that is in reality 2 100mm plates stacked veeerry close together. 1st gen apds will treat this the same way it treats the armour on the t26e5 which IS actually spaced, when in reality it should behave as a solid plate for apds because of how close it is together. Due to the game confusing stacked armour and spaced armour you end up with strange interactions like non-penning an IS-3
I hope this helped
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The problem is that when you’re shooting at around 500-1000 meters you can’t be sure to avoid the tracks on the front.
It’s probably what you say, gaijin has modeled the initial APDS wrong, and they recognize anything with two layers of armor as spaced armor, and besides, instead of making the spaced armor lower penetration significantly, what it does is make the bullet disappear.
Just get rid of shell shatter and it will be fine again.
I don’t think that the solution to something unreal is to make something else unreal. What should be done is that when the armor is made up of plates together it does not cause bullet breakage, but when they are separated it does cause the bullet to lose a lot of penetration, also depending on the thickness of the armor plates, so that, for example, fenders or boxes in the turret sides do not cause the bullet to break.
So are you going to make aphe shatter too? The reason the Brits stopped using aphe was because it had huge failure rates with may having 30-50% chance on failure on impact. Don’t see that in game but for some reason apds gets shatter and no other round. Get rid of it and bring it back into line with all other ammo types. I hate this one rule for one and not for the rest.
I have no problem with it, if it’s realistic then it should be done. Apart from the error rate of the APHE fuses, we would also have to add that the damage of the APHE in the game is unrealistic, since in reality they don’t create a sphere of death, the realistic thing is that the APHE would only do a little more damage than the Full AP.
In fact, this seems to me to be the biggest mistake in War Thunder, completely leaving aside realism, turning the game into something mediocre and close to the level of WOT, when it could have done something very different and with a unique style.